Why I'm not going to focus on buying Premium (Latitude and Business) fares on AC:
Jan 2, 2018, 4:21 pm
#1
Original Poster
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: MLL / AC Cafe
Programs: It's hard to get status when the website won't let me book flights.
Posts: 5,706
Why I'm not going to focus on buying Premium (Latitude and Business) fares on AC:
I have many examples from the last 6 months, but for the sake of keeping this all tight and simple, I'm going to focus on my 3 flights from December 28th 2017 and how I've decided to stop focusing on buying premium fares such as Latitude and Business on Air Canada in the future.
Nota bene: I used the word "focus" because I'll still buy these fares when I need to, but I won't be focusing on them being on AC flights and it will really only be when I need to instead of want to now.
Concept: If I'm going to hand over cash for premium fares I expect a premium service. If I'm not going to get a premium service I'm not going to pay for premium fares. As a reference my flights on AC this year were 50% Latitude (Y), 22% Business (multiple), 8% flex (T), 20% PY (O).
PS: Yes, I know I am complaining about premium things, because they are premium fares, if I wanted basic service I would pay basic fares.
YWG - YEG - YYC - YQF (not doing milage or segment or anything, both were irrelevant for 2018)
YWG lounge: no food, at all. Nothing to speak of for a meal, or a sandwich, no soup, no bread, no cookies, etc. Was there just after noon. Drink options were also very limited, with a number of the options repeating themselves on the shelf. While I'm not a big drinker there were only 4 types of alcohol available and no wine of any kind.
YWG - YEG flight: No meals boarded for J at all, nothing. Just offered nuts (can't - allergy). No apology and was only informed there were no meals 30 minutes into the flight. Hot towel made it's way around about 50 min after takeoff, first drink was offered at 1hr10min into the flight - only a 2nd drink offered after that. For a cabin of 9-10 pax and no meals to heat this seemed like a long time.
YEG lounge: Again, nothing! No soup, no cookies, no veggies, no anything! No one at the front desk either - stood there for about 5 minutes (I know I probably should have just walked in). The lemons and limes were literally brown - totally brown - and there was no ice to be found.
YEG - YYC flight: It was fine, minor annoyance was that 4 times before the flight (T-45 min, T-40 min, T-38 min, T-30 min) the gates was changed.
YYC Lounge: This might surprise you but again - NOTHING. Empty soup pots, no veggies, no cookies, no food of any kind.
So ya, I know I am complaining about premium things but that's what I've been paying for all year - and the example above is exactly how things have been for 6 months now. Not the first flight without a meal or empty lounge etc etc. If AC wants me to pay premium fares then they need to offer me something for that. This last half year to year they have been treating me like someone who buys basic fares so from now on that's what I'll be buying from them. Because if that's how they are going to treat me then that's what I'm going to pay for.
Added for more info after post: The washrooms in YEG MLL were a mess. There was no lock on the 1 toilet with a printed half hanging 8x5 x 11 sheet of paper saying it'll be a few days. Over the urinals there are huge chunks of wall paper half pulled off the wall etc. And this is supposed to be a premium lounge?
Nota bene: I used the word "focus" because I'll still buy these fares when I need to, but I won't be focusing on them being on AC flights and it will really only be when I need to instead of want to now.
Concept: If I'm going to hand over cash for premium fares I expect a premium service. If I'm not going to get a premium service I'm not going to pay for premium fares. As a reference my flights on AC this year were 50% Latitude (Y), 22% Business (multiple), 8% flex (T), 20% PY (O).
PS: Yes, I know I am complaining about premium things, because they are premium fares, if I wanted basic service I would pay basic fares.
YWG - YEG - YYC - YQF (not doing milage or segment or anything, both were irrelevant for 2018)
YWG lounge: no food, at all. Nothing to speak of for a meal, or a sandwich, no soup, no bread, no cookies, etc. Was there just after noon. Drink options were also very limited, with a number of the options repeating themselves on the shelf. While I'm not a big drinker there were only 4 types of alcohol available and no wine of any kind.
