Seat belt sign is out of control at UA
#106
Join Date: May 2009
Location: EWR
Programs: UA .5M, Vistana 1-Star owner
Posts: 992
UA indeed abuses it but for profitable reasons:
- less pax in aisles so FA's can shuttle materials between gallies
- less bathroom use thus less cleaning
- customers in seats are more likely to order for-buy-up items
- less liability when turbulence happens thus less legal fees
- less wear on cabin due to less foot traffic
- less problems with customers unhappily squeezing past each other; can't wait for the 77X's 3-4-3 to narrow the aisles even more
- reduce f/a need to tend to overall requests while they're in the gallies near the bathrooms
#107
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: PHL
Programs: UA 1K 1MM, Marriott Gold, IHG Platinum, Raddison Platinum, Avis Presidents Club
Posts: 5,256
I think the cockpit crew just forgets to turn it off. When they hit turbulence or get a report, that triggers it to turn on. There isn't anything to trigger them to turn it off other than passing to the next sector and getting a new turbulence report saying its clear. Also, I'm sure the err on the side of caution, your chance of getting injured while belted in is much lower than not belted in.
However, pilots should know better than anyone about the danger of nuisance alarms. If you keep it on the entire flight. Passengers eventually need to get up to use the lav and now you have no way of gauging how safe it is because the pilot took away the only indicator. It's equivalent to keeping it off the entire flight
However, pilots should know better than anyone about the danger of nuisance alarms. If you keep it on the entire flight. Passengers eventually need to get up to use the lav and now you have no way of gauging how safe it is because the pilot took away the only indicator. It's equivalent to keeping it off the entire flight
#108
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: TPA
Programs: UA Global Services 3MM, Hyatt Lifetime Globalist
Posts: 2,926
After 90 minutes I was about to have renal failure so went to the bathroom - yes you are right no one stopped me.... Still don't get what I perceive as an amazingly aggressive / conservative seatbelt sign on position.... For those of you considering its just a single flight / captain thing I've found this behavior amazingly consistent on UA - and amazingly absent in other carriers....
#109
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: EWR, PHL
Programs: UA1k 3MM, AA Plt, peasant on everybody else, elite something or other at a bunch of hotels.
Posts: 4,637
I find excessive use of the seat belt sign to be the case with USA carriers in general, but if you think UA is bad, then don't fly AA. Their pilots are hyper aggressive in keeping the seat belt sign on. I was on a flight ICN-DFW 2 months ago and the sign was on for all but about 1-2 hours - with very little turbulence.
Most foreign carriers are much better about this, although I too find CA to follow the AA model, with the sign on most of the flight - and ignored by pax.
Most foreign carriers are much better about this, although I too find CA to follow the AA model, with the sign on most of the flight - and ignored by pax.
#111
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: PHX
Programs: AS 75K; UA 1MM; Hyatt Globalist; Marriott LTP; Hilton Diamond (Aspire)
Posts: 56,291
I agree and it does seem to be getting worse.
It evidence's crew's disregard for passenger comfort. Particularly with all the delays these days, by the time aircraft's at cruising altitude, we may have been strapped in our seats for 90 minutes or more.
So if there's no turbulence, turn it off! Don't make the pax - many of whom are uncomfortable breaking rules - sit and sweat it out in discomfort. I eventually just get up and go. That usually starts a stream of pax who have also been sitting in discomfort and all of whom now feel kind of silly for having waited so long.
It evidence's crew's disregard for passenger comfort. Particularly with all the delays these days, by the time aircraft's at cruising altitude, we may have been strapped in our seats for 90 minutes or more.
So if there's no turbulence, turn it off! Don't make the pax - many of whom are uncomfortable breaking rules - sit and sweat it out in discomfort. I eventually just get up and go. That usually starts a stream of pax who have also been sitting in discomfort and all of whom now feel kind of silly for having waited so long.
#112
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: TPA
Programs: UA Global Services 3MM, Hyatt Lifetime Globalist
Posts: 2,926
I agree and it does seem to be getting worse.
It evidence's crew's disregard for passenger comfort. Particularly with all the delays these days, by the time aircraft's at cruising altitude, we may have been strapped in our seats for 90 minutes or more.
