This makes absolutely no sense
Apr 22, 23, 1:11 pm
#1
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Original Poster
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: HEL
Programs: lots of shiny metal cards
Posts: 13,865
This makes absolutely no sense
I had a stay in March, where the points didn't post, so I had to retro claim. So far so good. However the FB miles didn't post even then, so I made another claim. And this is the reply I got with the subject: "Accor is informing you about your request [xxxxxxxxx]"
In what world does this make ANY sense?
NB - I can still log in to my account normally... So what is this "safety measure"? Not posting FB miles??
PS - the links (and the reply-to) all point to the accor.com domain
Originally Posted by Accor
We are coming back to you about your request regarding your flying blue miles.
Despite our database security not being compromised, our systems have detected a risk of intrusion into your account. A third party may have discovered or is looking to find your password. As a precaution, your ALL - Accor Live Limitless account is subject to a safety measure that generated the situation you are experiencing.
We have not informed you of this security measure because, due to the circumstances, having no certainty about your secure access to your means of communication, we did not wish to use them.
In order to ensure the security of your account and reactivate all its features, please:
- change your password
- reply to this email by confirming your password change
- upload a copy of an Identity document (ID card, passport, driving licence…) on our secured platform by clicking here
The link is valid for 20 days and can be used only once for a 3MB maximum size document.
If you wish to share additional documents, please use the links below:
Share another document here
Share another document here
Given the context and in accordance with data protection regulations, the communication of this document is necessary. It will be automatically deleted after processing your request.
In general, for the security of your account, we strongly recommend that you:
- Change the password of third-party accounts (Facebook, Google, Yahoo, Linkedin, Apple Sign-in) if you use it to log in to your personal space ALL.
- Change your email password, it may be accessed by a third party and try to change your account access again
- Never share your password and change it regularly
- Choose a different and complex password for all the applications and sites you use
- Beware of emails asking you to provide information about yourself; check the sender address of these emails; for our mailings we most often use: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
Despite our database security not being compromised, our systems have detected a risk of intrusion into your account. A third party may have discovered or is looking to find your password. As a precaution, your ALL - Accor Live Limitless account is subject to a safety measure that generated the situation you are experiencing.
We have not informed you of this security measure because, due to the circumstances, having no certainty about your secure access to your means of communication, we did not wish to use them.
In order to ensure the security of your account and reactivate all its features, please:
- change your password
- reply to this email by confirming your password change
- upload a copy of an Identity document (ID card, passport, driving licence…) on our secured platform by clicking here
The link is valid for 20 days and can be used only once for a 3MB maximum size document.
If you wish to share additional documents, please use the links below:
Share another document here
Share another document here
Given the context and in accordance with data protection regulations, the communication of this document is necessary. It will be automatically deleted after processing your request.
In general, for the security of your account, we strongly recommend that you:
- Change the password of third-party accounts (Facebook, Google, Yahoo, Linkedin, Apple Sign-in) if you use it to log in to your personal space ALL.
- Change your email password, it may be accessed by a third party and try to change your account access again
- Never share your password and change it regularly
- Choose a different and complex password for all the applications and sites you use
- Beware of emails asking you to provide information about yourself; check the sender address of these emails; for our mailings we most often use: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
NB - I can still log in to my account normally... So what is this "safety measure"? Not posting FB miles??
PS - the links (and the reply-to) all point to the accor.com domain
Apr 22, 23, 1:34 pm
#2
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: YYZ
Programs: Accor ALL Diamond, AC Aeroplan E35K, Nexus/GE
Posts: 2,632
I've never received an e-mail like that, but I did have my account locked for similar reasons. Nothing about my account appeared unusual. I could view everything. I could make bookings. I only discovered a problem when checking out of the Fairmont Tremblant and trying to redeem points. The staff at the hotel had no idea why they couldn't redeem anything. They called a helpdesk, who confirmed the account was locked for redemptions for security reasons.
To restore access, I had to jump through hoops by e-mailing ID to some Accor department. The irony of trying to solve a security event, by asking a customer to e-mail sensitive identification documents via unsecured e-mail, was just one more event in a long line of evidence of the stupidity of the Accor organization.
