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ExpertFlyer and Air Canada- how to read

ExpertFlyer and Air Canada- how to read

Old Aug 29, 16, 3:02 pm
  #1  
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ExpertFlyer and Air Canada- how to read

Hey all,

I am trying out expert flyer as I want to start using it to monitor AC flights and load factor.

The following is a parsed bit for a flight I have:

J1 C1 D0 Z0 P0 R1 Y2 B1 M1 U0 H0 Q0 V0 W0 G0 S0 T0 L0 A0 K0

What I am trying to find out is if this flight is worth heading to gate early to try to do a volunteer bump for compensation?

From what I read- they have at least 1 business class seat open, and 2 economy class seats open? Does this show standby for this flight?

J1 is full fare business
C1 is low fare business
R1 is upgrade space
M1 is full fare economy
Y2 is economy...?

Is this kind of right? Is this the same across all airlines or only for AC?

Thanks!
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Old Aug 29, 16, 3:18 pm
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In the display in EF, if you click on the fare class you are interested in it will give a pop up that tells you what that class means. Y2 means there are still 2 seats available for sale at full (Latitude) fare in economy. Different airlines use different codes although many are the same across many airlines.
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Old Aug 29, 16, 3:19 pm
  #3  
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Start with the fare classes. You're partly right. Here is an official table with all of the fare classes and what buckets they fit in. And it depends slightly on the route. But, roughly:
  • J, C, D: Business (flexible); within Canada/US (C, D Business (lowest) elsewhere)
  • Z, P: Business (lowest)
  • R: eUpgrade space to J; also SE J IKK space
  • I: J reward space
  • O: PY (flexible)
  • E, N: PY (lowest); N is also eUpgrade space to PY
  • Y, B: Latitude
  • M, U, H, Q, V, W, G: Flex (M, U, H referred to on FT sometimes as "high Flex" as they require fewer upgrade)
  • The rest: Tango
  • X: Y reward space

I'm not sure what bucket PY rewards come from. I'd guess N, but someone here will probably correct me on that.

Note that EF doesn't show I space when you search for the flight, you have to do a specific search for rewards seats using that EF function.

Is this the same across other airlines? Not at all. Some are fairly consistent (Y is generally the highest economy fare, for instance), but there are plenty of differences, e.g. A is used by UA for domestic F (and maybe international F too, not sure) and C is the highest business class fare on AV.

As for your flight, all those numbers tell you is what fares AC is still willing to sell, not how many seats are actually available. Remember that AC is willing to oversell on the hope that people will no-show or change to other flights, or, if not, hoping that VDB or IDB comes out to less than they earned by selling a last-minute fare. So, a flight can be Y2 but be oversold.

I'd guess, based on those loads, that it's pretty close to sold out, but not necessarily oversold, since they're still selling a Flex fare (albeit the most expensive kind). But there's no way to be certain from that data. Is it worth going to volunteer for VDB? Could be, but no guarantees. As an E75K though, it's highly unlikely AC would bump you, so volunteering is the only way you'd get paid.
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Old Aug 29, 16, 3:21 pm
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I don't believe EF shows standby, but if you're trying to get bumped, it doesn't matter if there's one person or fifty on the standby list, that only comes up if there are unsold / no-show seats.

There's no hard and fast rule on this one, but unless it's Y0 I would say your chances of getting VDB'd are pretty low.

Obviously this depends on what that flight is - those numbers relate very differently to a 788 flying YYZ-YVR at 6PM on a Friday than they do to an E75 flying YYZ-ORD on a Saturday morning.
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Old Aug 29, 16, 3:27 pm
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Originally Posted by adam.smith View Post
...
As for your flight, all those numbers tell you is what fares AC is still willing to sell, not how many seats are actually available. Remember that AC is willing to oversell on the hope that people will no-show or change to other flights, or, if not, hoping that VDB or IDB comes out to less than they earned by selling a last-minute fare. So, a flight can be Y2 but be oversold.

I'd guess, based on those loads, that it's pretty close to sold out, but not necessarily oversold, since they're still selling a Flex fare (albeit the most expensive kind). Is it worth going to volunteer for VDB? Could be, but no guarantees. As an E75K though, it's highly unlikely AC would bump you, so volunteering is the only way you'd get paid.
Yes - 2 hours ago my flight AC 856 was showing 3 seats available for sale in PE and all economy fare buckets at 0. Now it is J4 C4 D4 Z3 P3 R0 O0 E0 N0 Y2 B2 M1 U1 H0 Q0 V0 W0 S0 T0 L0 K0 so I guess they have already bumped some folks up to PE and made 3 seats available for sale in economy. It could still be oversold in economy though as there are a few seats available in J (hoping one of them might end up being mine as I am in paid N class)

Edit: In the time I typed that it went to J6 C6 D6 Z5 P5 R0 O0 E0 N0 Y0 B0 M0 U0 H0 Q0 V0 W0 S0 T0 L0 K0 - They are clearly rearranging things now it is almost T-2hours, possibly based on how many people have already shown up at the airport and checked their bags etc.

