Jun 8, 2015, 5:51 am
Last edit by: UA1K_no_more
Thanks to member mre5765 for starting and maintaining this wikipost in the older thread.
General
LH has more wifi in its long haul fleet than UA.
LH Y vs UA Y
LH has free booze. And better booze than UA.
UA has E+. LH has true premium economy (separate booking class at a premium)
LH J vs UA J
All LH J seats have now been upgraded. However the window seats on 747-8i and all middle pairs of seats are arranged so that the feet of adjacent pax converge toward each other. Both UA J seats have a barrier that prevents kneeing, and the foot rests are well separated to prevent playing footsie.
Some people assert service and food in LH J is better, some say UA J is better, and others say there is no difference or that it varies flight to flight. LH J serves food on trays, but there are linens on the tray table and on the tray itself.
The trend at LH is that as it invests more in hard premium product, the soft aspects slip, because the hard product is an inflexible cost whereas the soft aspects are highly flexible.
The booze on LH J is better than UA J.
The IFE selections on UA are better than LH.
The amenity kit on UA J beats the LH J amenity kit.
LH F vs UA F
All LH planes with F now have the new F seat (748, 388, 346, 333). Ground services on LH F are better: the first class lounge, first class terminal (UA does not have one), and the tarmac limo service to your plane (UA only as this for GS and GF pax who have tight connections).
Standards in the FCT/FCL are slipping. A year or two ago one could expect limitless, whole macadamias and high end chocolates. Gone.
The new LH F seat is superior to the new UA F seat. However, the F cabin in the 747-8i is much more cramped than any GF cabin. Indeed, the 747-8i F cabin is more cramped than the upper deck of the 747-8i J cabin.
Another plus for LH is often the F cabins are sparsely filled, whereas, due to UA's employee contracts, unsold seats will invariably go to non rev employees.
The service and food on LH F is vastly superior to UA F. However standards are slipping. A year or two ago, an F pax was offered as many of the different appetizers as he wanted, and a second round of caviar. These offers are gone.
The booze on LH F is vastly superior to UA F.
The IFE selections on UA are better than LH.
The amenity kit on UA F beats the LH F amenity kit.
Overall, FT consensus in the UA and M&M forums is LH F is a better choice regardless of new F, old F, or gauge.
Overall
LH F > GF > BF > LH J > LH Y+ > UA E+ > LH Y > UA E-
Earlier threads
LH vs UA, which is better?
Best flight choice UA/LH TATL in business
General
LH has more wifi in its long haul fleet than UA.
LH Y vs UA Y
LH has free booze. And better booze than UA.
UA has E+. LH has true premium economy (separate booking class at a premium)
LH J vs UA J
All LH J seats have now been upgraded. However the window seats on 747-8i and all middle pairs of seats are arranged so that the feet of adjacent pax converge toward each other. Both UA J seats have a barrier that prevents kneeing, and the foot rests are well separated to prevent playing footsie.
Some people assert service and food in LH J is better, some say UA J is better, and others say there is no difference or that it varies flight to flight. LH J serves food on trays, but there are linens on the tray table and on the tray itself.
The trend at LH is that as it invests more in hard premium product, the soft aspects slip, because the hard product is an inflexible cost whereas the soft aspects are highly flexible.
The booze on LH J is better than UA J.
The IFE selections on UA are better than LH.
The amenity kit on UA J beats the LH J amenity kit.
LH F vs UA F
All LH planes with F now have the new F seat (748, 388, 346, 333). Ground services on LH F are better: the first class lounge, first class terminal (UA does not have one), and the tarmac limo service to your plane (UA only as this for GS and GF pax who have tight connections).
Standards in the FCT/FCL are slipping. A year or two ago one could expect limitless, whole macadamias and high end chocolates. Gone.
The new LH F seat is superior to the new UA F seat. However, the F cabin in the 747-8i is much more cramped than any GF cabin. Indeed, the 747-8i F cabin is more cramped than the upper deck of the 747-8i J cabin.
Another plus for LH is often the F cabins are sparsely filled, whereas, due to UA's employee contracts, unsold seats will invariably go to non rev employees.
