Mini RTW Questions

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Old Oct 16, 13, 12:39 pm
  #1801  
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: YYZ
Programs: AC35K, SPG/MR Plat
Posts: 331
Some change in plans...

Would this work?

YYZ-(via TPE on BR)-HKG(STOP)-PEK(STOP)-NRT(STOP)-YYZ

Would they consider HKG as the POT or PEK?

If we're doing a Beijing/Xian tour, is there a way to fit in the Xian-Beijing leg in there with points or does that have to be bought separately? Flight from Beijing to Xian is part of tour costs.

Last edited by Globex; Oct 16, 13 at 1:10 pm
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Old Oct 16, 13, 5:29 pm
  #1802  
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Montreal, Canada
Programs: SPG Platium, PC Ambassador & Platium, Aeroplan Elite
Posts: 101
Originally Posted by tng11 View Post
To answer your questions in order:
- Yes
- Yes
- Yes, CA is your only choice for this one.
- No, OZ does not have the QS seat on ORD-ICN. They operate the QS seat out of LAX and JFK for certain (not sure about SFO after the accident.)

If you can get the 773 on CA from PEK-LAX it's going to be a decent seat, lie-flat and no scamcharges.

I'd recommend the following itinerary for you (should be minimal scamcharges)

Dec 2: AC429 YUL-YYZ
Dec 3: BR35 YYZ-TPE (2.5 hr layover)
Dec 4: BR712 TPE-PVG (4 hr layover)

?: PVG-CTU (CA)
?: CTU-HKG (CA)

Dec 29: CA1354 SYX-PEK (5 hr layover)
Dec 29: CA983 PEK-LAX (6 hr layover)
Dec 29: AC771 LAX-YUL

(Unfortunately, Dec 1-3 I couldn't find YUL-ZRH-PVG on LX, nor could I find PEK-ZRH-YUL on the 29/30)
Thanks you for your suggestion.

I have the exact itinerary planned, is CA983 the lie flat seat you recommend?

For PVG to HKG, I am thinking using EVA to do PVG-TPE-HKG

On Dec 29th and 30th, basically not much choices that I can pick from. The layover in PEK and LAX is a killer

If I take the above suggestion, it looks like this.

YUL-YYZ-TPE-PVG STOP
PVG-TPE-HKG Open Jaw
SYX-PEK-LAX-YUL

Does this mean I can add an extra stop in either ICN or TPE from PVG if I want to because I am doing open jaw to SYX?
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Old Oct 16, 13, 7:10 pm
  #1803  
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: YYZ
Programs: AC35K, SPG/MR Plat
Posts: 331
Originally Posted by Wallease View Post
Thanks you for your suggestion.

I have the exact itinerary planned, is CA983 the lie flat seat you recommend?

For PVG to HKG, I am thinking using EVA to do PVG-TPE-HKG

On Dec 29th and 30th, basically not much choices that I can pick from. The layover in PEK and LAX is a killer

If I take the above suggestion, it looks like this.

YUL-YYZ-TPE-PVG STOP
PVG-TPE-HKG Open Jaw
SYX-PEK-LAX-YUL

Does this mean I can add an extra stop in either ICN or TPE from PVG if I want to because I am doing open jaw to SYX?
I'm trying to clarify this point as well in the FAQ thread, but from the FAQ, it seems that the origin point of your 2nd part of the Open Jaw is considered your one allowable stop.

So YUL-PVG // SYX-YUL and any >24hr layovers in between is what you can do. You won't be able to stop in PVG and Open Jaw in HKG//SYX.

If I'm wrong, somebody please correct me (and hopefully, I'm wrong, because I may want to do something similar )
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Old Oct 16, 13, 8:09 pm
  #1804  
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: YYZ
Posts: 1,655
Originally Posted by Wallease View Post
Thanks you for your suggestion.

I have the exact itinerary planned, is CA983 the lie flat seat you recommend?

