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Deflategate; new executive pods deflating in-flight

Old Nov 20, 2017, 2:16 pm
FlyerTalk Forums Expert How-Tos and Guides
Last edit by: Argonaut1000
Click here to go to a picture of the White Compensation Form and its stub






View Deflated Seat History Here (Database for submitted occurrences)
Enter New Deflated Seat Occurrence Here (Submit one if you have experienced deflated seat and it will show up in the database above)
----
From post #49 in this thread, here's one potential way to (re)inflate an AC seat:
  • Go the home screen "Your Seat". (find this on the seat side panel; not the main video screen)
    • Hold the top left hand corner "Air Canada" (with AC logo) for 3 seconds. Updated (Apr 9 18): may need to hold for as long as 45 seconds for key pad to appear
      • Dial pad shows up - hit 3-2-1.
        • Press "Reset Lumbar Support"
Note that this method has not met 100% success so YMMV.
A better method is for a crew member to use the reset switch under the seat, on the aisle side.

Compensation offers (green/white sheet completed)
40K AE- Apr 18 (50% back of the J class one way redemption)
2018 Jun - $500 coupon
2018 Sep $1,000 eCoupon or 40K AP (P fare TPAC)
2018 Sep $500 eCoupon (P fare TPAC) (no change on protest- update - 6 months later the $150 was increased to $500 - admitted they had made an error)

Compensation offers (no green/white sheet completed)
100K - May 5 (C$150 eCoupon; was moved to a functioning seat after meal service)
2017 Sept - 8,000 AE miles - reported via complaint web page after realizing it was a faulty seat, not standard discomfort; Asked for return of eUps but they declined.
2017 Nov & 2018 Feb - $500 coupons both times (second time on protest that $500 had been offered the previous time)
2018 Sep. $250 coupon (on a paid J TATL).
2018 Nov - $500 eCoupon (J TATL)

Standard eCoupon compensation offers (no haggling; following a recurring pattern)
~10+ hours: $1000
Long TPAC (TPE-YVR)

~6 to ~10 hours: $500
Short TPAC (NRT-YVR)
TATL
South America: YYZ-GRU

less than ~6 hours: 300
TCON


Have a Service Director (SD) That Is Giving You the Case of the Shrugs? Like the real life version of this ASCII emoji -> Ż\_(ツ)_/Ż ?

No success with the SD and/or crew rectifying your deflated seat and you can't be/aren't accommodated to another J seat? If you asked for a compensation form and the SD says they have no idea what you are talking about, you can use the below picture of the stub portion to help freshen their memory (better than nothing)...

Please note that for the longest time, the "Green Compensation Form" version was used, and there have been recent reports of the "White Compensation Form" replacing the Green version. Reports here have indicated that the two forms are virtually identical except for the colour.
There is now an even newer White Form which explicitly lists "deflated seat" and "deflated seat and fixed", among many other items.

Here is a snapshot of the NEWEST full form (as of August 2019), courtesy of lallied

https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/31421855-post2093.html
Originally Posted by lallied
Clearly jinxed myself. New form in case hasnt been posted before.

Oops, see it has been. I just didn’t look far enough down ☹️


This is only the stub portion, courtesy of lallied





Originally Posted by lallied



There’s a main section which the SD fills in and detachable section you get to keep. Each has a reference number. It looks like the green one to me except it’s white.




Example

Mattress pads purchased and listed in this thread




Print Wikipost

Deflategate; new executive pods deflating in-flight

Old Feb 15, 2019, 12:11 pm
  #1021  
 
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: YVR
Programs: AC SE100K, Bonvoy Platinum Elite, IHG Gold, Hertz 5*
Posts: 2,132
Hmmm, sorry @24left

I probably did read that post and got the idea planted in my subconscious.
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Old Feb 15, 2019, 12:25 pm
  #1022  
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: YVR - MILLS Waypoint (It's the third house on the left)
Programs: AC*SE100K, wood level status in various other programs
Posts: 6,171
Originally Posted by 24left
@WaytoomuchEurope

The real issue is Air Canada and how they are handling this.

While we are all amused that we can buy brightly-colored inflatables to improve our comfort against the increasing odds of "park bench stay-flats", there are many things AC could do and should have done, not the least of which are things some of us have posted already:

1. FIX. THE. SEAT.

2. Send personal communications from an executive to those who are either SE, MM, and/or who have clearly spent a fortune flying in these things. AC knows exactly which flights we have been on and of course knows our deflate histories, or they should. It should absolutely go to this group. It does not have to be a public statement. No one here that I know of, is going to call the CBC / Radio Canada or Global.

3. FIX. THE. SEAT.

4. AC needs to recognize that some have already shifted spend away from AC. It may be pennies right now, but it may have an effect at some point assuming others who are not on FT start to realize that despite their cheap $USD tickets, they are sitting in the same deflated seats as those of us who been at this rodeo for a while.



