Apr 21, 2014, 11:37 am
Last edit by: Pat89339
A number of folks with award flights booked on CA (Air China) found their reservations cancelled. The only notification of cancellation appears to be an email in from UA written in chinese. UA reps confirmed that cancellations were made online and CA award space was no longer available. UA can rebook on other flights when award space is available.
It is plausible that a third party with access to PNR and pax name on the flight can fraudulently cancel an existing itinerary and book the reopened award seat.
Affected FlyerTalk members — with links to where in this discussion they posted their experiences — include:
It is plausible that a third party with access to PNR and pax name on the flight can fraudulently cancel an existing itinerary and book the reopened award seat.
Affected FlyerTalk members — with links to where in this discussion they posted their experiences — include:
- MikeMpls
- nihaoa
- lewende Reported 4 friends with this issue
- ordbkk
- twebst
- kb1992
- litesleeper
- zombietooth
- critten Reported 2/3 confirmations (3 people CA Business class) cancelled at the same time
- skyvanman Also 1 friend with the issue
- chris1234
- atiger29
- bubble o bill
- genemk2
- jefftiger
- CuddlyFlyer
- gpeso8
- imm2b
- acf1270
- dgxoxo
- ACM two passengers
It seems everybody wants to see the message.. here was mine:
united.com 通知 - 航班预订取消
2014年4月17日 (星期四)
united.com | 优惠促销 | 预订 | 赢取前程万里 (MileagePlus®) 奖励里程 | 我的帐户
先生 ORDBKK
您的预订 MYRES123 已取消，我们已收到您的退款申请。申请信用卡退款需 7 个工作日。如果信用卡退款未在一个付款周期内寄出，请联系信用卡公司。对于包括现金退款在内的 所有其他形式 的付款，需要 20 个工作日。
如需详细信息或查看退款的状态，请访问 united.com 并提供您的机票号码。
感谢您使用 united.com
电子邮件信息
请不要使用“回复”地址回复此邮件。
此电子邮件中的信息仅供原接收人使用。
如果您遇到技术问题，请通过电子邮件或电话联系 united.com 服务支持。
通知：机票取消确认
电子邮件地址: ORDBKK@MYEMAIL
2014年4月17日 (星期四)
united.com | 优惠促销 | 预订 | 赢取前程万里 (MileagePlus®) 奖励里程 | 我的帐户
先生 ORDBKK
您的预订 MYRES123 已取消，我们已收到您的退款申请。申请信用卡退款需 7 个工作日。如果信用卡退款未在一个付款周期内寄出，请联系信用卡公司。对于包括现金退款在内的 所有其他形式 的付款，需要 20 个工作日。
如需详细信息或查看退款的状态，请访问 united.com 并提供您的机票号码。
感谢您使用 united.com
电子邮件信息
请不要使用“回复”地址回复此邮件。
此电子邮件中的信息仅供原接收人使用。
如果您遇到技术问题，请通过电子邮件或电话联系 united.com 服务支持。
通知：机票取消确认
电子邮件地址: ORDBKK@MYEMAIL
Originally Posted by ordbkk View Post
For tracking purposes, I went through the 27 pages of this thread and compiled a list of those affected:
MikeMpls
nihaoa
lewende (reported 4 friends with this issue)
ordbkk
twebst
kb1992
litesleeper
zombietooth
critten
skyvanman (also 1 friend with the issue)
jefftiger (but, happened during October 2013)
So we're at 13 people affected, although some like critten have had multiple trips canceled.
From what I understand, all of these occurred in the last 3 weeks.
For tracking purposes, I went through the 27 pages of this thread and compiled a list of those affected:
MikeMpls
nihaoa
lewende (reported 4 friends with this issue)
ordbkk
twebst
kb1992
litesleeper
zombietooth
critten
skyvanman (also 1 friend with the issue)
jefftiger (but, happened during October 2013)
So we're at 13 people affected, although some like critten have had multiple trips canceled.
From what I understand, all of these occurred in the last 3 weeks.
2014 UA Issued Awards on Air China (CA) Are Mysteriously Being Canceled (Hacked?)
Apr 18, 2014, 9:32 am
#151
Join Date: Aug 2011
Programs: UA 1K
Posts: 8,634
But why would someone cancel a random award ITIN? To what purpose beyond spite? It is possible to cancel one and then immediately grab the seats for yourself? I never had the impression that the seats would automatically go back into the award inventory. But if they do, and if UA cares, it should be possible to go into the system to look for a cancellation and then an immediate booking on another account.
Apr 18, 2014, 9:38 am
#152
Join Date: May 2000
Location: Houston, TX, USA
Programs: UA 1K, AA Lifetime Platinum, DL Platinum, Honors Diamond, Bonvoy Titanium, Hertz Platinum
Posts: 7,969
Well, duh! 
Let's assume for a moment that cancelled Air China award reservations go back into award inventory automatically and immediately. It may not work that way on UA, but it does on some carriers, so it's not unreasonable to think that it does on Air China.