For PVG to HKG, I am thinking using EVA to do PVG-TPE-HKG

On Dec 29th and 30th, basically not much choices that I can pick from. The layover in PEK and LAX is a killer

If I take the above suggestion, it looks like this.

YUL-YYZ-TPE-PVG STOP
PVG-TPE-HKG Open Jaw
SYX-PEK-LAX-YUL

Does this mean I can add an extra stop in either ICN or TPE from PVG if I want to because I am doing open jaw to SYX?
CA983 should be the lie-flat seat.

You cannot do PVG-TPE-HKG. You would be stopping twice in TPE on the way to HKG and that's not allowed. CA does not fly direct.

MPM5 for YUL-HKG is 10254. You can do:

YUL-YYZ-TPE-PVG STOP
PVG-ICN-HKG Open Jaw
SYX-PEK-LAX-YUL

PVG-ICN-HKG will probably be on OZ metal which incurs YQ. You can time as close to a 24 hour connection, but that's the maximum you can stay in ICN for it to count as a connection.

And it's one stopover, one open jaw only. PVG can be your only stop here.
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Old Oct 16, 13, 8:54 pm
  #1805  
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: YYZ
Programs: AC35K, SPG/MR Plat
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Originally Posted by tng11 View Post
CA983 should be the lie-flat seat.

You cannot do PVG-TPE-HKG. You would be stopping twice in TPE on the way to HKG and that's not allowed. CA does not fly direct.

MPM5 for YUL-HKG is 10254. You can do:

YUL-YYZ-TPE-PVG STOP
PVG-ICN-HKG Open Jaw
SYX-PEK-LAX-YUL

PVG-ICN-HKG will probably be on OZ metal which incurs YQ. You can time as close to a 24 hour connection, but that's the maximum you can stay in ICN for it to count as a connection.

And it's one stopover, one open jaw only. PVG can be your only stop here.
So you're allowed a stop at PVG and a stop at HKG for the Open Jaw?

Because the FAQ mentioned you could do NYC-SIN(STOP)//NRT(STOP)-NYC, but not NYC-MAD(STOP)-SIN(STOP)//NRT(STOP)-NYC since NRT is considered a stop even though it's the origin point for the Open Jaw?

From what you're describing above, he'd be doing (shortened): YUL-PVG(STOP)-HKG(STOP)//SYX(STOP)-YUL

Am I misunderstanding something from the FAQ or has something changed recently? Sorry if it's a stupid question...
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Old Oct 16, 13, 9:17 pm
  #1806  
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: YYZ
Posts: 1,655
Originally Posted by Globex View Post
From what you're describing above, he'd be doing (shortened): YUL-PVG(STOP)-HKG(STOP)//SYX(STOP)-YUL

Am I misunderstanding something from the FAQ or has something changed recently? Sorry if it's a stupid question...
SYX is not a stop, it's where he's departing on the open jaw. Might be poorly written FAQ as stopping in MAD on the way to SIN and ending the open jaw in NRT without any more intermediate stops to NYC is 100% allowed, subject to MPM.
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Old Oct 16, 13, 10:24 pm
  #1807  
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 2,187
Originally Posted by Globex View Post
Some change in plans...

Would this work?

YYZ-(via TPE on BR)-HKG(STOP)-PEK(STOP)-NRT(STOP)-YYZ

Would they consider HKG as the POT or PEK?

If we're doing a Beijing/Xian tour, is there a way to fit in the Xian-Beijing leg in there with points or does that have to be bought separately? Flight from Beijing to Xian is part of tour costs.
Yes
Whichever is furthest
Not with your three stops

Last edited by sp4294; Oct 16, 13 at 10:31 pm
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Old Oct 16, 13, 10:30 pm
  #1808  
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 2,187
Originally Posted by Wallease View Post
Thanks you for your suggestion.

I have the exact itinerary planned, is CA983 the lie flat seat you recommend?

For PVG to HKG, I am thinking using EVA to do PVG-TPE-HKG

On Dec 29th and 30th, basically not much choices that I can pick from. The layover in PEK and LAX is a killer

If I take the above suggestion, it looks like this.