YWG - YEG flight: No meals boarded for J at all, nothing. Just offered nuts (can't - allergy). No apology and was only informed there were no meals 30 minutes into the flight. Hot towel made it's way around about 50 min after takeoff, first drink was offered at 1hr10min into the flight - only a 2nd drink offered after that. For a cabin of 9-10 pax and no meals to heat this seemed like a long time.
YEG lounge: Again, nothing! No soup, no cookies, no veggies, no anything! No one at the front desk either - stood there for about 5 minutes (I know I probably should have just walked in). The lemons and limes were literally brown - totally brown - and there was no ice to be found.
YEG - YYC flight: It was fine, minor annoyance was that 4 times before the flight (T-45 min, T-40 min, T-38 min, T-30 min) the gates was changed.
YYC Lounge: This might surprise you but again - NOTHING. Empty soup pots, no veggies, no cookies, no food of any kind.
So ya, I know I am complaining about premium things but that's what I've been paying for all year - and the example above is exactly how things have been for 6 months now. Not the first flight without a meal or empty lounge etc etc. If AC wants me to pay premium fares then they need to offer me something for that. This last half year to year they have been treating me like someone who buys basic fares so from now on that's what I'll be buying from them. Because if that's how they are going to treat me then that's what I'm going to pay for.
Added for more info after post: The washrooms in YEG MLL were a mess. There was no lock on the 1 toilet with a printed half hanging 8x5 x 11 sheet of paper saying it'll be a few days. Over the urinals there are huge chunks of wall paper half pulled off the wall etc. And this is supposed to be a premium lounge?
Last edited by Sean Peever; Jan 2, 2018 at 5:07 pm Reason: adding info, fixing some spelling.
Jan 2, 2018, 4:49 pm
#2
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: YVR
Programs: Bottom feeder Star Gold
Posts: 2,652
So ya, I know I am complaining about premium things but that's what I've been paying for all year - and the example above is exactly how things have been for 6 months now. Not the first flight without a meal or empty lounge etc etc. If AC wants me to pay premium fares then they need to offer me something for that. This last half year to year they have been treating me like someone who buys basic fares so from now on that's what I'll be buying from them. Because if that's how they are going to treat me then that's what I'm going to pay for.
I can't pretend to know your flying habits, but if you're based in a hub like YVR, and frequently fly to places like Montreal, Phoenix and India, you do have the luxury of reasonable alternatives.
Sometimes in life, it's acceptable to look out for number one instead of proffering undiminished loyalty towards a corporation. Air travel is one of those instances.
YEG - YYC flight: It was fine, minor annoyance was that 4 times before the flight (T-45 min, T-40 min, T-38 min, T-30 min) the gates was changed.
Nota bena:
Jan 2, 2018, 4:50 pm
#3
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: Halifax
Programs: AC SE100K, Marriott Lifetime Platinum Elite. NEXUS
Posts: 4,566
Latitude doesn't grant you lounge access or meals up front. While I'm not sure why anyone would ever buy it, it not getting you quality lounges or J meals doesn't seem a reason to drop it.
Jan 2, 2018, 5:00 pm
#4
Original Poster
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: MLL / AC Cafe
Programs: It's hard to get status when the website won't let me book flights.
Posts: 5,706
With respect, you almost sound apologetic, and in my opinion, you have no need to. You are the customer, and your point about value is spot-on. You've consistently been one of the few posters on this forum who explains, with eloquence, why you purchase premium fares for their additional benefits (ie: staff arriving at the destination ready to hit the ground running), rather than to gain perceived status. If you feel you don't receive adequate value, click on a competitor's website (which may actually allow you to book!!!)
I can't pretend to know your flying habits, but if you're based in a hub like YVR, and frequently fly to places like Montreal, Phoenix and India, you do have the luxury of reasonable alternatives.
Sometimes in life, it's acceptable to look out for number one instead of proffering undiminished loyalty towards a corporation. Air travel is one of those instances.