Imagine yourself being a premium cabin broker (er, "Discount Business/First Class Travel Agent") in China that has access a pool of miles on Air China (or any of its partners). When you have a client that wants to buy a ticket, you find someone on that flight with an award booked through UA (through your secret contact on the inside). Armed with the PNR and passenger name, you go to the Chinese website that's been talked about where you can cancel a reservation with just PNR and last name, and do so. You then immediately book the freed-up award seat using miles in whatever currency you have access to, then sell that ticket to your client.
Let's assume for a moment that cancelled Air China award reservations go back into award inventory automatically and immediately. It may not work that way on UA, but it does on some carriers, so it's not unreasonable to think that it does on Air China. Imagine yourself being a premium cabin broker (er, "Discount Business/First Class Travel Agent") in China that has access a pool of miles on Air China (or any of its partners). When you have a client that wants to buy a ticket, you find someone on that flight with an award booked through UA (through your secret contact on the inside). Armed with the PNR and passenger name, you go to the Chinese website that's been talked about where you can cancel a reservation with just PNR and last name, and do so. You then immediately book the freed-up award seat using miles in whatever currency you have access to, then sell that ticket to your client.
Apr 18, 2014, 9:44 am
#153
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Chicago
Programs: UA 1k
Posts: 83
Update: I've been on the phone with United again this morning for about an hour. I am lucky to have a very professional and sympathetic agent this time. She sounds just as sick over this whole thing as I am, and she's currently speaking with her Air China counterparts. Not surprisingly, they are being less than helpful. My chances look bleak.
Apr 18, 2014, 9:59 am
#154
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 514
Maybe Air China should be kicked out of Star Alliance if found guilty of this.
Im seeing a lot of threads of this based on Air China. Sounds like Smisek needs to call Air China's CEO to see what is going on. Sadly that won't happen. I say kick them out of Star Alliance.
Wow, seeing a lot of these. Someone has to figure out why all of these are getting cancelled?
Im seeing a lot of threads of this based on Air China. Sounds like Smisek needs to call Air China's CEO to see what is going on. Sadly that won't happen. I say kick them out of Star Alliance.
Wow, seeing a lot of these. Someone has to figure out why all of these are getting cancelled?
Last edited by Ocn Vw 1K; Apr 18, 2014 at 8:56 pm Reason: Combine consecutive posts of same member.
Apr 18, 2014, 10:10 am
#155
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Sun & beach destinations
Programs: UA-lifetime Platinum (2MM), IHG-Amb, HH-Diamond, Hertz-PC, Marriott-Gold, CX-AM
Posts: 1,427
OP, I feel your frustration and sorry to hear that.
People who currently have any award reservations that contain CA flight need to babysit them everyday. If possible, try to change the CA segments to other carriers. I have 2 upcoming award reservations that contains CA flights. I guess I will search for other carriers that flies the same route to or out of China. Sad!
People who currently have any award reservations that contain CA flight need to babysit them everyday. If possible, try to change the CA segments to other carriers. I have 2 upcoming award reservations that contains CA flights. I guess I will search for other carriers that flies the same route to or out of China. Sad!
Apr 18, 2014, 10:14 am
#156
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Jersey Shore/YYZ
Programs: UA 1K, Marriott Plat, Hilton Diamond, Hertz PC
Posts: 12,521
United has lax security, allowing customer reservations to be canceled. United is aware of their security problems and lets them continue. United looks the other way when this happens. And who benefits when customers have to fly United instead of other carriers? United....... They're not a "victim" here, and they should not be let off the hook when they are complacent about fraud.
Apr 18, 2014, 10:17 am
#157
Join Date: Jan 2013
Programs: UA 1K
Posts: 10
It doesn't work that way on Air China, either. Cancelling an award ticket doesn't automatically open an I or O seat.
Apr 18, 2014, 10:20 am
#158
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Colorado
Programs: United MM (formerly 1K), Marriott Lifetime Gold
Posts: 551
Update: I've been on the phone with United again this morning for about an hour. I am lucky to have a very professional and sympathetic agent this time. She sounds just as sick over this whole thing as I am, and she's currently speaking with her Air China counterparts. Not surprisingly, they are being less than helpful. My chances look bleak.
Apr 18, 2014, 10:24 am
#159
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: ORD
Programs: UA 1K
Posts: 16,900
Well, Air China should have logs that would show the origination of the cancellation. Whether or not they care enough to go looking is another matter, but UA and/or *Alliance should be able to exert some pressure.
Apr 18, 2014, 10:24 am
#160
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Jersey Shore/YYZ
Programs: UA 1K, Marriott Plat, Hilton Diamond, Hertz PC
Posts: 12,521
This "by any means necessary" kind of thinking leads to poor outcomes for those who legitimately need to contact DOT (I did a year ago for baggage charges by TG on a UA ticket).
Last edited by aacharya; Apr 18, 2014 at 10:31 am
Apr 18, 2014, 10:24 am
#161
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: HNL
Programs: United Gold
Posts: 1,581
It'll be a while before I book any Air China awards.