YUL-YYZ-TPE-PVG STOP
PVG-TPE-HKG Open Jaw
SYX-PEK-LAX-YUL

Does this mean I can add an extra stop in either ICN or TPE from PVG if I want to because I am doing open jaw to SYX?
You need to fly PVG-HKG without TPE again
Without the OJ, you can add ICN after HKG, or fly through ICN instead of TPE before PVG

Last edited by sp4294; Oct 16, 13 at 10:35 pm
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Old Oct 16, 13, 10:41 pm
  #1809  
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 2,187
Originally Posted by aiminghigherYVR View Post
I too am looking to get to AKL next year in J which is getting really tough with NZ pulling out so much J availability and everything via HNL it seems. On top of that I'd like to stop in BKK.

On the Errorplan site I can book a R/T via the Pacific both ways for AKL
eg. YYZ-NRT-AKL
AKL-SIN-TPE-YYZ

I would think that's way over MPM (whatever it is for AKL) but the real problem is adding a stop in BKK. Suddenly it's invalid (online anyways).

Does anyone know if something like the following would be valid or have any other route suggestions. Obviously trying not to fly YQ airlines.

YYZ-NRT-AKL (stop or OJ)
AKL (or CHC)-SIN-BKK (stop)
BKK-TPE-YYZ

or

YYZ-ORD-NRT-AKL (to avoid AC)
AKL (or CHC)-SIN-BKK (stop)
BKK-TPE-YYZ

or
YYZ-NRT-AKL
AKL (or CHC)-SIN-BKK (stop)
BKK-IST-YYZ (or any route going via Atlantic)

Thanks for your help!
IIRC, these never work with SIN and BKK.
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Old Oct 16, 13, 11:17 pm
  #1810  
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: YYZ
Programs: AC-E50K, SPG Gold
Posts: 126
Originally Posted by sp4294 View Post
IIRC, these never work with SIN and BKK.
What about:
YYZ-NRT-AKL (stop)
AKL-SIN (stop)
SIN-TPE-YYZ

The website allows those 2 destinations as stops and shows this itinerary but you can only select the first 2 legs before the last one is no longer selectable. Above mpm I imagine. Anyone know if the itinerary is actually valid or not? Very frustrating as there are ZERO ways to get to AKL in J other than via Asia at this point.
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Old Oct 16, 13, 11:37 pm
  #1811  
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: YYZ
Posts: 1,655
Originally Posted by aiminghigherYVR View Post
What about:
YYZ-NRT-AKL (stop)
AKL-SIN (stop)
SIN-TPE-YYZ

The website allows those 2 destinations as stops and shows this itinerary but you can only select the first 2 legs before the last one is no longer selectable. Above mpm I imagine. Anyone know if the itinerary is actually valid or not? Very frustrating as there are ZERO ways to get to AKL in J other than via Asia at this point.
I wrangled with this back in August.

TPAC going back through SIN is not allowed unless you follow an SQ published routing (pointless because SQ doesn't release J from SIN-LAX/SFO.) This is because no matter how you structure it afterwards from SIN, it's way over MPM5 (10945)

If you can get direct (and direct only) NRT-YYZ on the return then that would work if you go TPAC.

I'm not sure if anyone has done YYZ-AKL via Europe before, as I don't see an MPM value TATL. YYZ-SYD works TATL and you get a generous MPM of 20,000 to work with.
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Old Oct 17, 13, 8:37 am
  #1812  
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Montreal, Canada
Programs: SPG Platium, PC Ambassador & Platium, Aeroplan Elite
Posts: 101
Originally Posted by tng11 View Post
CA983 should be the lie-flat seat.

You cannot do PVG-TPE-HKG. You would be stopping twice in TPE on the way to HKG and that's not allowed. CA does not fly direct.

