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-   Air Canada | Aeroplan (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/air-canada-aeroplan-375/)
-   -   New eUpgrade Requirements! Co-pay for lower flex fares (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/air-canada-aeroplan/1789272-new-eupgrade-requirements-co-pay-lower-flex-fares.html)

ffsim Sep 7, 16 8:43 am


Originally Posted by Geoflying (Post 27177081)
No upgrade from Aeroplan Market Fare (why not?)

I find this curious, too. Market Fares are at the very least Tango fares, so I don't understand why they can't be upgraded if AC allows upgrades from outright Tango fares. Strange.

alc Sep 7, 16 8:55 am


Originally Posted by ffsim (Post 27177675)
I find this curious, too. Market Fares are at the very least Tango fares, so I don't understand why they can't be upgraded if AC allows upgrades from outright Tango fares. Strange.

I haven't catch-up all the reading on this thread yet, but are we sure it will not work for Market Fares? I understood the chart show Aeroplan Classic, but as you stated, Market Fares is not "X" class, so it might work.

Anyone here got a Market Fares ticket before Jan 9 that can try to put it in the eUpg account and see if it will show "Upgrades can only be requested within 1 days of departure." or not?

YVR72 Sep 7, 16 9:03 am

I have a feeling the R Games are going to get a lot worse. But, I had a hunch this permanent change to standard upgrades was coming. They misjudged the impact of the original program revisions and have fixed it.

I've got several transcon flights coming up this fall so we shall see how it goes.

ridefar Sep 7, 16 9:05 am


Originally Posted by Diabeetus (Post 27177155)
Like many above, I am unimpressed by the copay for SE. Even the copay amounts themselves seem high to me for domestic routes.

I'd rather just buy the P fare too:
Confirmed J seat
More AQM
Saves Eups for other routes (I.e. TPAC from PY)

Disclaimer: I early qualify for S100k soon.

Seems to me that for domestic routes the copay is pretty similar to the LMU prices. So like why bother?

YEGTigger Sep 7, 16 9:06 am


Originally Posted by alc (Post 27177734)
I haven't catch-up all the reading on this thread yet, but are we sure it will not work for Market Fares? I understood the chart show Aeroplan Classic, but as you stated, Market Fares is not "X" class, so it might work.

Anyone here got a Market Fares ticket before Jan 9 that can try to put it in the eUpg account and see if it will show "Upgrades can only be requested within 1 days of departure." or not?

I've got one in October that when I put it in says "Upgrades can only be requested within 14 days of departure." So, that would seem to indicate it is upgradeable.

ffsim Sep 7, 16 9:13 am


Originally Posted by alc (Post 27177734)
I haven't catch-up all the reading on this thread yet, but are we sure it will not work for Market Fares? I understood the chart show Aeroplan Classic, but as you stated, Market Fares is not "X" class, so it might work.

Anyone here got a Market Fares ticket before Jan 9 that can try to put it in the eUpg account and see if it will show "Upgrades can only be requested within 1 days of departure." or not?

Good suggestion.

I tried upgrading an upcoming reward flight booked for my wife. One segment is in A and the other is in T. The message alongside both segments says:


Upgrades can only be requested within 10 days of departure.
So it's half nonsense and half encouraging. Nonsense because as an E50, I can't upgrade her unless she's on my PNR and even then, as far as I know, only at the airport on the day of departure. Yet it's encouraging because if I could actually upgrade her, it would be at the T-10 day mark.

So basically, flip a coin ;)

YOWgary Sep 7, 16 9:29 am


Originally Posted by ridefar (Post 27177788)
Seems to me that for domestic routes the copay is pretty similar to the LMU prices. So like why bother?

Sunk-cost fallacy.

AC is betting that 25Ks will think "well, I've got all these upgrade certificates, and it'd be a shame to just let them expire..."

Honestly, I think this is all simply a revenue-management move, trying to find a way to further monetize expired eUps and squeeze out another $500/yr per lower-tier FF member.

At this point, AC are offering several different ways to pay to upgrade, all of which seem calculated to make the passenger feel like "oh, it's just a little more", when, as many have shown here, LMU, or co-pay, or whatever, comes out to almost as much, or even more than, simply buying the higher fare in the first place.

I've been talking about it for a year and a half, now I'm ready to plant a flag on it - you'll be able to buy eUp credits by the end of 2018.

capebretonboy Sep 7, 16 9:45 am


Originally Posted by YOWgary (Post 27177888)
Sunk-cost fallacy.

AC is betting that 25Ks will think "well, I've got all these upgrade certificates, and it'd be a shame to just let them expire..."

