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Changes to your Qualification Period

Changes to your Qualification Period

Old Mar 8, 2024, 3:36 am
  #106  
 
Join Date: Mar 2024
Posts: 25
deleted (as I figured out how to quote!)

Last edited by huruburu; Mar 8, 2024 at 5:00 am
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Old Mar 8, 2024, 3:47 am
  #107  
 
Join Date: Mar 2024
Posts: 25
Originally Posted by firestarter197
Yeah it's a shame that it's the most loyal Conc flyers who are probably most hard done by. Like you said, I wouldn't rule out some additional gestures being made at a later stage, for me I'm just looking forward to a day where EI status goes beyond EI metal and it really starts to feel like being part of an alliance, as opposed to needing a 100% commitment to flights ticketed & marketed by a single airline to earn TCs.
I think the Green Tier members are also hard done by. I am customarily Silver but slipped back to Green on my anniversary last November. I was due to regain Silver in April or May, which I would then keep until November 2025 at least. Any member anticipating moving up a tier in the spring or summer is hard hit. Members with anniversaries late in the year are also hard hit. I'm in both categories. There is a world of difference between the civil, thoughtful BA Executive Club approach and the AerClub bludgeon. Maybe I should say club. I prefer to think of the members as the Club and I suppose this forum is an expression of that.

After the "Love, AerClub" announcement, in order not to entrust *anything* to these folks, I cut short an artist's residency and paid extra to travel back to Ireland in late March rather than early April. The Concierge phone line sounds great. i don't think I'll ever have that benefit but under the rules as they were when I planned my flights for this year, I would have been well positioned to reach Platinum by November 2025. Aer Lingus Customer Service staff, when you can finally get someone on the phone, are usually as helpful as they can be. But their sphere of operations seems to have shrunk (though I'm sure they work as hard as before, just maybe have access to less information).
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Old Mar 8, 2024, 4:39 am
  #108  
 
Join Date: Mar 2024
Posts: 25
deleted, still learning the ropes.

Last edited by huruburu; Mar 8, 2024 at 5:00 am
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Old Mar 8, 2024, 4:42 am
  #109  
 
Join Date: Mar 2024
Posts: 25
I've had a closer look at how British Airways Executive Club is approaching the challenge that AerClub is botching.

BA Executive Club has given members more than a year to plan for the change, which will take effect in April 2025. From the get-go they say, "Rest assured, we’ll make the change gradually, and you can continue to enjoy the benefits you’ve earned in our current Tier Point collection period."

They then go into great detail about how the change will be managed. For example, if your Tier Point period starts on 9 July 2023 and ends on 8 July 2024, it will reset on 9 July, 2024 and end on 31 March 2025 (instead of 8 July 2025). However, the Tier Points you earned between 1 April 2024 and 8 July 2024 *will be added* as a Tier Point adjustment. They then explain the process using each of the twelve months so that every member will have a clear idea of what will happen.

Yes it's complicated. That's because it has to be, if you take every member's benefit into account.

Key differences between British Airways EC and AerClub's management of the same problem:
  • BA Executive Club respects members' planning: past, present, and future. AerClub doesn't.
  • BA Executive Club makes sure that every member's interests are protected and every member has an opportunity to benefit as a result of the transition. AerClub doesn't.
  • BA Executive Club communicates clearly and thoughtfully, giving month-by-month examples over a 3 year period for how the process will play out according to your anniversary date. AerClub doesn't.
According to my understanding of the announcements
  • BA Executive Club isn't taking more than a year longer because they're dragging their heels: that's how long it takes to do the job seamlessly, correctly, and to the benefit of all, probably at a cost to BA.
  • AerClub recklessly announces they will do the job in a month. It won't be done well. However, individual members rather than AerClub will bear the cost.
A core issue concerns the loss of assets (e.g., tier credits, early promotion to another tier). This translates to hard cash. AerClub's approach is a breach of trust. It messes members around. It's wasteful of members' time and money. Obviously AerClub is of some relevance to members. Obviously, whatever their level, members have some loyalty and maybe a long track record with Aer Lingus. Should we be hustling, puzzling, speculating, rationalizing, fuming, changing flight dates, taking needless flights? No. I understand that some members gain from AerClub's approach and to some members it makes no big difference. But some members lose. And really, in terms of a Club, AerClub's one-way style of communication is just a drag.

