Why the IKK limit is stupid
 

This morning, I decided that instead of flying to YVR on my flight pass, I'd fly to YYZ with Aeroplan.

But there was no regular business space available today.

However, AC 756 (the 763, so my ideal flight) was J9C9D9Z9P9R9I0 ... X1. It may have been X9, but that's irrelevant.

So I do what any sane person would do. I booked a business class round trip with that segment confirmed in economy, went to the airport, and before I even left check-in, I had a ML*1 boarding pass[1].

IKK redemptions untouched.

Even if I wanted just a one-way, I could have booked it to any connection past YYZ, in J, and done the same thing.

So why is the IKK limit stupid?

Because revenue management is not acting appropriately. They have not prevented business class redemptions (for anyone) on this flight. They have just prevented it from being "easy".

So I guess in short, if a flight is J9C9D9Z9P9R9 X4, I think it should also be I4.

[1] The check-in agent started counting my upgrade credits. She apparently sees the same list we do, but without the total. She had clearly never seen such a large amount before. I don't know why she counted all the way to 154, but she did. Then I had to explain the situation. Then she had to call the concierge, who knew exactly what to do.

Great to hear your new episode of "I work at the airport" went well, even if you had to "explain the situation". :D

She was nothing but helpful. Don't get me wrong. Just because she didn't understand the situation and had to call for help does not bother me.

She was very respectful, polite, and helpful, even if it took longer than I would have liked.

And I never suggested otherwise. At least she called for help. ^

That's probably the point. Most people who use aeroplan don't have any clue about using the tools and schemes used by people on FT. I know more SE's off of FT than on FT and all of them have no clue about what is discussed here.

The other point I think you are missing is that people who redden for business class want to have the business class seat at the time of booking and not have to deal with waiting at the airport.

I think AC wanted to limit the number of upgrades given out, and they have achieved it. Your method of getting a business class seat probably doesn't even reach 1% of the business class bookings redeemed.

Hell, I know about these methods and I can't even be bothered to go through the hoops - I have better things to do with my time. Guess that means AC's system is working - to some degree. :p

Whenever I see my "10 IKK remaining for the year" counter, I think how stupid it is if AC's *real* frequent flyers who can earn SE status in a month (yyznomad!) get the same 10 IKK redemptions that mere mortals like the rest of us SE100k's get.

I'm confused. I thought that to be eligible to upgrade on an AE redemption you needed to pay J points for a Y seat, then wait list at the airport. But on a direct itinerary if there is no J available, you can't pay J points, so no way to upgrade. Am I mistaken?

I agree with you to an extent, but I booked this less than 4 hours before departure.

By that time, they know exactly what's going on. I'm not saying they should open it up to I9 11 months before departure just because it's X9 and no other seats in J have been sold. But 4 hours out?

In previous years, I just would have used IKK. But now, it's not worth it. It's a bit more effort for me, but that last IKK slot could easily be the difference between a happy birthday and an expensive (but still happy) birthday (my birthday is right before it resets).

I wish AC could have two-letter fare classes.

I for regular business class. IN (to copy United) for "elite" business class. R for "I'm Super Elite and I REAAAAALLY want this flight" business class.

Today's "I" would be tomorrow's "IN". "I" would be reduced. R could be the same.

Because that's my other issue. I'm SE, and can't get J on a flight (without IKK). But it's because the MileagePlus credit card churners* have taken all the seats.

*Or whomever. The point is, as SE, I should always have better access than someone with no status or from another program. AC makes money from me. That is evident by my status. In the context of redeeming miles for flights, they cannot make the same assumption about anyone who does not have AC status.

I booked a round trip with confirmed J on the return.

However, for a one-way, I could have added on a YYZ-YOW/YUL/YWG/Yxx flight confirmed in J now, and just not shown up for it.

