Sep 19, 2017, 10:25 am
Last edit by: 24left
Jan 18 2021 TC issues Airworthiness Directive for the 737 MAX
Link to post https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/32976892-post4096.html
Cabin photos
Post 976 https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/29534462-post976.html
Post 1300 https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/29780203-post1300.html
Cabin Layout
Interior Specs can be found here https://www.aircanada.com/ca/en/aco/home/fly/onboard/fleet.html
- Window seats may feel narrower to come as the armrests are placed "into" the "curvature" of the cabin.
- Seats with no windows feel even more narrower as there is no space created by the curvature of window.
- All bulkhead seats have very limited legroom.
- Seats 15A, 16A, 16F, 17A and 17F have limited windows.
- Exit rows 19 and 20 have more legroom than regular preferred seats.
Routes
The 737 MAX is designated to replace the A320-series. Based on announcements and schedule updates, the following specific routes will be operated by the 737 MAX in future:
YYZ-LAX (periodic flights)
YYZ-SNN (new route)
YUL-DUB (new route)
YYZ/YUL-KEF (replacing Rouge A319)
YYT-LHR (replacing Mainline A319)
YHZ-LHR (replacing Mainline B767)
Hawaii Routes YVR/YYC (replacing Rouge B767)
Many domestic trunk routes (YYZ, YVR, YUL, YYC) now operated by 7M8, replacing A320 family
Link to post https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/32976892-post4096.html
Cabin photos
Post 976 https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/29534462-post976.html
Post 1300 https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/29780203-post1300.html
Cabin Layout
Interior Specs can be found here https://www.aircanada.com/ca/en/aco/home/fly/onboard/fleet.html
- Window seats may feel narrower to come as the armrests are placed "into" the "curvature" of the cabin.
- Seats with no windows feel even more narrower as there is no space created by the curvature of window.
- All bulkhead seats have very limited legroom.
- Seats 15A, 16A, 16F, 17A and 17F have limited windows.
- Exit rows 19 and 20 have more legroom than regular preferred seats.
Routes
The 737 MAX is designated to replace the A320-series. Based on announcements and schedule updates, the following specific routes will be operated by the 737 MAX in future:
YYZ-LAX (periodic flights)
YYZ-SNN (new route)
YUL-DUB (new route)
YYZ/YUL-KEF (replacing Rouge A319)
YYT-LHR (replacing Mainline A319)
YHZ-LHR (replacing Mainline B767)
Hawaii Routes YVR/YYC (replacing Rouge B767)
Many domestic trunk routes (YYZ, YVR, YUL, YYC) now operated by 7M8, replacing A320 family
Air Canada Selects Boeing 737 MAX to Renew Mainline Narrowbody Fleet
Apr 2, 2019, 5:53 pm
#2312
Original Member
Join Date: May 1998
Location: Vancouver, Canada
Posts: 6,222
What?!?! You didn't quote me? Well I never.....
I'm pretty certain you have sat in some of my training sessions where I have described redundancy with a (supposedly) Confucian saying:
"A man with a clock knows what time it is. A man with two clocks is never certain."
(And another nugget: "Two men say they're Jesus... one of them must be wrong.")
Apr 2, 2019, 6:46 pm
#2313
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: Halifax
Programs: AC SE100K, Marriott Lifetime Platinum Elite. NEXUS
Posts: 4,568
Two things went wrong. The thing that went wrong and whatever allowed that latent problem to, as we geeks say, "ship".
The bug could be just a bug. A trivial fix, and I'm prepared to accept (and even be comforted!) that a 6 month testing and certification process is needed for the most trivial of fixes. Or it could be a problem that a bean counter ordered the airframe engineers to skip over, and software developers to implement - a massive conspiracy on a scale that makes Volkswagen emissions scandal look like a minor April Fools prank.
I don't particularly care about the bug being fixed. Or even that a conspiring bean counter got one thing through. I care about the regulatory framework and corporate culture that allowed just one thing through.