The service and food on LH F is vastly superior to UA F. However standards are slipping. A year or two ago, an F pax was offered as many of the different appetizers as he wanted, and a second round of caviar. These offers are gone.
The booze on LH F is vastly superior to UA F.
The IFE selections on UA are better than LH.
The amenity kit on UA F beats the LH F amenity kit.
Overall, FT consensus in the UA and M&M forums is LH F is a better choice regardless of new F, old F, or gauge.
Overall
LH F > GF > BF > LH J > LH Y+ > UA E+ > LH Y > UA E-
Earlier threads
LH vs UA, which is better?
Best flight choice UA/LH TATL in business
Discussion of Flying Lufthansa vs. United [2015 onward]
Sep 5, 2016, 8:01 am
#227
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: LAX
Programs: UA:1k; MR: PLT; Hilton: Gold
Posts: 1,324
Which UA 777? The 3 class with 8 across on J? And is this a night flight you'd want to sleep on or a day flight? Is your total out of pocket the same for each option, or is one meaningfully more expensive?
In my view, the 8 across J is really like a PE product that goes flat. So if it's not a night flight you'd want to sleep on, and if LH PE is cheaper than the B + mileage, I'd go with LH PE.
Also, is the B refundable or changeable without penalty? If so, could always hold out and see if your upgrade clears, and if it looks bad, switch over to LH or another option.
In my view, the 8 across J is really like a PE product that goes flat. So if it's not a night flight you'd want to sleep on, and if LH PE is cheaper than the B + mileage, I'd go with LH PE.
Also, is the B refundable or changeable without penalty? If so, could always hold out and see if your upgrade clears, and if it looks bad, switch over to LH or another option.
Sep 5, 2016, 8:47 am
#229
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: PHX
Programs: AS 75K; UA 1MM; Hyatt Globalist; Marriott LTP; Hilton Diamond (Aspire)
Posts: 56,454
Sep 5, 2016, 9:20 am
#230
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Florida
Programs: UA Gold, Marriott Gold
Posts: 276
Sep 5, 2016, 9:30 am
#231
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: DCA
Programs: UA 1K; *G and *A Top 1000; HHonors Diamond; *$ Gold; Global Entry
Posts: 2,272
I've flown on LH PE on the 748. Wasn't really impressed. Meals are the same as regular Y. Seats are a bit wider but I found the foot rest completely useless. The PE window seat is odd; it's too far away from the window for you to be able to rest up against the window.
Go with the UA777 in Y+ with possibility of an upgrade.
Go with the UA777 in Y+ with possibility of an upgrade.
Sep 5, 2016, 11:38 am
#232
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: SEA
Programs: UA Plat, AS MVP, HH Gold, MR Gold
Posts: 1,848
If you're buying a B fare, you can upgrade to J on LH with miles. Depending on the route, availability can be pretty good.
I find LH PE to be vastly better than E+. They key thing for me is that there is enough space that I don't end up involuntarily touching, or being touched by, other people. However, I have not yet figured out the PE fares that allow mileage upgrades to J.
I find LH PE to be vastly better than E+. They key thing for me is that there is enough space that I don't end up involuntarily touching, or being touched by, other people. However, I have not yet figured out the PE fares that allow mileage upgrades to J.
Last edited by PVDProf; Sep 5, 2016 at 1:01 pm
Sep 5, 2016, 4:52 pm
#233
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Our nation's capital
Programs: UA 1K & 0.6 MM
Posts: 781
Thanks for the comments, everyone. I'll be coming from India so will have one red-eye flight on which to sleep (hopefully in PE) before I hit this next one home. So the lie-flat will be welcome if the 1:50AM departure prior to it is a nightmare and I get no sleep in E- on a LH 344.
I usually go with UA bird to (a) maximize the upgrade likelihoods and (b) get the 150% PQMs, but with LH only (b) really applies. I have to book with UA codeshares (Fly America Act) so the upgrade with miles on a LH ticket becomes more complicated because it's a UA flight number.
Cost wise, the B fare is changeable with very few penalties so in theory I can change online ahead of time. When I am in the FRA lounge the day of the flight, however, UA charges a pretty penny for me to change that flight. (I tried in June and just waited it out.)