Honestly, I think this is all simply a revenue-management move, trying to find a way to further monetize expired eUps and squeeze out another $500/yr per lower-tier FF member.

At this point, AC are offering several different ways to pay to upgrade, all of which seem calculated to make the passenger feel like "oh, it's just a little more", when, as many have shown here, LMU, or co-pay, or whatever, comes out to almost as much, or even more than, simply buying the higher fare in the first place.

I think you are right on the psychology of this.. I am already thinking "it's just a little more, AC is allowing me to do it from Tango now, so why not. It is somewhat of a win-win for both parties. They make a little extra and I get to upgrade a previously unupgradeable itinerary (is that a word?)

172pilot Sep 7, 16 9:56 am


Originally Posted by ridefar (Post 27177788)
Seems to me that for domestic routes the copay is pretty similar to the LMU prices. So like why bother?

Agreed. The copay makes the Tango upgrade kind of useless. My company won't pay the copay but will pay for Flex. The copay seems to be higher than the fare difference in some cases.

I hope this is a trial run for the next 4 months and then will be adjusted for the 2017 benefit year.

Diabeetus Sep 7, 16 10:04 am


Originally Posted by YOWgary (Post 27177888)
Sunk-cost fallacy.

AC is betting that 25Ks will think "well, I've got all these upgrade certificates, and it'd be a shame to just let them expire..."

Honestly, I think this is all simply a revenue-management move, trying to find a way to further monetize expired eUps and squeeze out another $500/yr per lower-tier FF member.

Speaking of lower tiered elites, I think WestJet does it better.

A WS FF can use an upgrade certificate on the lowest fare to all destinations except Hawaii/LGW. They need to do the upgrade at the gate, once the flight is closed. If there is space in Plus, then they get the upgrade.

No copays. No fare class shenanigans.

alc Sep 7, 16 10:21 am

Thanks for those that try to upgrade a Market Fare ticket. So, it look like it is processing like any normal revenue ticket for now. Let see what happen when it is indeed within T-10

Re: LMU vs. co-pay. I recalled a recent thread state co-pay goes toward AQD while i also recalled from a thread eariler this year that LMU do not. If my memory (not the one you can really trust) is correct and the cost is about the same, it might be better to co-pay to top up your AQD. Say, you are < $50 short, a co-pay of $50 during an upcoming company only willing to pay Tango yyz-yow trip might not be that bad vs doing a round trip MR somewhere else.

alc Sep 7, 16 10:27 am


Originally Posted by Diabeetus (Post 27178053)
Speaking of lower tiered elites, I think WestJet does it better.

A WS FF can use an upgrade certificate on the lowest fare to all destinations except Hawaii/LGW. They need to do the upgrade at the gate, once the flight is closed. If there is space in Plus, then they get the upgrade.

No copays. No fare class shenanigans.

But is Plus really compareable to AC N.A. J... oh wait the WJ commercial only compare to a Full Y / Latitude ticket :)

What i am saying is that because the product is different, the demand is also differrent and hence handling it the old paper AC cert way will be fine. Remember how most of us complain about the cert/wallpaper back in the days?

Kraafish Sep 7, 16 10:37 am

Went on and tried my SFO-YYZ-IST itinerary in which I booked in Tango.

IST-YYZ $1600
YYZ-SFO $ 400

Hmmm, well considered my first leg from SFO-IST during online check-in I got asked if I want to get upgrade for significant less on both legs, eventually I got upgraded at the gate for free in SFO-YYZ flight. I feel like this is just another way to ripped low-tier customer out. If I want to spend extra $400 to upgrade my YYZ-SFO flight I might as well buy a flex fare and get more mileages.

Diabeetus Sep 7, 16 10:39 am


Originally Posted by alc (Post 27178160)
But is Plus really compareable to AC N.A. J... oh wait the WJ commercial only compare to a Full Y / Latitude ticket :)

What i am saying is that because the product is different, the demand is also differrent and hence handling it the old paper AC cert way will be fine. Remember how most of us complain about the cert/wallpaper back in the days?

Good point. The WS Plus is an inferior soft/hard product to AC NA J. Especially if you can do a ULH in a widebody

YOWgary Sep 7, 16 11:08 am


Originally Posted by Kraafish (Post 27178205)
If I want to spend extra $400 to upgrade my YYZ-SFO flight I might as well buy a flex fare and get more mileages.

Sure, if you control the overall purchase decision.

Lots of us do most of our flying on tickets purchased by clients and/or employers, which most often means lowest-Y.

Paying out of pocket to up-fare to Flex, just for a chance at maybe playing Aerolotto, is a pretty long bet; at least this way, an employee trying to eUp from an employer-purchased Tango fare knows s/he won't pay the fee unless the upgrade clears.


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