Based on my experience, I'm not at all surprised by your experience!
Apr 22, 23, 2:07 pm
#3
Suspended
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 1,593
Some of these addresses are no longer used ever since All was launched in replacement of LCAH. Therefore my suggestion is to avoid responding to this email or using any link inside this email at any cost and call CS directly to authenticate the email sent.
The agent will send you a dedicated email and you will know its legit.
The agent will send you a dedicated email and you will know its legit.
Apr 22, 23, 3:07 pm
#4
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Original Poster
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: HEL
Programs: lots of shiny metal cards
Posts: 13,865
Some of these addresses are no longer used ever since All was launched in replacement of LCAH. Therefore my suggestion is to avoid responding to this email or using any link inside this email at any cost and call CS directly to authenticate the email sent.
The agent will send you a dedicated email and you will know its legit.
The agent will send you a dedicated email and you will know its legit.
Apr 23, 23, 1:58 am
#5
Join Date: Mar 2019
Programs: FB Gold, Accor Gold, IHG One Rewards Platinum, SNCF Grand Voyager le club, Hertz 5* Gold,
Posts: 271
My account was locked in this way >5 years ago and even calling multiple times didnt help. Until I followed their stupid rules the account remained locked. in the end I arranged to send multiple emails with renamed password encrypted files; took them a few weeks to unravel everything.
I made a separate complaint but of course never heard anything from it. Not surprised it is still in play today.
I made a separate complaint but of course never heard anything from it. Not surprised it is still in play today.
Apr 23, 23, 3:17 am
#7
Moderator, Turkish Airlines Miles&Smiles & Accor ALL
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: BRU
Programs: TK*G, Accor ALL Platinum
Posts: 7,478
, or the latest fragmentation on how the company is run (Ennismore) but what they cannot manage are the very basics: running a hotel company with a loyalty programme well and efficient. Post-COVID I travel less and on my own dime but every single time there is a problem, either booking, stay or loyalty. I am getting perilously close to calling it quits.Lastly, I find it bizarre that AccorHotels Concierge still goes online (even as I speak) and obviously reads what is being said but has entirely withdrawn any engagement. What does that tell you? Just pathetic.
Apr 23, 23, 5:28 am
#8
Suspended
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 1,593
Accor is reknown for laying off easily. Over almost 20 years, I have been on and off the company several times and encountered several "purges" (there is no other word). Half of IT systems are outdated (i believe that the main one still in use is more than 35 or 40 years old and cannot be replaced or they are still having excuses not to do so) and regarding staff, you cannot reduce manpower all the time and believe you can keep consistency in quality of service while the size of the company is constantly booming. I rejoined Accor when A-Club became LCAH and loyalty was a top priority for Sebastien Bazin because we had less than 15 million members while our competitors had many times that number. Now that there are almost x5 this figure in terms of members but resources have not kept up to support the huge amount of work that comes with it.
I agree with you regarding Accorhotels Concierges...
I agree with you regarding Accorhotels Concierges...
Apr 23, 23, 11:51 am
#9
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Rhineland-Palatinate
Programs: OW Sapphire (BA), *A Gold (A3), Le Club Accor Gold, HHonor Diamond
Posts: 5,391
Frankly from where I am sitting it appears to be all falling apart. Nothing works properly (and yes they were never great to begin with). Rates or rooms cannot be booked across all platforms (recently Raffles vs ALL), CS is non existent (it either takes days or no response at all, social media is a disaster), not all hotel chains participate, some hotels opt out either entirely or partially), guest experience is highly variable at the same chain and at the mercy of local staff. Who runs this nonsense? Meanwhile management get entirely lost waffling endlessly on about the trend of the week (bleisure, wellness, self fulfillment, blah blah blah) Seriously, if you want to waste some time read this https://group.accor.com/en/Actualite...nsights-report , or the latest fragmentation on how the company is run (Ennismore) but what they cannot manage are the very basics: running a hotel company with a loyalty programme well and efficient. Post-COVID I travel less and on my own dime but every single time there is a problem, either booking, stay or loyalty. I am getting perilously close to calling it quits.