I will hang tight with the 777. Thanks for giving me so many good things to think about.
cheers!
I usually go with UA bird to (a) maximize the upgrade likelihoods and (b) get the 150% PQMs, but with LH only (b) really applies. I have to book with UA codeshares (Fly America Act) so the upgrade with miles on a LH ticket becomes more complicated because it's a UA flight number.
Cost wise, the B fare is changeable with very few penalties so in theory I can change online ahead of time. When I am in the FRA lounge the day of the flight, however, UA charges a pretty penny for me to change that flight. (I tried in June and just waited it out.)
I will hang tight with the 777. Thanks for giving me so many good things to think about.
cheers!
Sep 29, 2016, 3:10 pm
#234
Join Date: May 1999
Location: Central New Jersey
Programs: UA-Platimum 2 MM, HH-Gold, MR-Lifetime Gold, Hyatt-Discoverist
Posts: 6,238
LH Trans Atlantic- Where Have You Been All My Life?
I've been a long time UA (former CO) flyer out of EWR, and in general have taken the non stops on UA metal to/from Europe in coach. Not bad, but not great--I recently had the experience of doing a codeshare on LH (MUC-EWR), and can't believe the difference. Food was great, but the biggest change was in the beverage dept. Their cart had the usual red/white wines, but also hard liquors, champagne etc, and they did not just come by with the meal service, but several times before and after refilling and offering beverages. The food was also several notches above UA, and for the first time (probably ever), I ate the entire meal
. Now I have used LH in Biz on a couple of occasions, but this was the first time I was able to compare LH with UA in coach. Is this usual -- or did I just luck out? I've got a couple more LH codeshares coming up and am actually looking forward to coach
PS- also for some crazy reason, my UA MP account was credited for a lot more miles on the codeshare than I received on my outbound UA EWR-BRU flight (like more than double)??
. Now I have used LH in Biz on a couple of occasions, but this was the first time I was able to compare LH with UA in coach. Is this usual -- or did I just luck out? I've got a couple more LH codeshares coming up and am actually looking forward to coachPS- also for some crazy reason, my UA MP account was credited for a lot more miles on the codeshare than I received on my outbound UA EWR-BRU flight (like more than double)??
Sep 29, 2016, 3:55 pm
#235
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Danville, CA, USA;
Programs: UA 1MM, WN CP, Marriott LT Plat, Hilton Gold, IC Plat
Posts: 15,720
It is amazing how good the wines are on some carriers. I was on a 6-hour ANA flight last week - the angled seating was horrid but the French wines were really good. Then I connected to a 10-hour UA 747 flight where the seating was good (lie flat, but 8-across) but the Zinfandel was undrinkable. LH and ANA also have better beer than UA. Flying LH is pretty much a no-brainer now that LH installed lie-flat across its long-haul fleet (or so I'm told).
Sep 29, 2016, 4:19 pm
#236
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: SEA
Programs: UA Plat, AS MVP, HH Gold, MR Gold
Posts: 1,848
Food was great, but the biggest change was in the beverage dept. Their cart had the usual red/white wines, but also hard liquors, champagne etc, and they did not just come by with the meal service, but several times before and after refilling and offering beverages. The food was also several notches above UA, and for the first time (probably ever), I ate the entire meal.
.The main drawback to LH is getting stuck in a 31" pitch seat, but I've had very good luck getting bulkheads and exit rows at check-in. I've also had modest luck buying (at a reasonable price) or getting op-upped to Prem, which is an extra incentive.
Higher segment value? How did the PQDs compare?
Sep 29, 2016, 4:32 pm
#237
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Suburban Philadelphia
Programs: Marriott Lifetime Plat, IHG Gold
Posts: 3,392
I've been a long time UA (former CO) flyer out of EWR, and in general have taken the non stops on UA metal to/from Europe in coach. Not bad, but not great--I recently had the experience of doing a codeshare on LH (MUC-EWR), and can't believe the difference. Food was great, but the biggest change was in the beverage dept. Their cart had the usual red/white wines, but also hard liquors, champagne etc, and they did not just come by with the meal service, but several times before and after refilling and offering beverages. The food was also several notches above UA, and for the first time (probably ever), I ate the entire meal. Now I have used LH in Biz on a couple of occasions, but this was the first time I was able to compare LH with UA in coach. Is this usual -- or did I just luck out? I've got a couple more LH codeshares coming up and am actually looking forward to coach
PS- also for some crazy reason, my UA MP account was credited for a lot more miles on the codeshare than I received on my outbound UA EWR-BRU flight (like more than double)??
