Post-Southwest Flight Experience And Things United Can Learn
#31
Join Date: Oct 2010
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I don't see how it could be stressful. Aside from a very small number of seats (that you need to be A-List to get), all the seats have identical space. It's your preference whether you want front/back, aisle/window. You just walk on in your assigned order and sit down somewhere that looks good. Of course it helps to be near the beginning if you're picky. But I have to agree with the OP that boarding is messed up at United (and AA).
#32
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Board at the end of the Bs sometime and then tell me it's not stressful. Every empty middle seat you walk past makes you think "maybe there aren't any more aisles/windows left and I should just try to stick closer to the front." And indeed, this happened to a person just a few spots behind me in line - he went all the way to the back hoping for a window or an aisle, and instead got stuck in last row middle. He could've had 2B, but he took a risk and got rewarded with a tight space, no window, no recline, and the longest wait to get off the plane possible.. That's stressful.
The stress in WN boarding isn't choosing a seat. It is watching the COS come down the aisle and hope he's not eyeing the middle seat in your row. But assigned seats really don't solve that anyway.
#33
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The boarding process is fine, employees are friendlier, employees don't seem on the edge of clinical depression, no change fees, no bag fees, directv, copious drink vouchers and random unbilled free drinks, generally cheap fares, easy website and app.
Focusing on the No Change Fees and basically a 12 month travel voucher if you cancel it altogether. That is a tremendous perk. How is it that only one airline has taken it upon themselves to do this? Bad business by southwest or bad business by the others?
Focusing on the No Change Fees and basically a 12 month travel voucher if you cancel it altogether. That is a tremendous perk. How is it that only one airline has taken it upon themselves to do this? Bad business by southwest or bad business by the others?
#34
#35
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But the OP's idea of hybridizing their boarding method with UA's assigned seats and various fare and status levels - essentially assigning a specific boarding line position - certainly makes sense. Btw, because the WN BP is clearly marked with line position, it's easy to politely confront line cutters and lurkers.
Strictly speaking about boarding, UA - and AA and DL too - is a circus compared to WN.
#36
Join Date: May 2016
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My parents and I flew to ABQ this past weekend on Southwest Airlines since United had some terrible schedules into ABQ. This was the first time I've flown WN since they implemented the group + line number boarding system. I paid for Early Bird checkin and was assigned Group A 26, 27 and 28. I was quite amazed at how orderly the boarding process was. The only "cattle call" was on my last 4 United flights. Gate lice are not an issue since everyone has a line number.
Couple observations that United should copy.
1. Families board AFTER group A has boarded but before group B.
2. Medical pre boarding requires getting a pre board pass from the counter NOT just randomly joining the disabled pre boarding group.
3. Boarding group A 1-15 is reserved for WN's version of "Business Class" Business Select fare payers. All other elites via A List level get assigned AFTER the paid Business Select boards.
4. Maybe implement some sort of line numbering system to prevent gate lice and ENFORCE IT.
For all the ills people talk about WN's boarding system, I thought it was a REALLY fair system, that they actually enforced and also rewards those who paid the highest fares, and elites. Also, WN is able to do this with only one line. Group A gets in line then boards, then B, then C without the {mess} of the 5 line system of UA.
Couple observations that United should copy.
1. Families board AFTER group A has boarded but before group B.
2. Medical pre boarding requires getting a pre board pass from the counter NOT just randomly joining the disabled pre boarding group.
3. Boarding group A 1-15 is reserved for WN's version of "Business Class" Business Select fare payers. All other elites via A List level get assigned AFTER the paid Business Select boards.
4. Maybe implement some sort of line numbering system to prevent gate lice and ENFORCE IT.
For all the ills people talk about WN's boarding system, I thought it was a REALLY fair system, that they actually enforced and also rewards those who paid the highest fares, and elites. Also, WN is able to do this with only one line. Group A gets in line then boards, then B, then C without the {mess} of the 5 line system of UA.
#37
Join Date: May 2005
Location: PHX
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It works for WN, but if you think for even a second about it, they reserve A 1-15 for Elites and people buying more expensive fares. So on a flight with 143 (-700) and 175 seats (-800) they have 15 elite/business travelers. On many UA (or DL or AA) flights actual elites/business travelers may be 30-50% of the passengers. WN just has a very different customer base which requires different solutions.
A16-A60 will only go to non-status passengers if they are not all taken by A-list and A-list Preferred "elites". It's possible that even then there are so many A-list and A-list Preferred customers that some of them get B boarding numbers. However in that case they are allowed to board after A60 and before the B group starts.
So to say that WN only has 15 elite/business travelers on a given flight is simply not correct.
#38
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#39
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#40
Join Date: Jan 2016
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#41
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In short, I was miserable.