This might actually not be the fault of the airline, as gate assignments are controlled by the airport authority. One presumes there must have been some behind-the-scenes scheduling scrambling at play.
Nota bene, mio amico.
I can't pretend to know your flying habits, but if you're based in a hub like YVR, and frequently fly to places like Montreal, Phoenix and India, you do have the luxury of reasonable alternatives.
Sometimes in life, it's acceptable to look out for number one instead of proffering undiminished loyalty towards a corporation. Air travel is one of those instances.
This might actually not be the fault of the airline, as gate assignments are controlled by the airport authority. One presumes there must have been some behind-the-scenes scheduling scrambling at play.
Nota bene, mio amico.
Thanks for your kind words, glad to hear others don't think I'm way off the mark either.
And ya - Nota Bene, I made a few typo's as I re-read it. I mean, it is an online forum.....
Jan 2, 2018, 6:30 pm
#5
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: YYZ
Programs: AC*SE 2MM
Posts: 16,645
I'm also not sure that using the week between Christmas and New Years', which is notorious for the small number of business travellers to base your overall assessment of the airline.
Jan 2, 2018, 7:01 pm
#6
Join Date: May 2016
Posts: 2,494
Premium 4 star airline does this!
Oops, somebody forgot to order Business Class catering today for AC 784 LAX-YUL
Oops, somebody forgot to order Business Class catering today for AC 784 LAX-YUL
Jan 2, 2018, 7:10 pm
#7
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: YYC
Programs: AC SE 1MM, Marriott Ambassador
Posts: 3,396
I think this is fair. You expect value. I have long tried to make the point that AC J/PY isn't outright bad, but it is bad value. Value being relative and all, but still... You are just right: if you pay a premium you should rightfully expect premium service. If you don't get it, and AC doesn't want to make it right for you, then don't pay for it. 
And as the other poster said, you do have alternatives. Especially given your travel and location.
And as the other poster said, you do have alternatives. Especially given your travel and location.
Jan 2, 2018, 7:24 pm
#9
Moderator, Air Canada; FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: YYC
Programs: AC SE MM, FB Plat, WS Plat, BA Silver, DL GM, Marriott Plat, Hilton Gold, Accor Silver
Posts: 16,759
This reminds me of when I flew YYC-LHR on a Friday night a few months ago. Not only was the Friday night prime rib no longer a feature in the MLL, but there was nothing for food, at dinner time, but broken tortilla chips and guacamole. Every single chip in the bowl was broken - and yes, I used the tongs to push them around and check every one.
I was then stuck eating the crappy in-flight catering.
Not exactly reflecting a premium product in any way.
I was then stuck eating the crappy in-flight catering.
Not exactly reflecting a premium product in any way.
Jan 2, 2018, 7:27 pm
#10
Original Poster
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: MLL / AC Cafe
Programs: It's hard to get status when the website won't let me book flights.
Posts: 5,706
Jan 2, 2018, 8:07 pm
#11
Join Date: May 2013
Location: west coast best coast
Programs: TINDER GOLD, STARBUCKS GOLD, COSTCO EXECUTIVE!!
Posts: 3,989
If you guys spent a fraction of what you spent on flights on just decent meals in airports (the restaurants have been improving everywhere across the board), you'd be eating like kings.
While I understand food and drink is just a fraction of the "business class experience", when the business class lounges suck, the service is inconsistent, and the food nonexistent.. what are you paying for, if you're not in a bed on a transcon flight?
Air Canada, of course, would love for you to just continue paying the same price like normal and continually cutting back on all aspects of the experience. They might even be happy if people started visiting the Plaza Premium Lounges instead. But why people keep giving them money for a continually worsening product is beyond me.
While I understand food and drink is just a fraction of the "business class experience", when the business class lounges suck, the service is inconsistent, and the food nonexistent.. what are you paying for, if you're not in a bed on a transcon flight?
Air Canada, of course, would love for you to just continue paying the same price like normal and continually cutting back on all aspects of the experience. They might even be happy if people started visiting the Plaza Premium Lounges instead. But why people keep giving them money for a continually worsening product is beyond me.