. Now I have used LH in Biz on a couple of occasions, but this was the first time I was able to compare LH with UA in coach. Is this usual -- or did I just luck out? I've got a couple more LH codeshares coming up and am actually looking forward to coachPS- also for some crazy reason, my UA MP account was credited for a lot more miles on the codeshare than I received on my outbound UA EWR-BRU flight (like more than double)??
As for me, I will never set foot on a LH long haul in coach. I don't care if there's a free bottle of Dom involved, IME the seat stinks especially compared to UA E+
Sep 29, 2016, 4:41 pm
#238
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Carmel Valley(was Hawaii)
Programs: United 1K 2.7 MM
Posts: 1,174
I've been a long time UA (former CO) flyer out of EWR, and in general have taken the non stops on UA metal to/from Europe in coach. Not bad, but not great--I recently had the experience of doing a codeshare on LH (MUC-EWR), and can't believe the difference. Food was great, but the biggest change was in the beverage dept. Their cart had the usual red/white wines, but also hard liquors, champagne etc, and they did not just come by with the meal service, but several times before and after refilling and offering beverages. The food was also several notches above UA, and for the first time (probably ever), I ate the entire meal. Now I have used LH in Biz on a couple of occasions, but this was the first time I was able to compare LH with UA in coach. Is this usual -- or did I just luck out? I've got a couple more LH codeshares coming up and am actually looking forward to coach
PS- also for some crazy reason, my UA MP account was credited for a lot more miles on the codeshare than I received on my outbound UA EWR-BRU flight (like more than double)??
. Now I have used LH in Biz on a couple of occasions, but this was the first time I was able to compare LH with UA in coach. Is this usual -- or did I just luck out? I've got a couple more LH codeshares coming up and am actually looking forward to coachPS- also for some crazy reason, my UA MP account was credited for a lot more miles on the codeshare than I received on my outbound UA EWR-BRU flight (like more than double)??
Sep 29, 2016, 5:33 pm
#239
Join Date: May 1999
Location: Central New Jersey
Programs: UA-Platimum 2 MM, HH-Gold, MR-Lifetime Gold, Hyatt-Discoverist
Posts: 6,238
Premier economy, and I lucked out with an empty seat next to me, on a very full flight. I also enjoyed the availability of beverages in the galley.
Not an issue for me, as I'm a not very large woman, and actually thought UA's E+ more uncomfortable.
Yes, that is most likely the reason. I paid about $850 for a EWR(UA)-BRU(LOT)-to WAW with LH WAW-MUC-EWR. Costwise the UA portion was a third of the LH price.
Yes, that is most likely the reason. I paid about $850 for a EWR(UA)-BRU(LOT)-to WAW with LH WAW-MUC-EWR. Costwise the UA portion was a third of the LH price.
Last edited by goalie; Sep 29, 2016 at 6:51 pm Reason: Merge-please use multi-quote
Sep 30, 2016, 5:40 am
#240
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Suburban Philadelphia
Programs: Marriott Lifetime Plat, IHG Gold
Posts: 3,392
Premier economy, and I lucked out with an empty seat next to me, on a very full flight. I also enjoyed the availability of beverages in the galley.
Not an issue for me, as I'm a not very large woman, and actually thought UA's E+ more uncomfortable.
Yes, that is most likely the reason. I paid about $850 for a EWR(UA)-BRU(LOT)-to WAW with LH WAW-MUC-EWR. Costwise the UA portion was a third of the LH price.
Not an issue for me, as I'm a not very large woman, and actually thought UA's E+ more uncomfortable.
Yes, that is most likely the reason. I paid about $850 for a EWR(UA)-BRU(LOT)-to WAW with LH WAW-MUC-EWR. Costwise the UA portion was a third of the LH price.