MPM5 for YUL-HKG is 10254. You can do:

YUL-YYZ-TPE-PVG STOP
PVG-ICN-HKG Open Jaw
SYX-PEK-LAX-YUL

PVG-ICN-HKG will probably be on OZ metal which incurs YQ. You can time as close to a 24 hour connection, but that's the maximum you can stay in ICN for it to count as a connection.

And it's one stopover, one open jaw only. PVG can be your only stop here.
So the way I understand, because of the OPEN JAW, I am only allow 1 STOP, and 1 OPEN JAW, correct?

PVG to HKG, I think I read somewhere that you are allow to route back through TPE because it is a publish routing?

YUL-ZRH-PVG, YUL-YYZ-TPE-PVG, which route is better in terms of service, hard product?

Also ORD-ICN seems to be the smart Quartium seat as per below, worth to pay the scam charge? My brother works for OZ and got me to try it on my last trip, much better than the AC seat

http://efficientasianman.com/2013/06...artium-routes/

Thanks for all the answers! Learning something new all the time.
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Old Oct 17, 13, 9:50 am
  #1813  
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: YYZ
Programs: AC-E50K, SPG Gold
Posts: 126
Originally Posted by tng11 View Post
I wrangled with this back in August.

TPAC going back through SIN is not allowed unless you follow an SQ published routing (pointless because SQ doesn't release J from SIN-LAX/SFO.) This is because no matter how you structure it afterwards from SIN, it's way over MPM5 (10945)

If you can get direct (and direct only) NRT-YYZ on the return then that would work if you go TPAC.

I'm not sure if anyone has done YYZ-AKL via Europe before, as I don't see an MPM value TATL. YYZ-SYD works TATL and you get a generous MPM of 20,000 to work with.
Thanks for the info. Ya, I haven't seen any Mini RTW that reached AKL TATL. Other stops seem to work with a AKL-HNL-North America routing but dunno why NZ has pulled all availability on that route.

Although I'm still wondering if I can make it work TATL since my POT is actually SIN I think. Something like
YYZ-NRT-AKL (stop)
AKL-SIN direct (stop)
SIN-CPH/IST-YYZ

Still not bookable online. I did this kind of MiniRTW last year with SYD but I'm seeing no saver award availability on a TPAC routing on UA LAX/SFO-SYD in J either. Ugh.
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Old Oct 17, 13, 10:32 am
  #1814  
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: YYZ
Posts: 1,655
Just from looking at that I'd guess its way over MPM for YYZ-SIN.

What you could try is something like (or the reverse):

YYZ-CPH/IST-SIN-AKL-SYD and call SYD your point of turnaround, with a stop in SIN.

The return from SYD TPAC is more flexible but still severely restricted. I know the following work 100% without extra connections:
SYD-ICN-ORD-YYZ
SYD-PEK-YYZ

You can't do something like SYD-AKL-NRT-YYZ though. So you have to rule out NZ J long haul.
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Old Oct 17, 13, 12:23 pm
  #1815  
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: YYZ
Programs: AC35K, SPG/MR Plat
Posts: 331
Originally Posted by sp4294 View Post
Yes
Whichever is furthest
Not with your three stops
Thanks! So in terms of actual flights, I've gotten to this... not sure if better alternatives out there?

YYZ-TPE BR J
TPE-HKG BR J (STOP)
HKG-PEK CA Y (STOP...A321 morning flight, only F and no J)
PEK-NRT NH J (STOP...recommend 737 to NRT or 767 to HND? It seems recent flights use 787 so maybe it'll change to 787 closer to date?)

Returning to Toronto would either be:
If Saturday...
NRT-TPE BR J
TPE-YYZ BR J
If Sunday...(which one would be better?)
NRT-ORD NH J
ORD-YYZ AC J
-OR-
NRT-SFO UA J
SFO-YYZ AC J

Thank you so much to everybody for all of the help and clarifications, I think I'm pretty close to what I'd like, and it's pretty exciting! I'd have to wait until 330 days before to check availability on ANA/UA before booking right? I know AE can book 356 before but not all my flights show up there...
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