......feel better now .

Awaiting more reports from the field from those who are "Flying with Inflatables" (need to trademark that, lol)
.
+1,000,000
Bohemian1 is online now  
Old Feb 15, 2019, 12:27 pm
  #1023  
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Original Poster
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: SFO
Programs: AC SE MM, SQ Silver, Bonvoy Tit LTG, Hyatt Glob, HH Diamond
Posts: 44,186
Originally Posted by WaytoomuchEurope
As I'm doing some simple TCON bookings I am thinking to myself...are there some FTers who are now actively trying to avoid widebodies? I ask because when I'm booking I put effort into finding widebody R space because I haven't been burned by stayflats like some of you. Are you at the point where you'd rather book TCON in a semi-comfy A321 seat instead of taking the risk with the pods?
Personally, I'm more comfortable sitting on a pillow/blanket on top of a deflated seat than I am in PY or narrow-body J.

Not to mention the much better recline capabilities. I don't lie flat on most TCON flights, but I certainly put the seat in "relax" mode or whatever they call it.

Then there's the food/drink/service difference on widebodies.
canadiancow is online now  
Old Feb 15, 2019, 12:27 pm
  #1024  
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: YHZ/YQM
Programs: Aeroplan
Posts: 1,618
Originally Posted by 24left
Awaiting more reports from the field from those who are "Flying with Inflatables" (need to trademark that, lol)
"Flying with inflatables" sounds like the adults only version of canadiancow's Ace.

Dealing with AC-induced stress
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smallmj is offline  
Old Feb 15, 2019, 12:36 pm
  #1025  
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: YVR
Programs: Bottom feeder Star Gold
Posts: 2,652
Originally Posted by 24left
2. Send personal communications from an executive to those who are either SE, MM, and/or who have clearly spent a fortune flying in these things. AC knows exactly which flights we have been on and of course knows our deflate histories, or they should. It should absolutely go to this group.
I would think if the airline sends any personal communications to flyers affected by the deflated seats, it wouldn't be limited to the SE/MM crowd. You folks are 'easy money'; your investments & loyalty are in the bank and it's increasingly unlikely you're going to meaningfully alter your spending habits with Air Canada.

The real potential for lost revenue is with all the new premium flyers who reside in the US, Asia or Europe who may have won the park bench lottery on their introductory AC J flight. The adage of 'first impressions matter' rings true, especially if those impressions are from the metal edges of a deflated seat on a first-time flyer's backside. If indeed, AC has a list of all those who have reported a deflated seat, they should include each and every person, whether they've flown once or a thousand trips. I wouldn't be surprised to see more urgency placed towards those AC newbies who are in greater danger of taking their future travel bucks to established competitors.
CZAMFlyer is offline  
Old Feb 15, 2019, 12:36 pm
  #1026  
 
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: YVR
Programs: AC SE100K, Bonvoy Platinum Elite, IHG Gold, Hertz 5*
Posts: 2,132
Originally Posted by canadiancow
Personally, I'm more comfortable sitting on a pillow/blanket on top of a deflated seat than I am in PY or narrow-body J.

Not to mention the much better recline capabilities. I don't lie flat on most TCON flights, but I certainly put the seat in "relax" mode or whatever they call it.

Then there's the food/drink/service difference on widebodies.
I'm with you. As I said, I always try to get a widebody. The service difference is the other major factor for me after the seat.
WaytoomuchEurope is offline  
Old Feb 15, 2019, 12:55 pm
  #1027  
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: YVR - MILLS Waypoint (It's the third house on the left)
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Posts: 6,171
While I don't necessarily agree with the rest of your logic, your first sentence rings very true.

Originally Posted by CZAMFlyer
I would think if the airline sends any personal communications to flyers affected by the deflated seats, it wouldn't be limited to the SE/MM crowd.
It's not hard (or at least shouldn't be hard) for AC to go through a list of their J pax with Aeroplan numbers over the past year or so and reach out to them with a nice email describing the issue and what they are doing to resolve it (see @24left post above). The fact that we own this problem instead of AC is simply maddening.

Originally Posted by CZAMFlyer
You folks are 'easy money'; your investments & loyalty are in the bank and it's increasingly unlikely you're going to meaningfully alter your spending habits with Air Canada.
I respectfully disagree.

Case in point, I have a last minute trip next week to GIG. I went out of my way to juggle itineraries to avoid or minimize AC 777/787 metal. I was partially successful and will be flying UA on the outbound.

Sadly, the only return that really worked from a schedule/cost/punishment perspective was on AC. So I will take along my new inflatable friend just in case.

All joking aside, that's a $12K return fare. Of which AC is now only going to get 50% instead of 100%. In my mind, they are lucky to get even that much out of me / my employer.

