Dash-8 replace, repair or simply clean up

Old Sep 16, 13, 1:25 pm
  #1  
Original Poster
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 283
Dash-8 replace, repair or simply clean up

Most recent flight on a Dash-8 YYC-YEG, there was a sizable crack on an interior ceiling panel (say 2 ft long, very noticable). There were a few plane is cracking up joke among the PAXs which I didnt enjoy at all.

I know that the Dash-8s are 24-30 yrs. old, may be not quite obsolete but based on the broken pieces I have seen in the planes (air vents, lights, frayed carpets, cracked interior windows); they are probably over due for an overhaul or at least a deep cleaning.

If you ever fly on one of these beauties, take your cocktail napkin, wet it slightly and wipe it over any surface, say the seat back of the chair in front and look at the colour of the napkin afterwards. You will then understand why I say a deep cleaning is desirable.

As a YEGer, flying to other northern communities on a Dash-8 is an everyday reality, just wondering if there is any rumour that AC will replace these beauties and what with. I personally dont mind the Q-400s but I have no idea what other products may be available for these short-haul routes.
Qster is offline  
Old Sep 16, 13, 2:39 pm
  #2  
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 437
The DH1/3s are proving a complicated puzzle. QK has about 3 years before the first DH1 hits it's limit on the number of cycles (take offs and landings), and needs to be retired.

The issue is that there is no aircraft on the market that can replace it on a one to one basis. Bombardier will only build Q400s, the Q1/2/300 lines are all shut down. There is the ATR42, however that would be adding significant costs as it would be a totally new type for QK, as well as a logistical headache, as many of the hub airports arnt set up for rear door boarding.

There is a STC (supplemental type certificate) avaliable for the DH1/3 to further extend their lives, however costs a significant amount of money, and requires the plane to be out of service for a while.

It seems that the two main options are more Q400s, however that would (likely IMHO) lead to frequency cuts, especially for some of the smaller destinations.

Option number 2 would be to modify the current DH1/3 fleet to extend their lives, which would include cabin modifications/refreshing.
AC681 is online now  
Old Sep 16, 13, 5:24 pm
  #3  
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: YYZ; AC SE MM * UA PP * BA G * DL SM MM * HH Diamond * Marriott Lifetime Titanium * Accor Platinum * Queen's 92
Posts: 5,933
Aren't ATRs a non-option because of the icing on the wings issue in northern climates that brought down the aircraft near CVG in the early 1990s?
Simon is offline  
Old Sep 16, 13, 5:28 pm
  #4  
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 309
Originally Posted by Simon View Post
Aren't ATRs a non-option because of the icing on the wings issue in northern climates that brought down the aircraft near CVG in the early 1990s?
First Air runs 42s into the far north everyday....
BMGfan is offline  
Old Sep 16, 13, 5:38 pm
  #5  
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: YYZ most of the time
Programs: AC SE100K MM, UA*1K, Princess Elite
Posts: 3,823
Originally Posted by Simon View Post
Aren't ATRs a non-option because of the icing on the wings issue in northern climates that brought down the aircraft near CVG in the early 1990s?
There was an AD issued to fix it for flight into known icing conditions. AE (American Eagle) decided it was cheaper and easier to just move all of their fleet to SJU/MIA (now just SJU I believe) than to fix it.
yyz_atc_qq is offline  
Old Sep 16, 13, 5:41 pm
  #6  
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: YYZ most of the time
Programs: AC SE100K MM, UA*1K, Princess Elite
Posts: 3,823
and for what it's worth it was the ATR-72 that had the issue in Indiana, not a 42, and the 72s had the icing boot mod.
yyz_atc_qq is offline  
Old Sep 16, 13, 7:45 pm
  #7  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: YYZ
Programs: AC*SE MM, SD Gold, SPG Gold
Posts: 12,982
My guess is that the -100 will be with us for a long time based on lack of suitable alternatives in that size range, so they will eventually be refurbished and life extended. They could be the future DC-3 if the airframe can stand up.

-300 will get gradually phased out for Q400's.
The Lev is offline  
Old Sep 16, 13, 8:00 pm
  #8  
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: YYZ/YUL
Programs: UA 1K, AC nadda, DL, WS-Nadda
Posts: 1,475
The DHC8s are undergoing an overhaul program at Downsview that will extend their service lives for a good many years.
yul36 is offline  
Old Sep 16, 13, 8:00 pm
  #9  
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 286
Admittedly, I know nothing about these things - but why isn't the CRJ a suitable replacement? Don't they both have capacities ~ 50 (at least some models do). And they're jets too!
Acnyyz is offline  
Old Sep 16, 13, 8:07 pm
  #10  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: YYC
Posts: 21,584
Originally Posted by Acnyyz View Post
Admittedly, I know nothing about these things - but why isn't the CRJ a suitable replacement? Don't they both have capacities ~ 50 (at least some models do). And they're jets too!
Jets are distinctly less efficient. Poor economics.
Stranger is offline  
Old Sep 16, 13, 8:16 pm
  #11  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Feb 2000
Posts: 11,902
Originally Posted by Acnyyz View Post
Admittedly, I know nothing about these things - but why isn't the CRJ a suitable replacement? Don't they both have capacities ~ 50 (at least some models do). And they're jets too!
CRJ a/c are not good in winter weather like snow and ice. The DH8 is an amazing a/c with snow and ice, either in the air or on the runway. STOL capabilities add to that as well.

The cleaning OP is speaking to was very evident on a Sunday YYZ/YSB DH8 a/c. It was filthy
acysb87 is offline  
Old Sep 16, 13, 8:32 pm
  #12  
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 309
Originally Posted by acysb87 View Post
CRJ a/c are not good in winter weather like snow and ice. The DH8 is an amazing a/c with snow and ice, either in the air or on the runway. STOL capabilities add to that as well.
A couple winters ago we had a CRJ stuck here in YZF for almost a week....because it was -40c....

The CRJ 200 isn't rated for below -40...it was a rather big deal here at the time as all AC flights were cancelled for that week.
BMGfan is offline  
Old Sep 16, 13, 8:47 pm
  #13  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: YYC
Posts: 21,584
Originally Posted by acysb87 View Post
CRJ a/c are not good in winter weather like snow and ice. The DH8 is an amazing a/c with snow and ice, either in the air or on the runway. STOL capabilities add to that as well.
While the Dash-8 only requires a relatively short runway, real STOL was the four-engined Dash-7, which the 8 is a derivative of.

I still think the key issue is the jet poor efficiency over short range routes.
Stranger is offline  
Old Sep 16, 13, 8:56 pm
  #14  
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: YEG
Programs: AC: Ac*A, , Nexus: Expired
Posts: 1,447
Originally Posted by acysb87 View Post
CRJ a/c are not good in winter weather like snow and ice. The DH8 is an amazing a/c with snow and ice, either in the air or on the runway. STOL capabilities add to that as well.

The cleaning OP is speaking to was very evident on a Sunday YYZ/YSB DH8 a/c. It was filthy
In all fairness to Jazz, a deep cleaning to the DH8 might cause them to disappear. They are like a used pillow - after certain point there is more grime and bacteria than pillow...
danapop is offline  
Old Sep 16, 13, 8:59 pm
  #15  
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 437
Jets use a tonne more fuel then the dashes. For example, the Q400 uses the same amount of fuel as a CRJ100/200 however can take 24 more people.

Further problem CRJ 100/200 isn't being built anymore either
AC681 is online now  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread