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-   -   New eUpgrade Requirements! Co-pay for lower flex fares (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/air-canada-aeroplan/1789272-new-eupgrade-requirements-co-pay-lower-flex-fares.html)

philelite Sep 6, 16 1:39 pm

New eUpgrade Requirements! Co-pay for lower flex fares
 
New eUpgrade requirments!

Wow, can now upgrade from Tango and Award Tickets! Thoughts? I like it.

See preview of YVR-YYZ below:

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/membe...68-capture.jpg

CanRulez Sep 6, 16 1:43 pm


Originally Posted by philelite (Post 27174176)
New eUpgrade requirements!

Wow, can now upgrade from Tango and Award Tickets! Thoughts? I like it.

Hopefully they have this on Trans-border and International flights too.

Jumper Jack Sep 6, 16 1:47 pm

Laughing so hard right now.. AS predicted by me a few months back(Though I was more thinking they would allow Tango to PE as oppose to Tango to J)

Well.. it has happened.

International require a $600 co-pay to europe FOR Tango/Reward tix

Best Part : Tango E-upgrade to Asia for $850

I am going to very.. very happy next summer when I get J for <1200 to PVG

http://i.imgur.com/pxHEJqE.png
http://i.imgur.com/IJC4f4U.png

vernonc Sep 6, 16 1:57 pm


Originally Posted by philelite (Post 27174176)
New eUpgrade requirments!

Wow, can now upgrade from Tango and Award Tickets! Thoughts? I like it.

See preview of YVR-YYZ below:

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/membe...68-capture.jpg

Is there a link announcing this promo ? Or is this the new normal ?

Jumper Jack Sep 6, 16 1:57 pm


Originally Posted by CanRulez (Post 27174197)
Hopefully they have this on Trans-border and International flights too.

Well. they do :p

Sucks for SEs though.. Tango/Award Co-Pay appears to be the same regardless of level.

I am pretty happy though... actually.. I am very.. very happy. :D

Maybe AC will finally decrease flex/tango fare differences a little as a result of it... and more inline with the co-pay difference. ($100-150 difference is easier for me to swallow for some extra AQM)

YHZ_Flyer Sep 6, 16 2:02 pm

Interesting. I like that the expanded upgrade windows are here to stay as well as the reduced amount of credits. As for the Tango and X class upgrades, in some cases it could be cheaper or equivalent to just purchase a LMU.

SparseFlyer Sep 6, 16 2:12 pm


Originally Posted by philelite (Post 27174176)
New eUpgrade requirments!

Wow, can now upgrade from Tango and Award Tickets! Thoughts? I like it.

See preview of YVR-YYZ below:

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/membe...68-capture.jpg

10/10 well played.

canadiancow Sep 6, 16 2:21 pm

It's a little annoying the co-pay waiver has zero impact on Tango.

For anyone below SE, Flex to J is $750, and Tango to J is $850. Upgrades are no longer an incentive for buying Flex.

But for SE, there's still a HUGE incentive to buy Flex, because it's $0 instead of $850.

Why not just have some blanket policy like save $500 on TATL co-pay, $750 on TPAC co-pay, and $200 (?) on North American (I made up the last number since there is no co-pay for anyone else in Flex).

YYT82 Sep 6, 16 2:23 pm

LOL to the co-pay! There are ways to grab J cheaper than eUp credits + co-pay.

Admit it AC, you screwed up with the domestic eUp requirements for the 2015/2016 benefit years and don't have the courage to say so.

Plumber Sep 6, 16 2:24 pm

the new 'Preview Upgrade Requirements for your Itinerary' shows SE paying the co=pay on Tango and Aeroplan X fares, however, the new (Beta) AIr Canada website still clearly states:

An eUpgrade Add-on will not apply to:
  • [*]
  • [*]
  • [*]
  • [*]

canadiancow Sep 6, 16 2:29 pm


Originally Posted by Plumber (Post 27174402)
the new 'Preview Upgrade Requirements for your Itinerary' shows SE paying the co=pay on Tango and Aeroplan X fares, however, the new (Beta) AIr Canada website still clearly states:

An eUpgrade Add-on will not apply to:
  • [*]
  • [*]
  • [*]
  • [*]

To be fair, they haven't announced this change yet.

"Like before, Super Elites booked in Flex and Premium Economy (Lowest) will be exempt from the co-pay. However, the co-pay will apply for the now-upgradeable Tango and Aeroplan fares."