So if there's no turbulence, turn it off! Don't make the pax - many of whom are uncomfortable breaking rules - sit and sweat it out in discomfort. I eventually just get up and go. That usually starts a stream of pax who have also been sitting in discomfort and all of whom now feel kind of silly for having waited so long.
It evidence's crew's disregard for passenger comfort. Particularly with all the delays these days, by the time aircraft's at cruising altitude, we may have been strapped in our seats for 90 minutes or more.
So if there's no turbulence, turn it off! Don't make the pax - many of whom are uncomfortable breaking rules - sit and sweat it out in discomfort. I eventually just get up and go. That usually starts a stream of pax who have also been sitting in discomfort and all of whom now feel kind of silly for having waited so long.
#113
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Cleveland, Ohio, USA
Programs: UA PM, DL PM, Bonvoy Titanium, HH Gold
Posts: 1,288
Just landed on UA 840 SYD-LAX and the seat belt sign was ridiculously used. Took about 55 minutes for it to turn off after and came on at least 5 times (when I was awake) any time it hit mild turbulence.
Agree with the others. Heck, some foreign carriers (like SQ) turn it off even while still in the incline and not even at cruising altitude. I don't get UA's attitude on this one.
Agree with the others. Heck, some foreign carriers (like SQ) turn it off even while still in the incline and not even at cruising altitude. I don't get UA's attitude on this one.
#114
Join Date: Apr 2015
Programs: United Global Services, Amtrak Select Executive
Posts: 4,068
My experience is that the FAs are annoyed by it as well, as they know people are gonna get up regardless, and they need to say, "I have to tell you to please take your seat", just to be ignored. My practice is that if it's safe enough for the FAs to be up and about serving food and drinks, then it's safe enough for me to use the bathroom.
#115
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Austin, TX - AUS
Programs: AA Platinum, Hilton, Hyatt, IHG, Marriott
Posts: 1,622
Air China abuses the seatbelt sign the most of all the airlines I have flown. I flew 6 Air China flights recently - the seat belt sign stayed on the entire flight.
#116
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: HaMerkaz/Exit 145
Programs: UA, LY, BA, AA
Posts: 13,167
I have generally found UA, going back to CO, just kept it on almost always. They'll take it off once they reach cruising altitude for about 5 minutes before putting it back on. Almost like an indicator that you can now get up and about. But it's mostly on. I've seen similar on AA, but not DL.
On foreign airlines, it's basically off always accept when it has to be on (takeoff, landing, turbulence).
I've generally seen enforcement strict during takeoff, landing, turbulence, and special announcements as well as service, but lax at other points
On foreign airlines, it's basically off always accept when it has to be on (takeoff, landing, turbulence).
I've generally seen enforcement strict during takeoff, landing, turbulence, and special announcements as well as service, but lax at other points
#117
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: ORD
Programs: UA Silver, Marriott Platinum/LT Platinum, Hilton Gold
Posts: 5,594
My experience is that the FAs are annoyed by it as well, as they know people are gonna get up regardless, and they need to say, "I have to tell you to please take your seat", just to be ignored. My practice is that if it's safe enough for the FAs to be up and about serving food and drinks, then it's safe enough for me to use the bathroom.
My opinion is I haven't noticed it on UA any more than other U.S. airlines (I mostly fly UA though). There's clearly a significant difference when you compare to European airlines.
#118
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Virginia, USA
Posts: 4,492
I used to think the reason was benign ("they forgot") but I now think some crew use it for pax control (e.g., clear aisles for FA service, cockpit "security," and mostly "just because..."). It will , and does, create a "cry wolf" reaction among pax.
#119
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Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: DEN
Programs: UA MM Plat; AA MM Gold; HHonors Diamond
Posts: 15,866
Scratching my head over this thread. Yesterday's DEN-PIT flight was typical in my view...seatbelt light went off at 10k and was turned back on once for maybe 10 minutes when we hit bumps near Chicago. If the light IS on in smooth air there's never been any issue getting up to use the facilities...just don't ask if it's OK.
Maybe some flight crews err on the side of caution and/or there may be liability issues. Have any US airlines been sued because there were turbulence-related injuries when the seatbelt sign was off?
Maybe some flight crews err on the side of caution and/or there may be liability issues. Have any US airlines been sued because there were turbulence-related injuries when the seatbelt sign was off?