Originally Posted by
goodeats21
I didn't get to listen to the entire call, but what I heard about the 50 seaters and "small" markets was a hoot.
They just decimated my DAY service, removing all 2 cabin planes that were standard on ORD, and had been increasing to other hubs. All 50 seaters now. And AA and Delta both have multiple mainline ops every day. Hardly competetive.
I started flying out of CVG to avoid the CR2s, and now my costs have gone down as I am seeing lower fares.
I fear they are going to be disappointed by their plan to have the Devil's Chariot be the solution to their yield issues.
I will try to listen to the entire call later tonight to see if I missed anything, though.
I was was also struck by "natural share" discussion, which sounded a lot like "we don't need to compete for business".
Originally Posted by
minnyfly
...
DAY again. For 2017, both UA and DL (even mainline) are shrinking at DAY. AA is the largest and is up slightly. Much of the declines at DAY are undoubtedly due to competition returning to CVG, lowering fares there, and reversing CVG leakage to DAY.
UA still has 2-class RJs to ORD at comparable levels going back quite a few years.
AA has only two mainline flights, and DL has only four mainline flights, both going to one hub each in directions UA doesn't compete with them on.
UA's traffic decline predates the inclusion of CRJs replacing E145s.
UA recently announced a return to IAH, something I mentioned previously was their biggest hole at DAY.
...
Originally Posted by
goodeats21
Just because you keep saying it, it does not make it true...and I am tired of arguing with you about it. I have lived it.
DAY<->ORD on a 2 cabin plane seems to be down to one turn a week...Tuesday afternoons. Everything else seems to be 1 cabin.
That is a drastic reduction in 2-cabin service over the past several years.
And the other routes which used to see 2 cabin -DEN on most days, and the occasional IAD, are all 50 seaters now.
mduell - do you have time to run the schedule on this? I don't know of any other way to prove the obvious.
Oh, and sure, it is nice to see DAY<->IAH be added back this summer...but we are looking at an almost 3 hour flight on a 50 seater, so not like this is a groundbreaking.
Originally Posted by
mduell
UAL flights from KDAY:
Code:
year one_cabin two_cabin
------+-----------+-----------
2016 2757 1575
2017 1915 1986
2018 3270 1376
Well the good news is frequency is going up...
Originally Posted by
minnyfly
I'm not saying because I'm saying it. I'm saying it because it's what the BTS and Dayton Airport stats tell us. I'd be on board with you if that's what the stats show. UA hasn't had drastically more 2-class service on ORD-DAY for many years. And it's ironic that mduell shows you that 2017 had more 2-class service than 2016. ORD-DAY has been a mix of 2-class and 50-seaters for over a decade. Mainline left in 2009, and the RJ mix has been similar for even longer.
IAD-DAY had some 2-class service many years ago, but that was also limited. The overall DAY mix has been in the 50/50 to majority 50-seater range for a long time. The mix has been more favorable to 2-class lately, although overall traffic has been in decline for years. But that has been true for most carriers at DAY. Interestingly mainline traffic has also dropped over the past five years with DL and AA. It'as not a UA thing. It's primarily a DAY/CVG thing. Even if UA gets more 2-class RJs, I wouldn't expect a dramatic increase in service to DAY. That ship appears to be sailing down I-75. Maybe the new focus on small markets will stem the tide in the next few years, but don't expect mainline to suddenly dominate.
You have denied UA had more 2 cabin service in previous years.
mduell was kind enough to post the data that proves you are not correct.
If you have DATA showing something different, post it. Otherwise, you have lost credibility on this.
Overall, Kirby was very specific about the connectivity issue being key to increasing yields - that United needs to compete for small market share when there is competition.
I maintain that throwing CR2s against 2-cabin RJs and Mainline is not a winning strategy.