Bases covered. Assuming they think to do that :p

CanRulez Sep 6, 16 2:29 pm


Originally Posted by canadiancow (Post 27174397)
But for SE, there's still a HUGE incentive to buy Flex, because it's $0 instead of $850.

Yeah, as an SE, there doesn't appear to be a reason to buy tango if you wish to upgrade to J....might as well pay the Flex difference which will most likely be less than the co-pay.

In addition, at least with Flex you'll get 100% miles.

Sopwith Sep 6, 16 2:32 pm

I haven't been able to upgrade for a couple of years now, so I'm a bit rusty, but to me the "Within14 days" is meaningless if they keep playing the R games. What good is "Within14 days" if they wait until the gate to release upgrades?

canadiancow Sep 6, 16 2:42 pm


Originally Posted by CanRulez (Post 27174435)
Yeah, as an SE, there doesn't appear to be a reason to buy tango if you wish to upgrade to J....might as well pay the Flex difference which will most likely be less than the co-pay.

In addition, at least with Flex you'll get 100% miles.

I actually just checked SFO-YYC-SFO for the YYC do (a North American route)

Tango plus co-pay (2x$100) is more expensive than Flex.

Though I suppose there's the benefit that you're not paying the Flex surcharge unless you actually get the upgrade, which may be worth something.

With Flex, it may be $2000, with a chance of upgrade, but Tango could be $500 plus $750 per direction actually upgraded.


Originally Posted by Sopwith (Post 27174449)
I haven't been able to upgrade for a couple of years now, so I'm a bit rusty, but to me the "Within14 days" is meaningless if they keep playing the R games. What good is "Within14 days" if they wait until the gate to release upgrades?

The vast, vast majority of my upgrades have cleared at time of request. And as someone who often books last minute on routes that are J0 at T-24, I'd rather have them defer eUpgrades as long as possible :p

Plumber Sep 6, 16 2:43 pm


Originally Posted by canadiancow (Post 27174433)
To be fair, they haven't announced this change yet.

"Like before, Super Elites booked in Flex and Premium Economy (Lowest) will be exempt from the co-pay. However, the co-pay will apply for the now-upgradeable Tango and Aeroplan fares."

Bases covered. Assuming they think to do that :p

No they have not announced it yet, but it is live in the 'Eupgrade' section of AC.com... If you search the credits required, the new system is there....but you are right, they have just not updated their T&Cs in unison.

Yul_voyager Sep 6, 16 3:08 pm


Originally Posted by YHZ_Flyer (Post 27174288)
Interesting. I like that the expanded upgrade windows are here to stay as well as the reduced amount of credits. As for the Tango and X class upgrades, in some cases it could be cheaper or equivalent to just purchase a LMU.

And in some case Tango + eupgrade copay is cheaper than Flex... This is a good new on routes when tango has to be pretty cheap because of competition (like YUL-CDG)

Nitehawk Sep 6, 16 3:31 pm

Too bad I can't upgrade my Mum's upcoming rouge flight to ATH. :( No tango to PE upgrades. This is a nice change though. So they permanently rolled back the requirements for domestic flex?

canadiancow Sep 6, 16 3:35 pm


Originally Posted by Nitehawk (Post 27174714)
Too bad I can't upgrade my Mum's upcoming rouge flight to ATH. :( No tango to PE upgrades. This is a nice change though. So they permanently rolled back the requirements for domestic flex?

I suspect they'd add that. It wouldn't make sense not to.

My guess is someone accidentally pushed the J changes before they were ready to go live.

For all we know, the intended launch might be March 1.

Lights_a_blur Sep 6, 16 3:55 pm


Originally Posted by canadiancow (Post 27174495)

Though I suppose there's the benefit that you're not paying the Flex surcharge unless you actually get the upgrade, which may be worth something.

It also helps the people stuck with employers that only book Tango. The co-pay and upgrade can be processed in a separate transaction on their personal card.

DNAwizard Sep 6, 16 4:00 pm

The details of this promotion (Sept 6, 2016 - Jan 9, 2017) and some other changes have now been posted on the AC website:

https://www.aircanada.com/en/offers/...ade_offer.html

yyz_atc_qq Sep 6, 16 4:02 pm

I wonder if this is why MrsQQ's waitlisted upgrade dropped over the weekend.

canadiancow Sep 6, 16 4:05 pm

Well I guess that's that.