Apr 18, 2014, 10:28 am
#162
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Chicago
Programs: UA 1k
Posts: 83
Thanks. And I'm not sure babysitting will help. I was working when the cancellation email came in, so I had a United rep on the phone within a few minutes of the cancellation and there was already nothing she could do.
Apr 18, 2014, 10:29 am
#163
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Bay Area, CA
Programs: UA Plat 2MM; AS MVP Gold 75K
Posts: 35,067
I don't think any of this is a security item or a hack. Same for the poster above to YYZ.
Remember that CO's systems are so bad, the logs and history viewable to the reps in SHARES is an utter mess. They just see something and blame someone and that's it. Since they can't provide a real answer as to what happened, it's easy enough to say the customer cancelled it.
Recall we had Asiana stuff dropping a while back where tickets weren't getting being sent over properly, and the dropped segments issue has been a problem for CO and SHARES for a long as I can remember (at least a decade). I've lost AF and DL segments while CO was in SkyTeam, LX segments while in Star, and so on.
In my LX situation several years ago, CO blamed LX for cancelling my award F space, and only when I was able to talk with a LX supervisor, were they able to detail the transactions and provide the request where CO's system sent the cancellation request, to which LX responded. Then, and only then, was I able to convince CO to reinstate the reservation, though no award space existed, they had to pony up for paid A class.
If I had to guess, I'd say it's something related to a minor schedule change where SHARES isn't acknowledging it correctly or something, causing a mismatch and a drop by CA. CO's logging visible to the agent doesn't have the detail necessary to figure out exactly what happened.
Heck, I had a situation a couple weeks ago where an agent rebooked a flight after we'd already been checked in and rebooked, and after pushing back with 1K Voice to get an answer after they BS'ed me with a guess, they came back and said they could not do a detailed analysis. And this was on their own metal!
Bottom line, SHARES is awful, nobody knows what's going on, and I wouldn't believe anything any UA tells you, unless it's coming from the UA Insider level, as they seem to have access to resources that can figure stuff out rather than BS you.
Remember that CO's systems are so bad, the logs and history viewable to the reps in SHARES is an utter mess. They just see something and blame someone and that's it. Since they can't provide a real answer as to what happened, it's easy enough to say the customer cancelled it.
Recall we had Asiana stuff dropping a while back where tickets weren't getting being sent over properly, and the dropped segments issue has been a problem for CO and SHARES for a long as I can remember (at least a decade). I've lost AF and DL segments while CO was in SkyTeam, LX segments while in Star, and so on.
In my LX situation several years ago, CO blamed LX for cancelling my award F space, and only when I was able to talk with a LX supervisor, were they able to detail the transactions and provide the request where CO's system sent the cancellation request, to which LX responded. Then, and only then, was I able to convince CO to reinstate the reservation, though no award space existed, they had to pony up for paid A class.
If I had to guess, I'd say it's something related to a minor schedule change where SHARES isn't acknowledging it correctly or something, causing a mismatch and a drop by CA. CO's logging visible to the agent doesn't have the detail necessary to figure out exactly what happened.
Heck, I had a situation a couple weeks ago where an agent rebooked a flight after we'd already been checked in and rebooked, and after pushing back with 1K Voice to get an answer after they BS'ed me with a guess, they came back and said they could not do a detailed analysis. And this was on their own metal!
Bottom line, SHARES is awful, nobody knows what's going on, and I wouldn't believe anything any UA tells you, unless it's coming from the UA Insider level, as they seem to have access to resources that can figure stuff out rather than BS you.
Apr 18, 2014, 10:29 am
#164
Join Date: Jan 2006
Programs: AC Elite
Posts: 95
Who already knows those things? Air China. Who has a motive to retrieve J/F inventory to sell at higher prices? Air China. Who comes from a business culture of indifference to consumers? Air.... c'mon, do the math. This probably isn't a "hack," but a brutish form of inventory recapture by CA. The kind of thing UA occasionally does right at the gate when people flying on award tickets are downgraded for FAMs or other reasons.
I don't know what the hell United can do about it, either, beyond breaking open more inventory on alternative own-metal flights to reaccommodate, which it looks like they are not doing.
I don't know what the hell United can do about it, either, beyond breaking open more inventory on alternative own-metal flights to reaccommodate, which it looks like they are not doing.
There have been several similar "incidents" reported in Chinese forums recently. All the canceled award tickets were issued by UA and contained CA flight(s). Award tickets issued by every other *A carrier remained intact (including those issued by CA itself). This is not a coincidence since only United.com (among *A carriers) allows anyone to cancel an award booking online by simply entering the PNR and passenger's last name.
Apr 18, 2014, 10:31 am
#165
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Chicago
Programs: UA 1k
Posts: 83
I'm sorry, what exactly did I say that was speculation? That a security issue exists is a fact. That United is aware is a fact. That United benefits from passengers using United miles on United flights instead of others is a fact.