So for me, your statement needs a little correcting:

Originally Posted by CZAMFlyer
You folks are used to be 'easy money'; your investments & loyalty are were in the bank and it's increasingly unlikely likely you're going to meaningfully alter your spending habits with Air Canada.
And I'm sure I'm not the only one.
24left likes this.

Last edited by Bohemian1; Feb 15, 2019 at 1:03 pm Reason: Spelling eror
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Old Feb 15, 2019, 12:55 pm
  #1028  
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: YOW
Programs: AC-SE100K, AC-3MM, Marriott- LT Titanium, SPG RIP
Posts: 2,954
Originally Posted by 24left
4. AC needs to recognize that some have already shifted spend away from AC. It may be pennies right now, but it may have an effect at some point assuming others who are not on FT start to realize that despite their cheap $USD tickets, they are sitting in the same deflated seats as those of us who been at this rodeo for a while.
I believe that if AC was actually worried about this, they would have fixed the seats already.
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Old Feb 15, 2019, 1:01 pm
  #1029  
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Originally Posted by Bohemian1
.....The fact that we own this problem instead of AC is simply maddening......
Absolutely.


Originally Posted by Plumber
I believe that if AC was actually worried about this, they would have fixed the seats already.
You're right.
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Old Feb 15, 2019, 1:02 pm
  #1030  
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
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Originally Posted by Bohemian1
And I'm sure I'm not the only one.
I actually had you in mind as I typed my post above. You have stated on a few occasions that you have taken your premium travel elsewhere when able, and I respect and applaud that choice. Apologies for the universality of my statement; I recognize that several people do seek alternatives or have taken their business elsewhere entirely.

Agree you are not the only one, but I do believe you're in the minority amongst the more captive AC SE set. Hope you manage to spend some time in a Polaris lounge; my limited experiences in SFO were excellent.
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Old Feb 15, 2019, 1:13 pm
  #1031  
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
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Posts: 5,690
Originally Posted by WaytoomuchEurope
are there some FTers who are now actively trying to avoid widebodies?
Present.

They obviously can't be avoided on all routes as has already been mentioned, but I'm focused on getting onto as many narrow-body Airbus segments as possible whenever practical.
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Old Feb 15, 2019, 1:15 pm
  #1032  
 
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Posts: 6,171
@CZAMFlyer - Thanks for that. And yeah, I could well be in the minority.

If I put my cynical hat on, I could say that a lot of air travellers are just cattle and will follow routine and do as they are told.

But, to quote the late, great Peter Finch (as Howard Beale in the film adaptation of Network):

I want you to get up right now. Sit up. Go to your windows. Open them and stick your head out and yell - 'I'm as mad as hell and I'm not gonna take this anymore!' Things have got to change. But first, you've gotta get mad!.
In a nice way, of course.
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Old Feb 15, 2019, 1:18 pm
  #1033  
 
Join Date: Jun 2018
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Posts: 2,132
Originally Posted by Plumber
I believe that if AC was actually worried about this, they would have fixed the seats already.
I still think it's not that simple. I honestly don't think AC is ignoring the problem; they simply cannot be THAT obtuse. What I think is happening is a bitter argument with the seat manufacturer and trying to come to agreements of who is going to pay what for the fix.

AC would never willingly hold the bag for this and nor would any other company in this situation. The seat is a component they didn't manufacture on a plane they didn't manufacture. They are the end user and one assumes they are firmly in the camp of trying to get the seat manufacturer and in all likelihood Boeing to solve this problem for them, and more importantly, to pay the bill.

The problem, as pointed out multiple times throughout this thread, is the poor communication, and now increasingly the unwillingness to properly compensate. I'm taking a wild guess here but I suspect they've reached some dollar limit on liability that the seat manufacturer agreed to pay and all future compensation is coming directly out of ACs pocket. If that's actually the case, someone at AC should be fired because that's just terrible negotiating with the manufacturer.
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Old Feb 15, 2019, 1:23 pm
  #1034  
 
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Originally Posted by WaytoomuchEurope
I still think it's not that simple. I honestly don't think AC is ignoring the problem; they simply cannot be THAT obtuse. What I think is happening is a bitter argument with the seat manufacturer and trying to come to agreements of who is going to pay what for the fix.
I understand the complexities involved, and agree that they are not ignoring it.

But I think if it has actually been doing harm to their business (ie at an extreme all J wide bodied cabins are now flying empty), I am quite sure it would have been rectified by now!
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Old Feb 15, 2019, 1:43 pm
  #1035  
 
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Originally Posted by Plumber
But I think if it has actually been doing harm to their business (ie at an extreme all J wide bodied cabins are now flying empty), I am quite sure it would have been rectified by now!
It may be a similar situation to the original issues with the Thales AVOD system that we all love(d) to hate, in which the manufacturer can't or won't resolve the glitches in a timely manner. One would hope that the takeaways from that experience would have prompted AC to include contingency negotiations when placing the seat orders.
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