I'll just sit here and wait for the inevitable "the check-in agent told me my fare isn't eligible for upgrade!" :p

YOWgary Sep 6, 16 4:57 pm


Originally Posted by Jumper Jack (Post 27174212)
Laughing so hard right now.. AS predicted by me a few months back(Though I was more thinking they would allow Tango to PE as oppose to Tango to J)

Well.. it has happened.

International require a $600 co-pay to europe FOR Tango/Reward tix

Best Part : Tango E-upgrade to Asia for $850

I am going to very.. very happy next summer when I get J for <1200 to PVG

http://i.imgur.com/pxHEJqE.png
http://i.imgur.com/IJC4f4U.png

Jack - just a thought, you might actually be better off if, instead of your dad giving you 50K, he takes the 50 eUps and makes you his nominee.

As a 50K, you'll only get enough eUps to upgrade YYZ-PVG one way, but if he keeps his, and nominates you, you can buy Tango AND upgrade YYZ-PVG both ways.

Plus - and someone please check me on this - I believe you would then get the benefit of his SE eUp window, not your 50K, reducing the chances that the flight hits R0 before you get a chance to eUp.

If you're not flying much the rest of the year anyway, you're not giving up much in terms of lost 50K privileges for two YVR-YYZ one-ways.

Either way, you're kind of betting the farm - a quick look right now shows that YYZ-PVG is R0 at both 10 and 14 days, and that's after the back-to-school rush is over.

YVR-PVG is a little better, but either way, if your flight date is R0 when the window opens, a 50K on a Tango fare is going to be near the bottom of the list, and then you're stuck spending countless hours in an Economy seat that, as we all know, is the worst thing that's ever happened to anyone.

Food for thought, anyway.

gtpdiddy Sep 6, 16 5:12 pm

http://www.aircanada.com/en/offers/a...ade_offer.html
Until Jan 9, 2017!

Jumper Jack Sep 6, 16 5:15 pm


Originally Posted by YOWgary (Post 27175033)
Jack - just a thought, you might actually be better off if, instead of your dad giving you 50K, he takes the 50 eUps and makes you his nominee.

As a 50K, you'll only get enough eUps to upgrade YYZ-PVG one way, but if he keeps his, and nominates you, you can buy Tango AND upgrade YYZ-PVG both ways.

Plus - and someone please check me on this - I believe you would then get the benefit of his SE eUp window, not your 50K, reducing the chances that the flight hits R0 before you get a chance to eUp.

If you're not flying much the rest of the year anyway, you're not giving up much in terms of lost 50K privileges for two YVR-YYZ one-ways.

Either way, you're kind of betting the farm - a quick look right now shows that YYZ-PVG is R0 at both 10 and 14 days, and that's after the back-to-school rush is over.

YVR-PVG is a little better, but either way, if your flight date is R0 when the window opens, a 50K on a Tango fare is going to be near the bottom of the list, and then you're stuck spending countless hours in an Economy seat that, as we all know, is the worst thing that's ever happened to anyone.

Food for thought, anyway.

Hi Gary!

Thank you for the thoughts, they are very useful! :)

I have did the math in my head, now there are few reasons why I would choose E50 over the 50 E-up

1. If I go back to China for summer job again, having Star G benefit is useful for the 4-8 segments I do inter-china/south korea for work.
2. I am not too concerned about upgrade availability as on all of the fights me & my father took, there are always 3-4 seats left empty for YYZ-PVG/PVG-YYZ(As long as its the 40J 777 I think I should be safe)
3. Your comments regarding SE upgrade window are absolutely correct, but from what I heard once T-24 , I am pretty much screwed at the Gate as I am below everyone.
4. I travel with luggages most of the time and to me, the next worst thing to spending time in HD Y is to wait another hour in YVR for my luggage to arrive. That is like.. one of the most important E50 benefit for me.. before anything.
5. I am more likely to use credits for my YYZ-YVR route on sunday mornings than YVR-PVG if I am being completely honest here, I don't think I am going to risk stuck in Y for TPAC again... then again this sub $300 fare is really sucking me in to eat my words. Next summer is pretty much destined to be miles redemption for J at this point. But I am more than likely to buy Tango to EU and upgrade.
6. I really like the arrival lounge benefit , this allows to me to grab a quick lunch before heading back to UBC/Home(Besides, the YVR sandwiches are better now after my rant about how awful they are) .
7. I really need the PE seats on YYZ-YVR and I am willing to pay Flex for it, which give me free access to those seats. Plus ability to upgrade to J. - This also allow me to build up my P25/E35K status for 2018 in case AC screws SE by taking out E50.
8. As a E50, I can choose 40 E-UP credits vs 50. For all of the benefits entails.. I would argue that.. perhaps the E50+ is worth the 10 E-UP?