Lastly, I find it bizarre that AccorHotels Concierge still goes online (even as I speak) and obviously reads what is being said but has entirely withdrawn any engagement. What does that tell you? Just pathetic.
, or the latest fragmentation on how the company is run (Ennismore) but what they cannot manage are the very basics: running a hotel company with a loyalty programme well and efficient. Post-COVID I travel less and on my own dime but every single time there is a problem, either booking, stay or loyalty. I am getting perilously close to calling it quits.Lastly, I find it bizarre that AccorHotels Concierge still goes online (even as I speak) and obviously reads what is being said but has entirely withdrawn any engagement. What does that tell you? Just pathetic.
But I agree with all of what you say, Accor is not managed and basically a mess of a company.
Apr 23, 23, 12:04 pm
#10
Suspended
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 1,593
I have seen worse in the history of the company. Frankly, out of 5 CEOs I've known, Sebastien Bazin is the best for the job and he led Accor where no one was able to get before. But Accor is struggling with the same issue most multinationals is facing: always doing more with less resources...
Over the past years, HQ in Paris is getting more and more empty.
Accor is not the only company reducing workforce, but they all believe that 3 persons can do the work of 10 and because people are working their ... off, in the end, the conclusion is: "hey see ? you were 10 in the office and finally it works just fine with the 3 of you", so why hiring more people?
It's not only a problem with the number but also with "diversity" and diversity means costs. At the Bangkok office, they used to have so many nationalities, so expats. And they reduced the number drastically to employ locals only. It's happening almost everywhere within the group.
Same now is happening at hotel level for cost saving reasons with local general managers.
Over the past years, HQ in Paris is getting more and more empty.
Accor is not the only company reducing workforce, but they all believe that 3 persons can do the work of 10 and because people are working their ... off, in the end, the conclusion is: "hey see ? you were 10 in the office and finally it works just fine with the 3 of you", so why hiring more people?
It's not only a problem with the number but also with "diversity" and diversity means costs. At the Bangkok office, they used to have so many nationalities, so expats. And they reduced the number drastically to employ locals only. It's happening almost everywhere within the group.
Same now is happening at hotel level for cost saving reasons with local general managers.
Last edited by flyertalker00143; Apr 23, 23 at 12:43 pm
Apr 23, 23, 1:52 pm
#11
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Rhineland-Palatinate
Programs: OW Sapphire (BA), *A Gold (A3), Le Club Accor Gold, HHonor Diamond
Posts: 5,391
What you are saying has nothing to do with the prices of tea in China : Management losing itself into pseudo marketing, hotel not following All programs, guest experience being different is completely decoupled from the number of people in corporate in Paris or Bangkok.
Apr 23, 23, 1:59 pm
#12
Suspended
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 1,593
How do you want hotels to follow the rules if there is nobody in the offices to drive them and control that group standards are properly applied ?
but i was not talking about operations but about running support functions properly including IT, CS and the loyalty program
hotel operations are another story, especially in China. Accor has to manage tense relationships with Chinese hotel owners and trust me, its not the only hotel chain to struggle and chinese owners are not the worst either.
when your hotel owner summons you overnight for a P&L review and that you mention Accor standards you need to enforce and that the only thing he wants to hear from your mouth is about results, trust me, even the VP wont raise his voice to tell what to do with the hotel
but i was not talking about operations but about running support functions properly including IT, CS and the loyalty program
hotel operations are another story, especially in China. Accor has to manage tense relationships with Chinese hotel owners and trust me, its not the only hotel chain to struggle and chinese owners are not the worst either.
