lkar

Two of us travelling from USA to the Republic of Ireland via LHR. One of holds a USA passport and one of us holds a USA and Irish passport.

I understand the Irish citizen must (should?) present himself as an Irish Citizen when entering Ireland. And also should present himself as an EU member citizen when entering and exiting the EU. What I can't quite figure out is when does one enter the EU.

According to the step by step instructions on the Heathrow web site, one goes through passport control at T5 after taking the flight connections bus. Is this an entry into the UK/EU? Have you then cleared immigration such that you could simply walk out of the airport (assuming only hand baggage)? Is this where (if you need one) you obtain your EU visa? Or do you receive that visa when you land in your onward destination? It doesn't seem like the latter, since many on a flight from LHR are presumably UK citizens and don't even have to show a passport in Ireland. Presumably, if the former, the Irish citizen should present the EU passport at T5 passport control on the connection.

What about connections in LHR for onward flights to other EU member countries, other than within the UK or the RoI. Suppose you are connecting to France. Would the USA citizen, after going through passport control at T5, have entered the EU and does he get an EU visa stamp here, or does this happen when he lands at CDG? How about the Irish Citizen -- should he be showing his USA passport or Irish passport to T5 passport control in this circumstance?

Edit: I guess I probably should not be referring to "visas" for the USA citizen, since I guess they don't need them in the EU, but I suppose instead I'm talking about entry and exit stamps.

Gagravarr

If you land in Heathrow and your journey ends there, or if your checked luggage is only tagged that far and needs re-checking (eg two tickets), you'll enter the UK in Heathrow. If you carry on to France later, then you'd enter France when you got there (or in St Pancras if taking the Eurostar). The UK is not part of the Schengen zone, so an entry into the UK won't get you into France, that's another step.

The only time that entry into the EU as a whole matters is customs, not immigration. There is no common "EU immigration stamp".

If you're flying from the USA to Ireland via Heathrow, on a through ticket, then on arrival into Heathrow you'll just go through security. You won't clear customs, you won't clear immigration (unless you decide to pop out for a smoke!), but the onward airline will want to see a passport to check you have the right passport/visa to enter Ireland

For a dual US/Irish national, it's probably easier to show only the Irish passport to everyone on the way to Ireland, and the US one on the way home. Neither country has exit checks, so that keeps things simple. That said, for a short visit, they'd probably get away with entering on their US passport. Some countries require their nationals to enter the country on their passport, the USA being one, so they must use the US passport when entering the USA. Some countries don't have this restriction, but it often makes things quicker/easier if you do. The UK is one such, and I think Ireland might be too

alanR

The UK & Ireland have a Common Travel Area which effectively means that if you enter one, you enter the other.

Despite the claims of the previous poster you WILL pass through immigration at Heathrow even if you stay airside, let alone "popping out for a smoke".

There is no such thing as an EU visa - there is a Schengen Visa but there are countries (eg Norway) that are part of Schengen but not part of the EU and countries (eg UK) that are part of the EU but not part of Schengen.

Oh - US nationals are required to use a US passport to enter and leave the US.

Gagravarr

The Common Travel Area only applies to UK and Irish nationals though. It's not like Schengen. Any other EU citizens, and any non-EU citizens like US citizens are not entitled to use the CTA provisions. Additionally, the Irish will almost always want to see a passport for an arrival by air, even if the UK authorities don't for arrivals from Ireland.

Ber2dca

There's definitely immigration at LHR when you connect to Ireland and arrive from the U.S. and there will be controls in Ireland again, too. Though in both places it's a pretty quick and cursory process usually. The UK authorities basically treat the Ireland flights like domestic UK flights whereas the Irish authorities treat them as international arrivals.

Microwave

Bingo.

There will also be one additional step to be aware of: the passengers will have their photographs taken at security, and when boarding there will be check against the boarding pass name and photo taken at security to ensure the same person is boarding. For a first-timer this will seem very odd, but don't worry: it's done this way because departing international and UK/Ireland passengers are amalgamated so it's important to ensure that someone who's not been through UK immigration doesn't swap boarding passes with someone who has, potentially circumventing formalities.

lkar

Thanks everyone. Very helpful. I read somewhere that to avoid triggering overstay concerns you should always enter and exit Schengen with the same passport. I guess I was trying to figure out whether a similar concept applies to the EU as a whole. Sounds like the answer here is complicated but to use the EU passport throughout the EU and the USA passport to exit and enter the USA.