But that being said, thank you so much for your suggestion, this is def something for me to think about and you have raised some very good points I haven't thought about yet.
I will be watching the FLEX-Tango-PE gap very closely for the entire next year, If I see value in buying flex outright, I might waive my E50 for 2018 so that I can buy flex to EU/Asia and upgrade without any co-pay

canadiancow Sep 6, 16 5:28 pm


Originally Posted by Jumper Jack (Post 27175104)
Next summer is pretty much destined to be miles redemption for J at this point. But I am more than likely to buy Tango to EU and upgrade.

I stopped reading at this point.

Tango upgrades are only until January.

YOWCDNFF Sep 6, 16 5:37 pm

Well, not sure if this was there before but Premium Economy is now showing as a travel class for N.American travel on te upgrade chart, as well as on AC.com for North American travel. The end of preferred seating soon? (NO fares available yet though)

Jumper Jack Sep 6, 16 5:41 pm


Originally Posted by canadiancow (Post 27175133)
I stopped reading at this point.

Tango upgrades are only until January.

Oh sorry... you are right. I forgot about that for second.
Thanks for pointing it out. :)
But if past history is any indicator.......

thatdamnmelliniumbug Sep 6, 16 7:38 pm

How does this work for travelers traveling with an elite/super elite member?

If I take my wife with me on a trip and she's on an Aeroplan Y fare, at the gate, do they collect the additional add ons or how does this work when I use my eups on her.

canadiancow Sep 6, 16 7:43 pm


Originally Posted by thatdamnmelliniumbug (Post 27175517)
How does this work for travelers traveling with an elite/super elite member?

If I take my wife with me on a trip and she's on an Aeroplan Y fare, at the gate, do they collect the additional add ons or how does this work when I use my eups on her.

I assume it would work the exact same way as the existing co-pays for international flights.

Adam Smith Sep 6, 16 9:23 pm


Originally Posted by canadiancow (Post 27175133)
I stopped reading at this point.

Tango upgrades are only until January.

Have they actually officially announced any of this yet? Maybe the Tango/reward upgrades are a one-month trial. Or a 2017 benefit year privilege that wasn't supposed to be rolled out yet.

CanRulez Sep 6, 16 9:50 pm


Originally Posted by adam.smith (Post 27175852)
Have they actually officially announced any of this yet? Maybe the Tango/reward upgrades are a one-month trial. Or a 2017 benefit year privilege that wasn't supposed to be rolled out yet.

DNAwizard posted the link earlier, but here it is below.

https://www.aircanada.com/en/offers/...ade_offer.html

I see it live on my existing booking.

Transpacificflyer Sep 6, 16 10:00 pm


Originally Posted by Jumper Jack (Post 27174212)
Laughing so hard right now.. AS predicted by me a few months back(Though I was more thinking they would allow Tango to PE as oppose to Tango to J)

Well.. it has happened.

International require a $600 co-pay to europe FOR Tango/Reward tix

Best Part : Tango E-upgrade to Asia for $850

I am going to very.. very happy next summer when I get J for <1200 to PVG

Ok, what am I missing here? J class to Pudong is $3500 RT.
The cheapest fare to upgrade is $820 + 26 credits + $850 CAD (taxes incl.)
That's $1670 plus the credits, right? OK. so please explain why you think that a Tango fare customer is going to be able to easily upgrade
You are aware that on the longhaul routes, the load factory is rather high? There is an ongoing issue of overbooking.
Then there are going to be the aeropoint addicts who will want their full points and will fly in flex and will also assume that they will stand a better chance of an upgrade. However, more likely will be the folks in PE looking to upgrade and they will occupy a higher part of the pecking order.