Note: I wonder though: Is AerClub underresourced in some critical way? Why is there such divergence between two companies with the same parent? Two companies which moreover are aiming to align?
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Last edited by huruburu; Mar 8, 2024 at 7:26 am Reason: Added note
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Old Mar 8, 2024, 4:43 am
  #110  
 
Join Date: Mar 2024
Posts: 25
deleted, I guess there's no other way to do this?

Last edited by huruburu; Mar 8, 2024 at 5:01 am
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Old Mar 8, 2024, 1:51 pm
  #111  
 
Join Date: Mar 2024
Posts: 7
Originally Posted by huruburu
I've had a closer look at how British Airways Executive Club is approaching the challenge that AerClub is botching.

BA Executive Club has given members more than a year to plan for the change, which will take effect in April 2025. From the get-go they say, "Rest assured, well make the change gradually, and you can continue to enjoy the benefits youve earned in our current Tier Point collection period."

They then go into great detail about how the change will be managed. For example, if your Tier Point period starts on 9 July 2023 and ends on 8 July 2024, it will reset on 9 July, 2024 and end on 31 March 2025 (instead of 8 July 2025). However, the Tier Points you earned between 1 April 2024 and 8 July 2024 *will be added* as a Tier Point adjustment. They then explain the process using each of the twelve months so that every member will have a clear idea of what will happen.

Yes it's complicated. That's because it has to be, if you take every member's benefit into account.

Key differences between British Airways EC and AerClub's management of the same problem:
  • BA Executive Club respects members' planning: past, present, and future. AerClub doesn't.
  • BA Executive Club makes sure that every member's interests are protected and every member has an opportunity to benefit as a result of the transition. AerClub doesn't.
  • BA Executive Club communicates clearly and thoughtfully, giving month-by-month examples over a 3 year period for how the process will play out according to your anniversary date. AerClub doesn't.
According to my understanding of the announcements
  • BA Executive Club isn't taking more than a year longer because they're dragging their heels: that's how long it takes to do the job seamlessly, correctly, and to the benefit of all, probably at a cost to BA.
  • AerClub recklessly announces they will do the job in a month. It won't be done well. However, individual members rather than AerClub will bear the cost.
A core issue concerns the loss of assets (e.g., tier credits, early promotion to another tier). This translates to hard cash. AerClub's approach is a breach of trust. It messes members around. It's wasteful of members' time and money. Obviously AerClub is of some relevance to members. Obviously, whatever their level, members have some loyalty and maybe a long track record with Aer Lingus. Should we be hustling, puzzling, speculating, rationalizing, fuming, changing flight dates, taking needless flights? No. I understand that some members gain from AerClub's approach and to some members it makes no big difference. But some members lose. And really, in terms of a Club, AerClub's one-way style of communication is just a drag.

Note: I wonder though: Is AerClub underresourced in some critical way? Why is there such divergence between two companies with the same parent? Two companies which moreover are aiming to align?
You put it perfectly: thank you. AerClub has some nerve to present this as a no-lose deal. Fair enough if members win to differing degrees; quite another thing for many members to lose, when their Tier Credit assets are just being extinguished.
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Old Mar 8, 2024, 2:45 pm
  #112  
 
Join Date: Mar 2024
Posts: 7
I wonder if theres any latitude in the statement

Tier Credits Review:
Additionally, we are reviewing any Tier Credits earned between 1st April 2023 and 31st March 2024. Based on this review any related Tier status upgrade will be applied to your account after 10th April 2024.

toargue that extinguished Tier Credits (i.e earned up to 31st March) can be taken into account at any point during the coming year (i.e. after 10th April) if they would have resulted in moving up a Tier at that point.