Yeah, it seems like this would have to be the case. Once you're let into T5 couldn't you just walk out without going through immigration again as though you were an arriving pax? Or is there no way for anyone except uk arriving pax to leave T5 without passing immigration control? I assume there is a sterile area where those with true international connections are kept, unable to leave the airport without immigration. Or are all arriving and departing pax seperated in T5? Could a person arrive at T3, connect airside to T5 showing an onward international ticket (Moscow, Tangier), avoid immigration, and then just walk out of the airport? Or hop on a flight to GLA on a seperately bought ticket?

Edit: oh, the photo prevents the last scenario? Interesting.

Aviatrix

This is all getting very contrdictory and confusing,

The replies given by Gagravarr are largely incorrect, please disregard them.

As has been mentioned the UK and Ireland (and the Channel Islands, and the Isle of Man) form what is known as the Common Travel Area or CTA.

There are normally no passport checks between the different parts of the CTA, including the Republic of Ireland which unlike the Channel Islands and the Isle of Man is a sovereign state. However, there is one exception to this (which has existed for a few years) - anyone flying into DUB (only) from outside the Republic now has to go through a checkpoint. British and Irish citizens can get through the checkpoint using their driving licences or other acceptable form of identity, others need to present a travel document - passport or EU/EEA National ID Card. There are no immigration checks travelling in the other direction, nor flying into other Irish airports or going by sea. It's just a Dublin thing.

Flying to Ireland via the UK you go through Immigration in the UK. You don't just go through a security check as previously suggested. You fully enter the UK and then continue on an internal flight.

I don't believe either the UK or Ireland have a requirement for dual nationals to use the "local" passport - but it makes sense to do so as EU citizens enter EU countries as a matter of right, not privilege.

lkar

Thanks Aviatrix. I had sort of morphed the thread into more of a curiosity of the mechanics of what exactly "passport control" when connecting at LHR really means, and how the airport is arranged to accommodate the various categories of travel, given the particular status of the UK (EU member, non-Schengen member, common travel area with the RoI).

When the flight connections bus arrives at T5, for example, there is a very broad mix of types of passengers who are on that bus. International arrivals headed toward international destinations. UK arrivals headed internationally, or within UK. International headed to UK. International headed to RoI.

As I understand it, all are channeled through passport control, except for international to international other than RoI. I guess I was sort of trying to work out (as a matter of curiosity) what the status is of all these various persons once in T5, and how it is all managed.

TCG

Sorry to post on an old thread, my questions are a little more specific to holding a USA passport in case it mattered.

As of posting Oct 2016 Is it still true that on a USA-LHR->DUB itin, one needs to get a passport stamp into the UK at heathrow, and then another stamp at dublin?

Further, How much time does this process take at heathrow? Will 75 Minutes be enough at LHR?

Thanks

Swiss Tony

75 minutes will be possible if you are on a single ticket, arriving and departing the same terminal and any bags are checked through, but it's cutting it fine. However again assuming a single ticket, the airline will put you on the next available flight free of charge if you misconnect because of immigration delays.

The challenge with a connection like this is you could easily land 30 minutes early, or equally feasible is 30 minutes circling over the Home Counties as you wait for a landing slot.

BigFlyer

Any ideas for the rationale for making incoming UK originating passengers go through passport control at DUB?

Arctic Troll

The rationale is that you need to prove your eligibility to rely on the CTA, and the best way of doing this is by presenting your passport to show yourself as a UK or Irish national.

Although there is no border control, you do need to show eligibility to use the CTA. I have been on the express bus from Belfast to Dublin when the Guards have pulled the bus over to check papers.

The truth is more that DAA just couldn't be chewed making separate UK and international arrivals, I think.

KARFA

As noted this is absolutely not correct. International passengers arriving at LHR and transiting on to DUB (or indeed any UK airport) go through immigration (it is the same queue for UK and DUB connections at the border) and security. You would have your photo taken as well as part of this process and this is reconciled with you at the gate when boarding.

David-A

Given that DUB is of course NOT a UK airport and to a casual reader that could carry that implication as other airports in Ireland are not mentioned, I think that could be better phrased as:
"International passengers arriving at LHR and connecting on to DUB (or indeed any airport in Ireland or the UK) go through immigration and reclearing security. It is the same setup in all UK airports, however in some cases - even when the airport has a connections provision generally - to connect onto CTA destinations the passenger would actually be routed landside and re-clear security with non-connecting passengers (i.e. it is the same queue for CTA flight connections as it is to leave the airport at the border) "

(Connecting as in airport design terms and immigration terms they do not remain in transit, or rather to clarify they are transiting the UK (having been given entry to do so), not transiting the airport.)