I appreciate that you like living life on the edge, an adventurer, willing to try new things like red tortilla chips vs yellow, or wearing those odd fitting boxer briefs from HM which I can't wear because I am too fat and too old. However, it seems to me that it is very, unlikely you will score the upgrade from a Tango fare. In plane language you are deluded. (Yes, I know it should be plain, but this is an air travel forum and I am trying to show off my grasp of language, and offer a witty pun, which I shouldn't have to explain, but I just know someone will notice). Of course, I could be wrong. It wouldn't be the first time, but I just think you are setting yourself up for heartbreak. Unless you have an ability to charm the system. Everyone's going to be upgrading, so it's going to be difficult to get one. What am I missing?

Adam Smith Sep 6, 16 10:39 pm


Originally Posted by CanRulez (Post 27175947)
DNAwizard posted the link earlier, but here it is below.

https://www.aircanada.com/en/offers/...ade_offer.html

I see it live on my existing booking.

My bad, I missed that sandwiched between YOWgary's big post and Jack's reply to it.

CdnFlier Sep 6, 16 11:09 pm

Interesting, well that's a start. A little too late for me, this drop from SE last year to nada this year has been interesting. Tried a few other carriers, and while AC status would be nice for this stuff..it'll be interesting to see if this becomes permanent or it's just a way to burn off eups.

Kudos on restoring upgrade from AE though, it was a nice year or two where that was possible.

The whole SE co-pay for Tango floats between making sense and being confusing. For SEs to remain SEs there aren't going to be a lot of Tango purchases anyway.

canadiancow Sep 7, 16 12:11 am


Originally Posted by CdnFlier (Post 27176114)
The whole SE co-pay for Tango floats between making sense and being confusing. For SEs to remain SEs there aren't going to be a lot of Tango purchases anyway.

I've hit the requirements for SE already.

If I need to fly somewhere, and Tango plus co-pay is cheaper than Flex/PY, why wouldn't I save money?

My bigger issue is that while Tango is an extra $100 each way in co-pay for E75K, it's an extra $850 each way for me. So I'm not even convinced the cost savings is there.

Might as well buy PY and be top of the upgrade list, especially given that I often see PY priced between Tango and Flex.

quantumofforce Sep 7, 16 1:06 am


Originally Posted by canadiancow (Post 27176265)
I've hit the requirements for SE already.

If I need to fly somewhere, and Tango plus co-pay is cheaper than Flex/PY, why wouldn't I save money?

My bigger issue is that while Tango is an extra $100 each way in co-pay for E75K, it's an extra $850 each way for me. So I'm not even convinced the cost savings is there.

Might as well buy PY and be top of the upgrade list, especially given that I often see PY priced between Tango and Flex.

Maybe this is all designed to sell more PY seats?

Bonaventure Sep 7, 16 2:57 am

Interesting change. Can't see how it's that big of a benefit, but more choice is always better.

FlyerGoldII Sep 7, 16 4:54 am

I have read AQD for SE next year, and I am almost here for the AQM segment.

So I might want some of my remaining flights for the rest of the year booked as award seats or tango seats; but if I have to pay a miniscule amount for a co-pay - that would be deterrant for me.

So anyone know whether SE will or will not pay be responsible for the co-pay in these situations?

yyznomad Sep 7, 16 5:09 am


Originally Posted by Transpacificflyer (Post 27175981)
Ok, what am I missing here? J class to Pudong is $3500 RT.
The cheapest fare to upgrade is $820 + 26 credits + $850 CAD (taxes incl.)
That's $1670 plus the credits, right? OK. so please explain why you think that a Tango fare customer is going to be able to easily upgrade
You are aware that on the longhaul routes, the load factory is rather high? There is an ongoing issue of overbooking.
Then there are going to be the aeropoint addicts who will want their full points and will fly in flex and will also assume that they will stand a better chance of an upgrade. However, more likely will be the folks in PE looking to upgrade and they will occupy a higher part of the pecking order.

I appreciate that you like living life on the edge, an adventurer, willing to try new things like red tortilla chips vs yellow, or wearing those odd fitting boxer briefs from HM which I can't wear because I am too fat and too old. However, it seems to me that it is very, unlikely you will score the upgrade from a Tango fare. In plane language you are deluded. (Yes, I know it should be plain, but this is an air travel forum and I am trying to show off my grasp of language, and offer a witty pun, which I shouldn't have to explain, but I just know someone will notice). Of course, I could be wrong. It wouldn't be the first time, but I just think you are setting yourself up for heartbreak. Unless you have an ability to charm the system. Everyone's going to be upgrading, so it's going to be difficult to get one. What am I missing?

^


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