Apr 2, 2019, 7:15 pm
#2314
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: YYZ
Programs: AC SEMM / HH Diamond
Posts: 3,162
@canopus27
i have no evidence to predict other latent defects, but you have none either. My forward looking assertion is based on changing only one variable ie MCAS repair, while your assessment suggests an infinite number of unknown future defects...so which of us is closer to reality - too early to tell I suppose.
But let’s assume you are right - which means you will never fly MAX again by your logic regardless of what is said about any fix, and you would therefore also go out and argue with regulators to de-certify the aircraft...if your’ concerned for public safety and the MAX falling on your head (of course stay safe always)
Either the aircraft can remain certified or NOT...no middle ground here...
i have no evidence to predict other latent defects, but you have none either. My forward looking assertion is based on changing only one variable ie MCAS repair, while your assessment suggests an infinite number of unknown future defects...so which of us is closer to reality - too early to tell I suppose.
But let’s assume you are right - which means you will never fly MAX again by your logic regardless of what is said about any fix, and you would therefore also go out and argue with regulators to de-certify the aircraft...if your’ concerned for public safety and the MAX falling on your head (of course stay safe always)
Either the aircraft can remain certified or NOT...no middle ground here...
You write above, talking about me,
let’s assume you are right - which means you will never fly MAX again by your logic regardless of what is said about any fix, and you would therefore also go out and argue with regulators to de-certify the aircraft
is there a latent problem with the wiring or system that receives the sensor data? I dunno
By all means you should hold (and state) your own beliefs. Please just be careful when rephrasing the beliefs of others.
Apr 2, 2019, 8:01 pm
#2315
Join Date: May 2004
Programs: aeroplan
Posts: 375
Yeah, that's essentially what you said when the planes crashed. You were wrong. And since then the evidence that has emerged would give every reason to question some of Boeing's decisions about the Max.
Apr 2, 2019, 8:41 pm
#2316
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Ideally YOW, but probably not
Programs: AC SE*MM
Posts: 1,826
MCAS as it was implemented would be akin to buying a car that forces the steering wheel into a hard turn at highway speeds if a single wheel/sensor/camera is blocked or malfunctions. The car has multiple sensors that could have been averaged but JUST THE FAULTY ONE was used.
Last edited by RatherBeInYOW; Apr 2, 2019 at 9:04 pm Reason: Edit: Sigh.
Apr 2, 2019, 9:04 pm
#2317
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Ideally YOW, but probably not
Programs: AC SE*MM
Posts: 1,826
I am not a pilot and don't claim to be super knowledgeable in this area. However, I have done a simulator course at British Airways Flight Training at LHR and was instructed by a senior BA pilot. When hand flying the 747-400, it can be manual everything. It was particularly demonstrated to me how the weight of the controls changes as the trim gets further away from an ideal set point and how to change the trim manually. It was easy to feel the difference when the trim was changed. I don't know if you consider a 747-400 a "modern airliner", but it is in current commercial service and does not necessary have auto trim on at all times, regardless of the state of autopilot being on or off.
Apr 3, 2019, 4:27 am
#2319
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: Mississauga Ontario
Posts: 4,103
I'll just toss this into the cesspool.
Heaven forbid that us non-engineering, non-pilot passengers should question the sancticty of the design and operating process of the Max.
https://www.cnn.com/2019/04/03/afric...ntl/index.html
Heaven forbid that us non-engineering, non-pilot passengers should question the sancticty of the design and operating process of the Max.
Ethiopian Airlines pilots followed Boeing's emergency procedures before crash: report
https://www.cnn.com/2019/04/03/afric...ntl/index.html
Apr 3, 2019, 6:34 am
#2320
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Ideally YOW, but probably not
Programs: AC SE*MM
Posts: 1,826
Apr 3, 2019, 8:48 am
#2325
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: Halifax
Programs: AC SE100K, Marriott Lifetime Platinum Elite. NEXUS
Posts: 4,568
@skybluesea: how many crashes of a particular aircraft type would you need for that types airworthiness to be suspect? How many before you look into the type and not just however many incidents got you there? How many before you would ground the fleet?