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Old Nov 4, 19, 10:13 pm
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: London, England.
Programs: BA
Posts: 7,580
Originally Posted by YVR Cockroach View Post
I am particularly intrigued by how airline terms originate from shipping lines. Simply the name "airline" and "airliner" (instead of ocean liner). Crew rank (captain, steward/stewardess). Galleys (and I imagine cooking was done onboard in the flying boat days and I don't go back far enough to remember what flying must have been like then). Would terms have been different if there was no connection?.
A fascinating book which gets into several of these aspects is "Croissants at Croydon", by Jack Bamford, who was, astoundingly, the Air France (and their pioneer predecessors) General Manager at London right from the start of commercial aviation in 1919 through to the early 1960s with Caravelles and even 707s on the Paris flights - and in retirement he even flew on Concorde. But the detail about those absolute pioneer times is fascinating.

Quite why pilot uniforms look like ship officers is described, because that is what a few pioneers decided was the best available to them - lots of surplus after WW1. In open cockpit aircraft days they changed into and out of heavyweight leather suits, Sidcot Suits that went over the top. They were all (including Bamford himself of course) just out of the military, and brought their traditions with them.
More specifically, I was looking for a steamship company operated the airline as a wholly-owned subsidiary
Quick one for me to add here is Panagra. This was a jointly owned carrier between Pan Am and the Grace shipping line, who were the long-established shipping company from the US to the west coast of South America, and had all the local offices etc there.

And then there were several UK airlines so owned. British United, and later British Caledonian, were principally owned by British & Continental Shipping, who owned several long-established long distance worldwide shipping companies.

Meanwhile all rather busy here, haven't looked at the posts here for some days, am currently in a grossly overpriced hotel in Frankfurt, Germany, where it is trade fair week. Not that we are going to the fair itself, but thank goodness the client is at least shouldering both plane fares and accommodation costs which are at least double compared to normal on a dreary wet (yes, it is) November day. Came over yesterday on the first BA E190 from London City, had one of the longest taxys in ever at Frankfurt, must have been several miles, from the new runway in the NW corner of the airport to the BA stand at the far east end. Did notice that there are still plenty of Lufthansa A340-300s around, itself a somewhat disappearing type nowadays, along with plenty of 747s as well. Meanwhile the airport train station into Frankfurt is closed for a couple of months for some works, and the trains are running from a separate station normally used for long distance trains out on the airport periphery, connected by a special bus. Even the trains themselves are all mixed up, running late, and even last-minute cancelled. For a centre of a supposedly efficient culture it's all somewhat disorganised and poorly signed, and I probably penetrated it all better than others. Back home on the last flight tonight.

I first came through here in 1972, arriving by a Dan-Air BAC One-Eleven on a student charter flight from London Gatwick, even then it was quite a large airport, though the US military base on the south side, which I recall had a fine display on arrival of US charter DC-8s from the likes of World, Transinternational, Capitol, etc, is now all demolished and somewhat abandoned. And that train station right under the terminal, which then was new, whizzed us into the city so efficiently. But not yesterday.

Did I mention that Dan-Air was also always owned by a shipping company ? It was Davies and Newman, hence it's name, long based where shipping companies used to be headquarters right in the City of London, now the wholly financial district. I think they were the only airline with an HQ there. Eventually the airline became the principal operation and the shipping side ran down. They started off in the early 1950s providing charter operations taking changeover ship crews, at a time when so many were British, to various places round the world.

Last edited by WHBM; Nov 4, 19 at 10:26 pm
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