Thought us doesn't oversell biz class?
Feb 24, 2015, 2:37 pm
#76
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The requirement for rest seats comes from two places: FAR 117, which contains the legal limitations for flight time and duty time, and the APA contract, which in some cases stipulates greater rest facilities than required by law. For a single relief pilot (i.e., a three pilot crew), the FAA requires only one rest seat, given that only one pilot will be on rest at a time. The APA contract also allows for only one rest seat in most cases... The contract only requires one seat as long as the seat has aisle access and there is nobody who would have to step over the pilot resting to get out of their seat. Thus, only one seat is required on any widebody, as the pilots can be assigned a window seat with aisle access or an aisle seat in the center section, which would also not require anyone to step over. The current 757 seats, though, don't allow for such accommodations; thus, two seats are required so that both requirements are met.
As a side note, on the LUS 762s (I don't know about the pre-CIP LAA 763s), two seats were allocated for crew rest even though neither FAR 117 nor the contract required it. This is because the company installed a curtain around the crew rest seats, making it a Class II rest facility rather than Class III. This, in turn, allows the flight time and duty time to be increased more than if the seat didn't have the curtain. It was apparently not feasible to put a curtain around a single seat, so both seats in the center section were inside the curtain, meaning that both seats were unavailable to revenue passengers. On newer 1-2-1 configurations, the curtain, if any, is typically placed around a window seat, so only requires a single seat to be removed from inventory. Likewise, if AA chooses the 763 CIP seat for the 757 cabin refit (1-2, 2-1), they should be able to allocate a single seat to the pilots, rather than a seat pair, leaving 15 seats to sell rather than 14 in 2-2 configuration.
As a side note, on the LUS 762s (I don't know about the pre-CIP LAA 763s), two seats were allocated for crew rest even though neither FAR 117 nor the contract required it. This is because the company installed a curtain around the crew rest seats, making it a Class II rest facility rather than Class III. This, in turn, allows the flight time and duty time to be increased more than if the seat didn't have the curtain. It was apparently not feasible to put a curtain around a single seat, so both seats in the center section were inside the curtain, meaning that both seats were unavailable to revenue passengers. On newer 1-2-1 configurations, the curtain, if any, is typically placed around a window seat, so only requires a single seat to be removed from inventory. Likewise, if AA chooses the 763 CIP seat for the 757 cabin refit (1-2, 2-1), they should be able to allocate a single seat to the pilots, rather than a seat pair, leaving 15 seats to sell rather than 14 in 2-2 configuration.
Feb 28, 2015, 11:14 pm
#77
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I can't speak for US's policy, but overbooking J does occur occasionally on AA. There are certain markets with high no show rates in the cabin so analysts sometimes risk it. Usually works out. Rare occurrence they actually have to deny boarding to someone with a confirmed seat or downgrade them. They analysts seem to know what they are doing with this at AA. You also see it a LOT on 3 cabin planes and they boot folks up to F. But these are going away other than the 77Ws.
Mar 1, 2015, 4:28 am
#78
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I can't speak for US's policy, but overbooking J does occur occasionally on AA. There are certain markets with high no show rates in the cabin so analysts sometimes risk it. Usually works out. Rare occurrence they actually have to deny boarding to someone with a confirmed seat or downgrade them. They analysts seem to know what they are doing with this at AA. You also see it a LOT on 3 cabin planes and they boot folks up to F. But these are going away other than the 77Ws.
Mar 1, 2015, 3:27 pm
#79
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Mar 1, 2015, 3:46 pm
#80
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Wait - why did you consent to that? I would have laughed in their faces and asked them how they expect a 3-year old to sit by himself in coach? It seems like your mother enabled US to get away with this. If you had just refused to provide a solution, US would eventually have to move your son back to F and downgrade someone else.
It doesn't matter if it's a FAM or a pilot rest issue, US should have a policy not to separate a 3-YO into a different cabin than the rest of their party. And that's an issue that will get a lot of press. US should bend over backwards to kiss your @$$ on this, there should be 2x involuntary downgrade compensation at a minimum.
It doesn't matter if it's a FAM or a pilot rest issue, US should have a policy not to separate a 3-YO into a different cabin than the rest of their party. And that's an issue that will get a lot of press. US should bend over backwards to kiss your @$$ on this, there should be 2x involuntary downgrade compensation at a minimum.
A better response would be making sure they realize that its a child and offering to have another member of the family move. Their system doesn't look at ages when doing seat assignments. Plus since there really isn't such a thing as childrens fares anymore, I'd be surprised if the info even shows up about ages in a reservation unless the child is traveling as a UM.Most airline don't have a policy about where children should be seated. And why should this get 2X compensation. The same amount of involuntary downgrade compensation should be offered and thats that.
As an aside, in terms of on board customer service - why not invite Grandma to sit in one of the empty crew rest seats, until one of the crew actually wants to use it?
This wouldn't affect compensation, she's still assigned/downgraded to Y, but would go a long way to alleviating ill will.
This wouldn't affect compensation, she's still assigned/downgraded to Y, but would go a long way to alleviating ill will.
All..
I'm still on vacation so not really going to handle it till I get back but a few details
1) same pnr for whole family
2) never given a choice to downgrade someone else, agent was well aware of his age
3)planned to ask for his one way fare back and miles for one way biz seat to Caribbean
FA was nice and gave grandma some drinks. I do have my sons boarding pass in coach
I'm still on vacation so not really going to handle it till I get back but a few details
1) same pnr for whole family
2) never given a choice to downgrade someone else, agent was well aware of his age
3)planned to ask for his one way fare back and miles for one way biz seat to Caribbean
FA was nice and gave grandma some drinks. I do have my sons boarding pass in coach
Apr 9, 2015, 4:22 pm
#81
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Update
Just an update.. So far they have only refunded the fare difference a paltry $90. The response from US Airways ignored the point that they downgraded a child and focused more on the idea that downgrades happen. Completely over their head.. I've emailed AA VP's for additional assistance, i'm honestly thinking about asking a BA blogger to get involved. I feel like if I was CP or EXP PLT this would have taken less time and gotten more of what I deserve.. More to come...