Clutching at straws, I suspect!
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Old Mar 8, 2024, 5:00 pm
  #113  
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 3,865
Originally Posted by huruburu
I've had a closer look at how British Airways Executive Club is approaching the challenge that AerClub is botching.

BA Executive Club has given members more than a year to plan for the change, which will take effect in April 2025. From the get-go they say, "Rest assured, well make the change gradually, and you can continue to enjoy the benefits youve earned in our current Tier Point collection period."

They then go into great detail about how the change will be managed. For example, if your Tier Point period starts on 9 July 2023 and ends on 8 July 2024, it will reset on 9 July, 2024 and end on 31 March 2025 (instead of 8 July 2025). However, the Tier Points you earned between 1 April 2024 and 8 July 2024 *will be added* as a Tier Point adjustment. They then explain the process using each of the twelve months so that every member will have a clear idea of what will happen.

Yes it's complicated. That's because it has to be, if you take every member's benefit into account.

Key differences between British Airways EC and AerClub's management of the same problem:
  • BA Executive Club respects members' planning: past, present, and future. AerClub doesn't.
  • BA Executive Club makes sure that every member's interests are protected and every member has an opportunity to benefit as a result of the transition. AerClub doesn't.
  • BA Executive Club communicates clearly and thoughtfully, giving month-by-month examples over a 3 year period for how the process will play out according to your anniversary date. AerClub doesn't.
According to my understanding of the announcements
  • BA Executive Club isn't taking more than a year longer because they're dragging their heels: that's how long it takes to do the job seamlessly, correctly, and to the benefit of all, probably at a cost to BA.
  • AerClub recklessly announces they will do the job in a month. It won't be done well. However, individual members rather than AerClub will bear the cost.
A core issue concerns the loss of assets (e.g., tier credits, early promotion to another tier). This translates to hard cash. AerClub's approach is a breach of trust. It messes members around. It's wasteful of members' time and money. Obviously AerClub is of some relevance to members. Obviously, whatever their level, members have some loyalty and maybe a long track record with Aer Lingus. Should we be hustling, puzzling, speculating, rationalizing, fuming, changing flight dates, taking needless flights? No. I understand that some members gain from AerClub's approach and to some members it makes no big difference. But some members lose. And really, in terms of a Club, AerClub's one-way style of communication is just a drag.

Note: I wonder though: Is AerClub underresourced in some critical way? Why is there such divergence between two companies with the same parent? Two companies which moreover are aiming to align?
If you think BA has done such a good job you might want to pop over to the BA forum and put that view forward. I anticipate the replies with interest

P.S. please stop referring to tier points as assets, it hurts my inner accountant
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Old Mar 9, 2024, 2:54 am
  #114  
 
Join Date: Mar 2024
Posts: 25
There may be latitude but I think a transparent process upfront is preferable. I don't trust AerClub administration to make decisions for me, or that they will communicate those decisions in time for whatever travel I have planned or am planning. I feel I have to protect my interests against them which is a weird thing in a loyalty program!
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Old Mar 9, 2024, 2:57 am
  #115  
 
Join Date: Mar 2024
Posts: 25
Originally Posted by Kgmm77
If you think BA has done such a good job you might want to pop over to the BA forum and put that view forward. I anticipate the replies with interest

P.S. please stop referring to tier points as assets, it hurts my inner accountant
That's interesting, Kgmm77, can you be specific about the complaints? It's a lengthy thread as BA announced the alignment at the beginning of February. There seems to be the usual confusion but not the sense of panic as BA EC members are given 14 months to plan. I'll have a closer look later.
And ah, if we were all to protect our inner professions here ....! But seriously, what do you make of the dominant vocabulary of "earning," "spending," "accrual" of tier credits?

Last edited by huruburu; Mar 9, 2024 at 3:34 am
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Old Mar 9, 2024, 4:55 am
  #116  
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Originally Posted by Kgmm77
If you think BA has done such a good job you might want to pop over to the BA forum and put that view forward. I anticipate the replies with interest
This!

