Mini RTW Questions

Old Sep 17, 2014, 6:37 am
  #3196  
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Originally Posted by zoobtoob
Backtracking question:
I'm going to book this tomorrow morning:
YVR-NRT-CTS/CTS-HND-MUC-LUX/GVA-ZRH-YUL-YVR

Now, I'm planning on watching regularly for non-LH or NH to open up on TYO-Europe and hopefully get a refund on some YQ; will this trigger "backtracking" because of the double stop in ZRH if I grab LX161?
If so, I can also opt for the last segment as GVA-FRA-SFO-YVR but then I would have to ride UA's rickety old 747. Thoughts?
CTS being your destination - you will be allowed 6540 on TPAC, but a whopping 14485 TATL. One way to get back to Europe you may look at is CTS-PEK-Europe. Scamcharge free, and CA has a very decent biz product.

I am not sure you are allowed an open jaw/ground segment in the middle of your return (LUX/GVA). I thought Aeroplan has told me open jaws can only be at the destination/origin.
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Old Sep 17, 2014, 6:43 am
  #3197  
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Originally Posted by rankourabu
CTS being your destination - you will be allowed 6540 on TPAC, but a whopping 14485 TATL. One way to get back to Europe you may look at is CTS-PEK-Europe. Scamcharge free, and CA has a very decent biz product.

I am not sure you are allowed an open jaw/ground segment in the middle of your return (LUX/GVA). I thought Aeroplan has told me open jaws can only be at the destination/origin.
Open jaws in the middle are not allowed. He will need to fly that segment.
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Old Sep 17, 2014, 7:13 am
  #3198  
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Originally Posted by Pseudo Nim
Open jaws in the middle are not allowed. He will need to fly that segment.
Thats what I thought, thanks for the confirmation ^
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Old Sep 17, 2014, 7:35 am
  #3199  
 
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Originally Posted by rankourabu
. One way to get back to Europe you may look at is CTS-PEK-Europe. Scamcharge free, and CA has a very decent biz product.
CA is currently not bookable. The AE agent I spoke with yesterday told me that according to the memo she read CA awards have been down since September 8. They are working on fixing the issue...no estimate of when the issue will be resolved.
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Old Sep 17, 2014, 7:56 am
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Originally Posted by Pseudo Nim
Open jaws in the middle are not allowed. He will need to fly that segment.
There's conflicting opinions on this forum about that. I'm not clear on what the actual rule is. One opposing view is the Open Jaws can be in the middle, but that takes up one of the allowable stopovers. I have a ticketed itinerary which has an OJ in the middle:

YYZ-TPE-HAN/SGN-BKK-KBV(stop)KBV-BKK-ICN-PEK-YYZ

I'm pretty sure KBV is my POT, but my OJ is between HAN and SGN.
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Old Sep 17, 2014, 9:39 am
  #3201  
 
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Valid routing?

Can anybody comment if this is a valid mini-RTW routing? The AP agent I spoke to said it looked valid to him, but the system was having problems with the sectors leaving Australia. Even he couldn't understand what was the issue.

YVR-SFO-LAX (stop)
LAX-ICN-SYD (open jaw)
BNE-BKK-CDG (stop)
CDG-YUL-YVR

Any thoughts? Thanks.
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Old Sep 17, 2014, 9:51 am
  #3202  
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Originally Posted by ChrisA330
There's conflicting opinions on this forum about that. I'm not clear on what the actual rule is. One opposing view is the Open Jaws can be in the middle, but that takes up one of the allowable stopovers. I have a ticketed itinerary which has an OJ in the middle:

YYZ-TPE-HAN/SGN-BKK-KBV(stop)KBV-BKK-ICN-PEK-YYZ

I'm pretty sure KBV is my POT, but my OJ is between HAN and SGN.
Nah. The rule is definitive and I don't think there's any two ways about it, unfortunately. Your case is a slightly grey area, but here's why it works:

- YYZ-HAN MPM5/AT = 12,666
- YYZ-SGN MPM5/AT = 13,076
- YYZ-KBV MPM5/AT = 13,034

So although HAN is closer, SGN is further; so I guess if either part of the OJ falls beyond the real 'stop', then it becomes the POT and the OJ becomes legal. Certainly, this is a really niche situation.
Originally Posted by YVR guy
Can anybody comment if this is a valid mini-RTW routing? The AP agent I spoke to said it looked valid to him, but the system was having problems with the sectors leaving Australia. Even he couldn't understand what was the issue.