Edit (2): At T-55 minutes it is now back to J4 C4 D4 Z3 P3 R0 O0 E0 N0 Y2 B2 M1 U1 H0 Q0 V0 W0 S0 T0 L0 K0 - fun fun

Edit (3). OpUp happened

Last edited by Geoflying; Aug 29, 16 at 5:24 pm
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Old Aug 29, 16, 3:28 pm
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Originally Posted by YOWgary View Post
Obviously this depends on what that flight is - those numbers relate very differently to a 788 flying YYZ-YVR at 6PM on a Friday than they do to an E75 flying YYZ-ORD on a Saturday morning.
This is a very good point. On busy travel days and/or later in the day, there's more potential for messes to have piled up in the schedule and they may be looking for flexibility and need to IDB/VDB people.

But you never know. I was on some flight a while ago, early in the day, where it looked heavily oversold but a big tour group (20+, I think) misconnected and it went out with a bunch of empty seats. On the other hand, AC undoubtedly had a big job to do accommodating that large number of people on later flights. Actually, it may not have been AC, I don't remember, but the principle is the same.
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Old Aug 29, 16, 4:05 pm
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Went to gate to volunteer- were oversold by 4.

Was able to volunteer but 8 people got caught up in immigration so I made it on.

Thanks for the info everyone! Really appreciate it!
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Old Aug 29, 16, 4:44 pm
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That just goes to show you the unpredictability - oversold by 4, but ended up with empty seats (or space for standbys).

Only way to find out is to try.
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Old Aug 30, 16, 2:50 pm
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Originally Posted by Erome View Post
Hey all,

I am trying out expert flyer as I want to start using it to monitor AC flights and load factor.

The following is a parsed bit for a flight I have:

J1 C1 D0 Z0 P0 R1 Y2 B1 M1 U0 H0 Q0 V0 W0 G0 S0 T0 L0 A0 K0

What I am trying to find out is if this flight is worth heading to gate early to try to do a volunteer bump for compensation?

From what I read- they have at least 1 business class seat open, and 2 economy class seats open? Does this show standby for this flight?

J1 is full fare business
C1 is low fare business
R1 is upgrade space
M1 is full fare economy
Y2 is economy...?

Is this kind of right? Is this the same across all airlines or only for AC?

Thanks!
Fare availability does not necessarily equate to seats being open.
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Old Aug 8, 17, 2:50 pm
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If something is R0- and J9 C8 D7 Z5 P3 Y9 etc...

Does that mean there is a good chance of the waitlist eupgrade clearing?

When do they normally go through the waitlist? At gate, or beforehand sometimes?
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Old Aug 8, 17, 3:04 pm
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J9 how far before departure?

They go through it at the gate, and sometimes before.
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Old Aug 8, 17, 3:07 pm
  #12  
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Originally Posted by Erome View Post
If something is R0- and J9 C8 D7 Z5 P3 Y9 etc...

Does that mean there is a good chance of the waitlist eupgrade clearing?
Depends, how far away is the flight? What's your status and fare class? If a couple hours and you're SE, probably a fairly good chance of eUp clearing. If it's a month away, who knows. Depends on how many people buy tickets on short notice etc.

When do they normally go through the waitlist? At gate, or beforehand sometimes?
Both. Your eUp could clear a week out, it could clear just before OLCI opens, they might process it at the gate...
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Old Aug 8, 17, 3:14 pm
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Its for YVR-YXE Aug 22nd

SE 100k, on flight pass (M fare)
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Old Aug 8, 17, 4:08 pm
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Originally Posted by Erome View Post
Its for YVR-YXE Aug 22nd

SE 100k, on flight pass (M fare)
14 days out is too much time to have a lot of confidence that the numbers will stay like that. Also, keep in mind that R0 means you have no view into the upgrade waitlist length ... there could be 10 other people on the list already. As an SE you'll be in OK shape, but you're behind any SEMM's.

Bottom line ... you might be OK, J9 is better than J0 but I've seen loads swing quite a lot in the last few days before a flight.
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Old Aug 8, 17, 5:15 pm
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SE in M on a flight like that? I'd bet on it clearing in advance unless that J number drops waaaay down.

The flight is operated by a CRA, which means they're selling 10 seats, and it's J9. It's quite possible the entire cabin is unsold at this point.
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