CruiserCLE

I don't get it. In another thread, people complain because UA was holding back some CPU's and not running them at the window. Now are complaining because they run too many. Nothing seems to please anyone.

I book a fair mix of 2-3 week out travel and some 2-3 day out travel. I just expect that booking last minute I will not necessarily be able to get my preferred seat or an upgrade. Life goes on.

ryman554

No, no, and absolutely no.

Back in my day, where you actually had to use currency called e500 if you wanted to be upgraded, me, a lowly 2P, was able to sit up front every so often. Not just on short hops, but on trans-cons. It wasn't often. And it certainly was not as often as those exalted 1Ks. But it was enough to be sticky. And turn this 2P into a 1K over time.

Once you got on the waitlist, you weren't jumped by those with higher status. You were in a FIFO queue (yes, I know about the PA/PB lists) that bumped you up when it was your turn.

The loyalty program worked.

Let me repeat that again, the loyalty program worked to stick me to an airline and give it money. It would not have worked if all of the upgrades went to those with highest status. The reason it worked is that it felt equitable, felt like even the little guy has a shot.

Let's compare this to the quote above. The quote is dangerously close to an entitlement -- that the higher class deserve upgrades by virtue of being a higher class. Taken to the logical conclusion, R space should go away, and all UG should be done at the gate (which, for CPU, I actually agree with!)

MP has a fine line to walk here. They have to give the little guy a chance to stick. If you consistently give the GS/1K stuff you do two things: you create an entitlement attitude (which this 1K -- me, not OP -- is guilty of) where you engender negative feelings (like the OP expressed) when an UG does not come through AND you discourage the early-career travelers from even trying. The loyalty program would not work. Anecdotes (which is not a synonym for data) seem to indicate the latter.

In this humble 1K view, the pendulum has swung too far in the higher status direction and needs to swing back a bit, not even more forward.

kale73

OP, given that United's "loyalty" program doesn't seem to be working to your satisfaction, perhaps you should investigate switching airlines.

Artpen100

If there were no upgrades until the gate, I'm not sure you would see more availability. I think you would see even more people locking in their upgrade - if they want one - through buy-up, using certificates or miles, or taking TODs, which is what I do already. As it is, almost every domestic flight I take is 100% full, so I doubt there are that many CPUs anyway.

Bonehead

That was my first thought as well when I saw this thread.


My understanding is that many GS are comped via their business contracts, and are spoiled because they buy coach and almost always get bumped up to FC. I sometimes take perverse pleasure in seeing a GS or two head to the back on my DEN-PIT flights that attract a lot of paid F (me included).

docbert

And while we're at it, is there any way we can get them to stop seat allocation in advance, and just do that based on boarding group too?

I'm sick and tired of platinum and gold status people getting the best window seats, and me having to sit in row 11 rather than my preferred row 8!

Often1

That is an advantage to the lowest level elites who know that they can change their seat assignment at the expense of people flying in paid F who pay for flexibility.

While UA should not move an upgraded pax out of Y to acommodate the paid F pax, it also should not upgrade Y freebies, e.g. CPU's until the paid F are taken care of.

RobOnLI

Am I right in guessing (assuming) the OP cancelled their "Y" (full) fare and rebooked it in a lower fare class? If they were upgraded with golds at the 48 hour window and cancelled within 24 hours of the flight then they were on a refundable fare.

Sounds to me like the OP books fully refundable tickets because their travel schedule isn't solidified. Then the day before (or possibly day of) travel they know they are taking the flight and rebook the flight in whatever lower fare class is open and for sale at the time.

Seems to me the CPU logic is working fine. But even if you want to argue that a 1K on a lower fare should be ahead of golds...it's the game we all play and the rules are known. This is a highly TRANSPARENT process. CPUs process at 96/72/48/24 window. If CPU bucket is open and elites are on the list then they get the upgrade (based on fare class, etc. etc.). If you cancel your ticket and rebook, whether the same flight or not, you are back in queue for CPU. There is no reason to argue this process. It's the known rules. If you wanted to save a few bucks by rebooking your full fare to the lowest fare after your CPU processed then you deal with the consequences. And even if it's not a rebooking from full Y to whatever fare class is available, the flyer still knows the consequences.

There is no difference between this and a GS who sits in the back while lower level elites fly up front because they burned an instrument or miles long before the GS ever booked the flight. I know when I'm booking a flight that lower level elites may very well be sitting up front. They chose to book earlier and apply some instrument to get there. Good for them.

-RM

ermintrude

+1

GS are the entitled ones particularly if they know what they are doing; 1K really aren't.

This year I can't complain with CPUs and therefore not the process, however I find the buy-ups irritating.

The OP had an ~ 2 hr flight - I could care less for that flight time

mherdeg

Personally, I favor a policy in which people with my status, fare class, and travel patterns get upgraded as the highest priority and everyone else gets upgraded only if there is space left.

It is remarkable how much the fair thing has shifted over the years [with my travel patterns].

For example, if I ever stop having extra time to spend searching for "R", I am going to absolutely detest United's "don't dynamically clear waitlists, allow people to phone in and snipe off the waitlist" setup. For now I think it's pretty good and definitely the most fair thing because hey if a brand new walk-up customer could buy and upgrade, why not me? But later when I have less time I'll think that dynamic waitlists would be more fair because I'd rather shop with a company who has predictable technology with no surprises.

cjermain

Very well put. Fly long enough and UA (like any airline) will break the letter or spirit of the CoC, or they'll do something that clearly runs afoul of contract law or regulators... it's the nature of the business. This isn't one of those times. One might argue the current process doesn't meet expectations. But that doesn't make it unfair.

helvetic

That's not correct. I was in low-fare Y both times, first time S then K. What changed was my routing, going SEA-SFO-XXX to SEA-SFO-YYY. I was within 24h of booking, so I could cancel and re-book; but I could not make the destination change without a fee. So I had to lose my upgrade to change destination by rebooking an entirely new ticket.

IAH-OIL-TRASH

I'm thinking a policy in which people with my FF# are upgraded at the highest priority would be suitable...

...and a Thunderdome at the gate to sort out the rest. Such a method would certainly attract the UFC and WWE fans that fly the ULCCs.

seanp7

I think UA's currently handling of the situation you described is correct and fair. You rebooked an entirely new ticket and fell back into the process - and you weren't upgraded.

This happens a lot - ever SDC'd? Ever been in upgraded F on a flight that was cancelled and rebooked in Y? It's just a downside of a rebook - customer or UA initiated. Wouldn't want to see it change because the benefits of the upgrade windows/instruments/TOD offers etc outweigh these exception scenarios.

pushmyredbutton

While I don't disagree in principle, I feel it's one of the trade-offs of doing any sort of change. Granted, I usually pop right back to the top of the upgrade list and clear anyway, but there are times where I'm behind quite a few. UA could in fact hold a larger degree of seats until the gate, but that's up for debate as well in terms of how many seats to hold back (I think it's currently F2?)

Regardless, on SFO-SEA I actually prefer not to be upgraded if on a 737. I find the F seats extremely uncomfortable, and I get better food in the back as a 1K, and depending on the day, there's often an empty middle.