YVR-SFO-LAX (stop)
LAX-ICN-SYD (open jaw)
BNE-BKK-CDG (stop)
CDG-YUL-YVR

Any thoughts? Thanks.
There is no MPM or published routing for BNE-YVR over the Atlantic, so I guess that's why. You should have gotten him to try forcing it to ticket because that'd be a totally wild itinerary.
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Old Sep 17, 2014, 10:01 am
  #3203  
 
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Originally Posted by Pseudo Nim
Nah. The rule is definitive and I don't think there's any two ways about it, unfortunately. Your case is a slightly grey area, but here's why it works:

- YYZ-HAN MPM5/AT = 12,666
- YYZ-SGN MPM5/AT = 13,076
- YYZ-KBV MPM5/AT = 13,034

So although HAN is closer, SGN is further; so I guess if either part of the OJ falls beyond the real 'stop', then it becomes the POT and the OJ becomes legal. Certainly, this is a really niche situation.
Isn't the destination or point of turnaround based on the furthest point of the itinerary and no by which has the highest MPM? If it is the former, it's KBV. If it's the latter, I've just learned something completely new.

http://www.gcmap.com/mapui?P=yyz-han,+yyz-sgn,+yyz-kbv
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Old Sep 17, 2014, 10:08 am
  #3204  
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Originally Posted by ChrisA330
Isn't the destination or point of turnaround based on the furthest point of the itinerary and no by which has the highest MPM? If it is the former, it's KBV. If it's the latter, I've just learned something completely new.

http://www.gcmap.com/mapui?P=yyz-han,+yyz-sgn,+yyz-kbv
Honestly, I thought it was the furthest away point, which, in your case, would indeed be KBV. Then I went to check MPM, and came up with those results. I therefore infer that the "furthest away" might be by MPM rather than GCMap, since agents have no idea where the cities are, and do not know GCMap or anything similar.

Last edited by Pseudo Nim; Sep 17, 2014 at 11:15 am
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Old Sep 17, 2014, 10:32 am
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Originally Posted by ChrisA330
There's conflicting opinions on this forum about that. I'm not clear on what the actual rule is. One opposing view is the Open Jaws can be in the middle, but that takes up one of the allowable stopovers. I have a ticketed itinerary which has an OJ in the middle:

YYZ-TPE-HAN/SGN-BKK-KBV(stop)KBV-BKK-ICN-PEK-YYZ

I'm pretty sure KBV is my POT, but my OJ is between HAN and SGN.
The definition of open jaw is industry standard, must be at destination or origin. AP may choose to ignore/overlook it.
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Old Sep 17, 2014, 10:54 am
  #3206  
 
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YVR-HND NH J
HND-CTS NH Y
STOP
CTS-TPE BR Y
TPE-CDG BR J
O/J
GVA-ZRH LX J
ZRH-YUL LX J
YUL-YVR AC J

$425.01 and 105000 AP
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Old Sep 17, 2014, 11:15 am
  #3207  
 
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I am planning ahead a trip originating in Europe, going to Asia and back to Europe via Canada (YYC a must stop).
Trying for 2 stops in Asia: choice of NRT, HKG, TPE, ICN.
I am looking at most optimum routing, cost, time, carriers. Any ideas or maybe personal experiences?
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Old Sep 17, 2014, 11:15 am
  #3208  
 
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Originally Posted by zoobtoob
YVR-HND NH J
HND-CTS NH Y
STOP
CTS-TPE BR Y
TPE-CDG BR J
O/J
GVA-ZRH LX J
ZRH-YUL LX J
YUL-YVR AC J

$425.01 and 105000 AP
You have a stop in Asia1, but Europe2 AP point cost ... How did you pull that off?
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Old Sep 17, 2014, 11:16 am
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Originally Posted by beep88
AP may choose to ignore/overlook it.
Which is what the discussion in this thread is about. Frankly, I don't care what the industry definition is, only what AP's rules are.
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Old Sep 17, 2014, 11:17 am
  #3210  
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Originally Posted by Eternity000
You have a stop in Asia1, but Europe2 AP point cost ... How did you pull that off?
I guess the agent (or the system?) saw CDG as the POT, rather than HND, which makes sense as it's further away.
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