Originally Posted by
ctownflyer
Again, what made these people a group? Not sure why I need to keep repeating myself here.
You make them a group, the blog makes them one, and all those who complained to the blog certainly make themselves one.
I'm not accusing LH of systemic racism, but I am accusing those who decided that all Jews on the flight constituted a group.
You do when you claim that they were barred from continuation for being Jewish.
See my response to sossos below - the assumption of the people at FRA to think that these were all "members of the same cult", wasn't an unreasonable one. In the light of first assessment, not as a final judgement of course.
Pretending that no anti-Semitism existed in the incident is downright chilling.
I think you are committing the age old fallacy of conflating a race / nationality / religion and in this case sub-sect of a religion.
People may use insensitive language but generally they mean "that group", not the entire race.
And yes perhaps there were some racists present - the one who called all officers "Nazis" certainly was one ... people have a right to wrong thoughts. They just should contain them.
So I am not claiming that no antisemitism was at work, I just don't think that it has met the burden of proof.
I respond to the individual questions below but it seems to me that you interpret too much into that "group" thing. As a bad Protestant, I cannot tell the uniforms of the Catholics apart, let alone people who wear insignia of the Jewish faith. Who @ FRA would have been aware of that obscure pilgrimage of a subset of a faith the vast majority of locals do not remotely understand - and should not have to. So yes, grouping "visible faith members" who travel together to a common destination is not unreasonable. The fear that there is some bad group dynamics at work that will possibly impact flight safety is absolutely reasonable. Wrong perhaps but very reasonable.
Also on a 747, there are some 300 passengers around to keep 100 unruly ones in check. On an A320 this won't be the case anymore. From a safety point of view, dispersing the group was the logical thing to do. Much like the police does with protestors which then also impacts the law abiding protestors.
Originally Posted by
s0ssos
The leadership of Germany welcomed immigrants. The people of Germany did not. Are these immigrants a "group?"
You just put all Germans sans their "leadership" into one group. So the 99.99% now are the group of xenophobes?
A group is anything that the inference engine of your brain can cluster into a common characteristic. The members of the group don't have to agree with your assessment. Most Lemmings probably don't think that they like other Lemmings because they are part of the same species.
The Nazis defined themselves as a group, the "Aryans" or so I've been told
Perhaps they did. But outside of their fine taste in weaponry, you really shouldn't use them as a role model. They frankly sucked as a political system and greatly contributed to widespread trouble.
"..Adolf Hitler and many Nazi officials had dark hair and were still considered members of the Aryan race under Nazi racial doctrine,"
What did you expect? That the leaders recuse themselves from their made-up ideal???
They obviously weren't that ideological when it comes to their personal flaws. Do you think that they would have behaved better if they more "racially pure" and more blond? I don't sense the message here.
"The immigrants to Germany recently came from many different places. Are they "a group?"
Obviously you don't perceive them as a group and I don't, so let's settle for "no".
The US has issues with this (obviously). Does a Hispanic person have to vote a certain way or have certain beliefs, otherwise they aren't Hispanic?
Again, you should not make the gaffes of politicians your philosophical role model. You can stand apart from Biden and National Socialists.
Asians is purportedly the "model minority" but there are many different countries in Asia and their immigrants are as different as night and day. Should they get all lumped together?
What are you planning? Lumping some 4+ billion people together?
Someone said cause they dress the same. So, they are a group because they wear similar clothes?
Why do you need other people's opinion on proper grouping???
Does that mean people in the plane who wear tshirts and jeans also constitute a group? Or is that just ridiculous?
At a tailcoat gala, they would absolutely make for a group....