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-   -   Realistic scheduling? (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/air-canada-aeroplan/1348013-realistic-scheduling.html)

JimYUL May 19, 12 8:17 pm

Realistic scheduling?
 
I'm guessing this has to do with "Gate times", but why does AC not under promise and over deliver on some of it's sched times?

AC 111 (YUL-YVR) is on average, 30+ mins late. I cite this just as an example, there are many, many more. Why not just post the arrival time to reflect the usual reality?

Seriously, I'm curious about this.

jlisi984 May 19, 12 8:29 pm

Same thing for YYC-YYZ - always 10 minutes or so late, never perfectly on-time or early. :confused:

calligow May 19, 12 10:40 pm

It is due to time dilation as predicted by Einstein's relativistic theory.

When you are scheduled to arrive at let's say 1:40pm, it is with reference to the passenger's clock which is traveling with the plane.

However, because the plane is moving so fast, the stationary ground clock runs faster than your clock. Thus, the observed difference, i.e. you "appear" to be 10 mins late.

The solution is, obviously, to take time dilation into account and adjust the arrival time accordingly.

As a side note, it has been experimentally shown by independent observers that booze might also induce time dilation effect ;)

Sopwith May 19, 12 10:58 pm


Originally Posted by calligow (Post 18607774)
It is due to time dilation as predicted by Einstein's relativistic theory.

Einstein also predicted that the dilation effect is only noticeable as you approach the speed of light. The only thing I have ever seen AC do at even half the speed of light is post your charges to your credit card account.

calligow May 20, 12 12:09 am


Originally Posted by Sopwith (Post 18607838)
Einstein also predicted that the dilation effect is only noticeable as you approach the speed of light. The only thing I have ever seen AC do at even half the speed of light is post your charges to your credit card account.

... and setting R=0 at T-8 if I may add

Sopwith May 20, 12 12:29 am


Originally Posted by calligow (Post 18608024)
... and setting R=0 at T-8 if I may add

Right. Forgot about that one.

JimYUL May 20, 12 6:42 am

Ahhhh, now I get it ;)

JimYUL May 20, 12 6:45 am

On a more serious note, would anyone from AC care to comment? Really, I am curious and want to know why the obvious, common sense approach isn't being applied on some of these routes. Why set yourself up for missed connections and customer complaints?

TimMinYYZ May 20, 12 7:46 am

Pure speculation on my part, but maybe determining the gate-to-gate time to be published in the schedule isn't just a case of looking at actual experience and taking the average or median. Maybe there's some marketing that gets added in to the mix. And maybe it's a delicate balance between wanting to tell pax they'll get there quickly on the one hand, and boasting on-time performance, on the other.

Having said that, personally I'd think that on-time performance is a much more important competitive advantage than length of flight. If I'm flying YUL-YVR and AC says it will get me there 30 minutes faster than WS, then all other things being equal (which they never are) I would choose AC, but if AC's on-time performance is 50% and WS's is 95%, I might well choose WS, especially if I were connecting at the YVR end.

If any of this holds any water, you'd still need to wonder how many people actually pay attention to the on-time performance number when buying tix.

Bottom line, I'm with the OP. Better to be realistic in the schedule. Especially to avoid cranky pax who miss connections at the arrival end.

hearna May 20, 12 7:47 am

One thing I noticed that LH does on my recent 6 flights with them, that AC never does, is respect the boarding time. LH sometimes starts the boarding process even before the posted time, where AC seems to always wait untill the last minute. I believe this is part of the issue. Another, may just be how they schedule ground crew... perhalps they have the same last minute approach to getting the luggage and cargo on board. On a recent YYZ-YOW we where 40 minutes late leaving as the captain informed us multiple times, I still have the main cargo door open. I watched them arrive with the last container at T+30 minutes and put it in. Not sure what billiant tool couldnt wait for the next flight which at that point was only 30 minutes away...

Perhalps if Airports in Canada where more harsh on the dept/arrival slots and finned AC for every late arrival and departure; they would actualy set this issue as a priority and find out what is causing so many delays.

However, with the company bleeding cash like it is, I think they have other concerns ATM; like finding new ways of pissing off its passengers and staff.

global happy traveller May 20, 12 7:48 am

perhaps it will be more realistic if they start boarding on time (as per the boarding card), rather than waiting another 10-15 mins after that time to commence boarding.

hearna May 20, 12 7:49 am


Originally Posted by global_happy_traveller (Post 18609008)
perhaps it will be more realistic if they start boarding on time (as per the boarding card), rather than waiting another 10-15 mins after that time to commence boarding.

1 min too late GHT :P

ACflyerDE May 20, 12 9:24 am


Originally Posted by global_happy_traveller (Post 18609008)
perhaps it will be more realistic if they start boarding on time (as per the boarding card), rather than waiting another 10-15 mins after that time to commence boarding.

For flights ex FRA this would mean that boarding would start 30-40 mins. earlier than usual...

hearna May 20, 12 10:32 am


Originally Posted by ACflyerDE (Post 18609323)
For flights ex FRA this would mean that boarding would start 30-40 mins. earlier than usual...

And that is what they do... our MUC-YUL flight started boarding on time, but the push back was delayed by 30 minutes as they did not start earlier then the time indicated on the boarding cards and we where stuck at one of those stupid Bus Gates; waiting for 3 pax who showed up at the very last minute (boarding wise) but had to wait for the bus.

guessaaa May 20, 12 11:16 am

AC likes to maintain that the flight is on time when the inbound aircraft hasn't arrived by the boarding time. Only at departure time will they admit the flight is late when said aircraft is pulling up to the gate.


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