The announcement led to a long-winded (even for the BA forum) thread full of complaints....
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Old Mar 9, 2024, 4:57 am
  #117  
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Originally Posted by FlightDetective
If EI leadership didn't care about the programme, they'd remove it and redeploy the staff and save any overhead. That's business 101. Since the harmonisation is going on and it's all on one IT platform, it sounds to me like IAG certainly value it, and I'd say whatever they value, the owned airlines must value too.
The trouble is, the frequent flyer club was taken out of EI leadership's hands years ago.

When Gold Circle was closed down - which was run in-house by competent staff - it was replaced by Aer Club, which is run by Avios Group Limited from London. It was imposed on EI by IAG, and is run by outsiders (i.e. not directly by EI themselves) and brings with it limitations which never existed under GC (such as, for example, Aer Club's inability to offer TATL business class tickets for EU-originating customers - because there are no business class flights on shorthaul)

Last edited by irishguy28; Mar 9, 2024 at 5:03 am
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Old Mar 9, 2024, 5:33 am
  #118  
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Dublin, Ireland
Programs: BA Gold, Mucci
Posts: 2,083
Originally Posted by irishguy28
The trouble is, the frequent flyer club was taken out of EI leadership's hands years ago.

When Gold Circle was closed down - which was run in-house by competent staff - it was replaced by Aer Club, which is run by Avios Group Limited from London. It was imposed on EI by IAG, and is run by outsiders (i.e. not directly by EI themselves) and brings with it limitations which never existed under GC (such as, for example, Aer Club's inability to offer TATL business class tickets for EU-originating customers - because there are no business class flights on shorthaul)
That's not correct, I'm afraid. AerClub is run from the Aer Lingus head office in Dublin, from Director level on down. While the IT platform is common across IAG, "all" decisions are made in Ireland (with certain caveats, as I'm sure the harmonisation of dates must have been decided at a group level). I would hazard a guess it's the same setup for the British Airways Executive Club in London and Iberia Plus in Madrid and so on. The whole IAG group is setup so that the individual airlines largely run their own show, which is why they all have their own CEOs and so on.

Interesting though, I was unaware of that limitation around being unable to offer Transatlantic business class from Europe due to no J on the European leg. You'd think the system would just offer Y on that leg and J on the flight across the pond. I never engaged with Gold Circle, so I am not sure how different it was. What else could you do back then that you can't now, out of curiosity?
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Old Mar 9, 2024, 8:06 am
  #119  
 
Join Date: Mar 2024
Posts: 25
Originally Posted by irishguy28
This!

The announcement led to a long-winded (even for the BA forum) thread full of complaints....
It's hard to see why, as the BA approach seems so much more sensitive. I'll have a look later and see how the discussion panned out, e.g., if in fact there are substantive issues rather than just teething problems and over-quick reads.

Last edited by huruburu; Mar 9, 2024 at 12:14 pm
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Old Mar 9, 2024, 8:07 am
  #120  
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 5,949
Originally Posted by FlightDetective
That's not correct, I'm afraid. AerClub is run from the Aer Lingus head office in Dublin, from Director level on down. While the IT platform is common across IAG, "all" decisions are made in Ireland (with certain caveats, as I'm sure the harmonisation of dates must have been decided at a group level). I would hazard a guess it's the same setup for the British Airways Executive Club in London and Iberia Plus in Madrid and so on. The whole IAG group is setup so that the individual airlines largely run their own show, which is why they all have their own CEOs and so on.

Interesting though, I was unaware of that limitation around being unable to offer Transatlantic business class from Europe due to no J on the European leg. You'd think the system would just offer Y on that leg and J on the flight across the pond. I never engaged with Gold Circle, so I am not sure how different it was. What else could you do back then that you can't now, out of curiosity?
Of course it was better during Oneworld membership but generally I think the program
is better run now taking that aside . I have a mostly optimistic view going forward . Reading the above posts maybe they could have given a blanket 300 tier points as compensation for those who are hard done by.
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