Jan 2, 2018, 8:12 pm
#12
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: YYZ
Programs: Only J via Peasant Points, 777HDPeasant or The Unexpected Virtue of Ignorance and Narcissism.
Posts: 5,951
This reminds me of when I flew YYC-LHR on a Friday night a few months ago. Not only was the Friday night prime rib no longer a feature in the MLL, but there was nothing for food, at dinner time, but broken tortilla chips and guacamole. Every single chip in the bowl was broken - and yes, I used the tongs to push them around and check every one.
I was then stuck eating the crappy in-flight catering.
Not exactly reflecting a premium product in any way.
I was then stuck eating the crappy in-flight catering.
Not exactly reflecting a premium product in any way.
Jan 2, 2018, 8:19 pm
#13
Moderator, Air Canada; FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: YYC
Programs: AC SE MM, FB Plat, WS Plat, BA Silver, DL GM, Marriott Plat, Hilton Gold, Accor Silver
Posts: 16,759
If you guys spent a fraction of what you spent on flights on just decent meals in airports (the restaurants have been improving everywhere across the board), you'd be eating like kings.
While I understand food and drink is just a fraction of the "business class experience", when the business class lounges suck, the service is inconsistent, and the food nonexistent.. what are you paying for, if you're not in a bed on a transcon flight?
Air Canada, of course, would love for you to just continue paying the same price like normal and continually cutting back on all aspects of the experience. They might even be happy if people started visiting the Plaza Premium Lounges instead. But why people keep giving them money for a continually worsening product is beyond me.
While I understand food and drink is just a fraction of the "business class experience", when the business class lounges suck, the service is inconsistent, and the food nonexistent.. what are you paying for, if you're not in a bed on a transcon flight?
Air Canada, of course, would love for you to just continue paying the same price like normal and continually cutting back on all aspects of the experience. They might even be happy if people started visiting the Plaza Premium Lounges instead. But why people keep giving them money for a continually worsening product is beyond me.
"Will become"? Have you even visited that dump of a lounge?
Jan 2, 2018, 8:34 pm
#14
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: YOW
Programs: AC SEMM; AA,DL, Hyatt and Starwood. Ex-status:SQ PPS,CSA,Hilton,AA,UA
Posts: 743
To each his own, and full respect to Sean and others to say "I'm not getting what I want".
Perhaps I'm easy to please, but I continue to fly AC paid P/C/J happily most of the time on longhaul intercontinental and also "medium haul" (transcontinental domestic J service).
For me on long-haul it's first and foremost about sleep, and as long as I get pods, which I can sleep in no problem, than I'm happy. A vaguely tolerable meal and a glass of wine to help sleep are also a plus. During waking hours, space to open up laptop and be able to type without feeling squashed and by seatmate reading every word. Finally, a lounge with wifi, somewhere to sit in relative quiet, and some sort of nibbles keeps me happy. Anything else is a mild bonus, but far down in the decision criteria vs the biggies above, and schedule.
It's probably people like me that make AC do what it does, vs say a Singapore Airlines. Don't get me wrong, I like eating in SQ J/F and the SilverKris lounge, just I probably wouldn't pay more than +$15 for it.
Perhaps I'm easy to please, but I continue to fly AC paid P/C/J happily most of the time on longhaul intercontinental and also "medium haul" (transcontinental domestic J service).
For me on long-haul it's first and foremost about sleep, and as long as I get pods, which I can sleep in no problem, than I'm happy. A vaguely tolerable meal and a glass of wine to help sleep are also a plus. During waking hours, space to open up laptop and be able to type without feeling squashed and by seatmate reading every word. Finally, a lounge with wifi, somewhere to sit in relative quiet, and some sort of nibbles keeps me happy. Anything else is a mild bonus, but far down in the decision criteria vs the biggies above, and schedule.
It's probably people like me that make AC do what it does, vs say a Singapore Airlines. Don't get me wrong, I like eating in SQ J/F and the SilverKris lounge, just I probably wouldn't pay more than +$15 for it.