So basically you're confirming the fact (often disputed here quite vigorously by certain posters, with a reference to a rather vaguely worded post from an AC rep about 'upgrade' priorities) that Aeroplan tickets with at least one segment confirmed in J, are basically at the top of the waitlist (and superior to the 'upgrade' list) for travelling in J for the remaining segments. And this is what you took advantage of, because you were able to find inventory in the Y cabin at some point in the day (a significant likelihood on most lighter travel days on such a busy route!).

Is my assessment of the situation correct?

We're departing with at least 11 empty J seats.

That's my point.

This is not a flight where J space was in dispute. There is TONS of it.

That should have been made clear by the loads I posted.

No, your assessment of the situation is not correct, you've just tried to manipulate it to suit your needs.

P.S. my argument was that status was the most important regardless. That would have me at the top of the list regardless of other factors, because I'm SE. So even if J were full, your assessment would still be wrong.

There never was any question of the waitlist not being cleared, so you were just immediately cleared into confirmed space at check-in.


Yet my assessment seems to have worked out for you. And doesn't rely upon status at all. Your status in this case was/is meaningless, and no-status "Joe Blow" with 50,000 Aeroplan points to burn could have done the same.

Under the current system, there is always a not insignificant amount of risk that someone's waitlisted AP segments into J won't clear. As AC can (and routinely attempts to) confirm all remaining seats for revenue pax or confirmed R-space upgraders. I'm pretty sure that AC wouldn't want to start effectively guaranteeing AP mixed reward tickets J space on a confirmed, not waitlisted basis.

BTW, the IKK limit still is a useful tool for AC to limit redemptions in lieu of being able to sell very high fare bucket fares on days which are traditionally very heavy, if not significantly oversold days for which AP inventory would be set to almost zero at the outset based on historic trending of demand.

You nailed it. I don't want to go through a convoluted process to get a seat.
And like you, I have much better things to do with my time. The gimmicks and gaming of the system annoy me. I pay premium fares and when the time comes to get some sort of consideration for accepting the inflated fares for a mediocre product all I get is aggravation and excessive surcharges. It erodes loyalty and undermines the brand image.

I thought this was going to be a thread about how one could book 10 PNRs with 9 tickets each to Europe/Asia/wherever very far away and cost a ton of money whereas people like you and me who often book shorter-haul tickets, often one-way, and do so for 1-2 people per PNR, get access to a lot less seats and cost AC a lot less money.

I agree you've identified an issue here, but this seems to me more an issue of poor revenue management by not allowing some I space than an IKK issue. As jaysona said, I think most people want confirmed J at time of booking, not a slight variation on aerolotto, and very few reward bookings are made day of/day before the flight.

I'd have to agree. Realistically, how many "I must have J no matter the cost" customers (ie: fat people, deputy ministers/public servants/legislators, corporate CEOs, hockey players, etc.) are going to reach for web browser, and accept a ticket that, at best, enables them to waitlist into J? Albeit at a very high priority as is accorded to AP tickets. Very few. The goal of revenue management is to maximize the number of situations, particularly at short notice, that will result in this very limited subset of passengers being forced to pay full fare.

Heck, half of us on this very AP forum can't even agree on what canadiancow did as being possible, as evidenced by the various threads in which the topic has arisen (usually devolving to "you don't know what you're talking about" or similar). And I like to think that FT'ers are a bit more knowledgeable than your average J buyer when it comes to the practicalities of AP redemptions.


But if I space is allocated willy-nilly and always available for at-time-of-booking compensation, then you will the "J must-haves" buying AP points for $0.02 a piece, and enjoying confirmed J class travel for $1000-$1500 (+ $100-$200 in fees) roundtrip. Obviously not very viable when the going rate is around double that for "discounted J" on the transcon routes.

AC revenue management generally knows what they're doing. I don't see any evidence that they've done canadiancow wrong, or left any revenue on the table. The only way AC could 'improve' this for themselves would be to, in their next 'contract' with Aeroplan, negotiate a tightening of the waitlisting policy and/or rules for AP J redemptions.