I'm sure if you're a smaller individual the seats are ok, but they simply don't work for me.
#42
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The slimlines are too narrow (I have to get lucky and sit next to a small person not to have the shoulder-squeeze go on the whole flight), and there was very little knee room (can't recall if I had any at all...the seat in front of me may have been contacting my knees the whole flight).
#43
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: What I write is my opinion alone..don't read into it anything not written.
Posts: 9,684
Kacee hit this one on the head. WN of the 4 big players is consistently/significantly at the bottom, lingering with AA. DL has been tops, with UA right behind DL. When WN started to fly to more expensive, more congested primary airports years back, their system performance has fallen below all the other major carriers. And their cost structure has increased at the same time, passing those costs on to the consumers. But reputation lags reality for a long time.
#44
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The worst thing about the Evolve (aka Devolve) seats is that their seats used to be really comfortable, as we both have noted. It made the typical WN shenanigans (20-person preboard entourages, seat saving, line jumping) tolerable.
#45
Suspended
Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 1,808
My parents and I flew to ABQ this past weekend on Southwest Airlines since United had some terrible schedules into ABQ. This was the first time I've flown WN since they implemented the group + line number boarding system. I paid for Early Bird checkin and was assigned Group A 26, 27 and 28. I was quite amazed at how orderly the boarding process was. The only "cattle call" was on my last 4 United flights. Gate lice are not an issue since everyone has a line number.
Couple observations that United should copy.
1. Families board AFTER group A has boarded but before group B.
2. Medical pre boarding requires getting a pre board pass from the counter NOT just randomly joining the disabled pre boarding group.
3. Boarding group A 1-15 is reserved for WN's version of "Business Class" Business Select fare payers. All other elites via A List level get assigned AFTER the paid Business Select boards.
4. Maybe implement some sort of line numbering system to prevent gate lice and ENFORCE IT.
For all the ills people talk about WN's boarding system, I thought it was a REALLY fair system, that they actually enforced and also rewards those who paid the highest fares, and elites. Also, WN is able to do this with only one line. Group A gets in line then boards, then B, then C without the {mess} of the 5 line system of UA.
Couple observations that United should copy.
1. Families board AFTER group A has boarded but before group B.
2. Medical pre boarding requires getting a pre board pass from the counter NOT just randomly joining the disabled pre boarding group.
3. Boarding group A 1-15 is reserved for WN's version of "Business Class" Business Select fare payers. All other elites via A List level get assigned AFTER the paid Business Select boards.
4. Maybe implement some sort of line numbering system to prevent gate lice and ENFORCE IT.
For all the ills people talk about WN's boarding system, I thought it was a REALLY fair system, that they actually enforced and also rewards those who paid the highest fares, and elites. Also, WN is able to do this with only one line. Group A gets in line then boards, then B, then C without the {mess} of the 5 line system of UA.
EBCI is a perfect case of giving you a disease and then selling you the cure. They take extra revenue by people trying to avoid a problem WN themselves have created: Having to roll the dice and having to interrupt your day 24 hours beforehand to check in. Worse still, the program gets exploited by groups who buy 1, EBCI ticket, and then save seats for their companions..thereby devaluing the product for others that have paid for it. As WN refuses to take a stance on seat saving, don't expect them to make any effort to end this practice. What's more, it really doesn't offer much when you take into account thru pax. If WN simply had assigned seating, none of this would be an issue.
WN is all coach class. As such, the rewards are not that great. You get a free coach seat after a huge amount of flying, but one that is not assigned and still requires you to get into the scrum. No first class..no lounges..no points xferable to intl long hauls.
No bag fee is nice, but let's face it, most of us FF'er never check bags anyhow. No change fees is also nice, but not completely true either if there is a $ differential between flights when you have to pay the diff. Flying 2 times a week for 10 years, I have only ever had to change a flight once anyhow, so for me, it's not an incentive. It may be for those with more fluid schedules.
Fly WN enough, and you will see that the seating system they have is more pain than pleasure. In almost every flight there are kettles who cannot figure it out, companions sneaking on with their lower number companions, line cutting, and a lack of enforcement for boarding order. I prefer to choose my seat beforehand. I know what I am doing, I know where I want to sit, and I know how to get it.
This is subjective, but I also find the experience of WN very very taxing. The whole camp-counselor chumminess schtick, while amusing to the average late middle aged white male AM radio listener, is simply cringy when you have to deal with it a few times a week. The cornball jokes, the stupid hold messages (remember WN Rap?) on their phones, the egalitarian bragging. I prefer an exclusive, NON egalitarian, mature attitude after flying so much. A bit of dignity.
I still fly WN but in very limted circumstances. The flight has to be under 2 hours, direct, and the only available option on the route. Even then I buy Biz Select and hold my nose.