when your hotel owner summons you overnight for a P&L review and that you mention Accor standards you need to enforce and that the only thing he wants to hear from your mouth is about results, trust me, even the VP wont raise his voice to tell what to do with the hotel
Last edited by flyertalker00143; Apr 23, 23 at 2:11 pm
Apr 24, 23, 7:39 am
#13
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Portugal
Programs: TK Elite+ (*A Gold), FB Gold (ST Elite+), BAEC Gold (OW Emerald), ALL Diamond, IHG Diamond Amb
Posts: 256
Frankly from where I am sitting it appears to be all falling apart. Nothing works properly (and yes they were never great to begin with). Rates or rooms cannot be booked across all platforms (recently Raffles vs ALL), CS is non existent (it either takes days or no response at all, social media is a disaster), not all hotel chains participate, some hotels opt out either entirely or partially), guest experience is highly variable at the same chain and at the mercy of local staff. Who runs this nonsense? Meanwhile management get entirely lost waffling endlessly on about the trend of the week (bleisure, wellness, self fulfillment, blah blah blah) Seriously, if you want to waste some time read this https://group.accor.com/en/Actualite...nsights-report , or the latest fragmentation on how the company is run (Ennismore) but what they cannot manage are the very basics: running a hotel company with a loyalty programme well and efficient. Post-COVID I travel less and on my own dime but every single time there is a problem, either booking, stay or loyalty. I am getting perilously close to calling it quits.
Lastly, I find it bizarre that AccorHotels Concierge still goes online (even as I speak) and obviously reads what is being said but has entirely withdrawn any engagement. What does that tell you? Just pathetic.
, or the latest fragmentation on how the company is run (Ennismore) but what they cannot manage are the very basics: running a hotel company with a loyalty programme well and efficient. Post-COVID I travel less and on my own dime but every single time there is a problem, either booking, stay or loyalty. I am getting perilously close to calling it quits.Lastly, I find it bizarre that AccorHotels Concierge still goes online (even as I speak) and obviously reads what is being said but has entirely withdrawn any engagement. What does that tell you? Just pathetic.
With ALL?
- 0 enforcement of standards across hotels of same brand
- 0 training on procedures (3 attempts at using Diamond dining vouchers ended in me giving up before a 4th hotel actually knew how to use them)
- 0 help from HQ / brand when sh*t hits the fan with any experience (0 benefit of chain vs. non-chain hotel)
- some nice properties exiting
- 0 elevated recognition for true loyal members vs Gold-via-ibis-card (I know there's people that stay/spend more than I do... but still if I'm diamond based on spend and this is deemed their highest (public) status I'm certainly not the one spending the least)
- 0 incentives to stay above Diamond level (really, above Platinum but... well...)
- Customer service is slow and frequently not helpful at all (taking ages to reply)
- IT breaks more than I can believe is possible at this scale (and I'm in IT... so I know a thing or two...)
How can you run a hotel chain where your app doesn't show SNU-enabled properties or your website is in constant-loading mode for days? There's no one looking at analytics? I work with big orgs and well aware of inefficiencies at this scale but this is just another dimension.
it really drives you crazy that while you can't seem to do get the basics done (book a hotel and then get service there delivered per standard) you constantly get pushed "experiences" and "lifestyle" and whatever-not in always useless promo emails (never ever did I make a booking or upsell as a result of a ALL email and they literally know my travel patterns). So 100% agree: you're a hotel brand: act like it.
I'm very convinced that if a hotel brand just focused on the core: great, fast, efficient booking experience, rewarding loyalty program, efficient data-driven interactions, aspirational marketing and hotels with nice hard product and superb service (which is "free") they'd be super successful. But no... so 10 bureaucrats can get paid a salary we get drawn into this 'experiences' brand craziness.
btw... this isn't specific to ALL, just increasingly more prominent...
Apr 25, 23, 5:09 am
#14
Join Date: May 2015
Location: WAW / TBS
Programs: AF Platinum / Accor Platinum / Hilton Diamond / TP Silver / A3 Silver
Posts: 2,558
in a summary i like this thread cause it seems this is what ALL C level management needs to hear , adding more brands when they are not able to keep up with quality of existing hotels is just ridiculous
Last edited by fifty_two; Apr 25, 23 at 5:20 am
Apr 25, 23, 5:17 am
#15
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Original Poster
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: HEL
Programs: lots of shiny metal cards
Posts: 13,865
Getting back to the original issue - I called CS (boy, is the number well hidden on the website!) and the only solution was what was described in my OP. They sent me a new email (identical, except for the name signed) and I followed the instructions. (NB - I painted over the last several digits of the passport number) A day later FB miles posted. I'm not sure if they were the correct amount, but I don't mind.
