intuition

This was first intended to be posted on the AY+ forum, but as it mostly covers experiences from other airlines, I decided to post it as an travel-report instead. But if you came here are looking for the ordinary TR you might be disappointed.


Background
As I heard many voices on how much better other europeean airlines are compared to Finnair, I felt it was time for me to try it out myself. So I came up with this benchmark idea, where I will subjectively compare AY to a few others who could be considered the competition on my routes. I fly mainly scandinavia to south-east Asia in J, often staying for a week but sometimes as short as a weekend.


Disclaimer :-)
As I am not based in Finland, and neither my flying pattern nor my reasons for flying are the same as the majority of contributers to the AY+forum, I do realise that my conclusions might not be the same as anyone elses. Hopefully some of you can find it interesting to read anyway.


Round 1: Pricing, routing, schedule
First out for my benchmark was BA on the route CPH-LHR-HKG. And right there, already before take-off, you have my biggest objection on flying BA. It takes 2 hours to LHR, then there is a 2 hour wait, then after another 2 hours, the plane passes by CPH again, because the route LHR-HKG is exactly overlaping the CHP-LHR route. That is 6 hours wasted without moving an inch closer to my destination. I love flying, but not to this extent.


However, BA had a sale and the ticket came out below 2100€, about 400€ cheaper than a regular AY price, at the same time as I needed to go to HKG for a weekend. A good time if ever to do the benchmark.
For me AY has the perfect schedule for asian trips - leaving in the late evening allows for a full workday before the trip, arriving early in the morning allows for almost full workday on the arrival day. BAs schedule is slightly worse. This is only due to the longer flight time, they too have night flights in both directions. But leaving in late afternoon and arriving halfway to lunch will significantly shorten both the departure- and the arrival-day workday.


Summary
Sales comes and goes, and I'd say both airlines basically have the same price point for this route. On routing and schedule AY is the clear winner in my mind. BA's price would need to be several hundreds of euro lower than AY before I would consider BA to be in the game, due to the routing disadvantage.

Winner round 1: AY

intuition

The first euro-leg (CPH-LHR) started off badly. A disorganized gate procedure was followed by an incident where overhead bins were already filled with luggage. It turned out that Y-pax were free to stuff their gear into J cabin bins, and also that FA had personal belongings in J bins. Almost everyone carried 2 large bags onboard, so it was a zoo. As I was in row 1, without any stowage space on the floor, the threat was to move my stuff (1 small backpack) to cargo hull. Finally it was solved by cabin crew removing some (of their?) bags to a storage space in the "apron area".

After that it turned to the better. Crew was happy and friendly, they had a system for hanging coats (not needing the BP, which annoys me tremendously on AY), tasty food with very large portions served on plates. Service was attentive and a bit slow, but this is to my liking, as it timed the flight very well. (Really hate rush meals). Drinks service worked very well, and an incident where my seat neighbour spilled his wine glass was handled professionally.

The homebound euro-leg (LHR-CPH on the return) was even better. Purser had checked manifest for frequent travellers and used last name with me on first serving. Food was as nice and as plentiful as before, and crew seemed to truly enjoy their work and working together.
Only complaint would be that the coffee was completely undrinkable.

Summary
I have found AY euro-service slowly deteriorate when it comes to food and service in the cabin. It is still decent, but in comparison to BA, it really pales.

Winner round 2: clearly BA

intuition

One of AY's strong points are the ease of transfer. It is easy and quick to transfer in HEL. That fact also reflects in the schedule of flights, as they usually never schedule long connections. I have had incomming flight being so late that there only was 10 minutes left to when the asian flight was scheduled to leave, and never had an doubt in my mind that me and the bags would not make the connection.

The HEL lounge is on the other hand not good enough. I dislike the shiny white reflective design and the large hall structure (reminds of school lunches). The offerings are stingy / un-generous. Yes, my expectations are of a first class lounge, and HEL is not offering anything close to that. Only part of AY lounge that is of that class are the showers, which are very nice and well equipped.

LHR has the galleries, offered in first (and business). Many have spoken highly of it, so I was naturally excited about this.
I was a bit disappointed on arrival. The structure is also that of a large hall. No attempts to lower the ceiling or to make "compartments", just a big hall filled with chairs. Drinkwise the offerings were good, but foodwise it wasn't. A bag of crisps, a cookie and a cuba libre was my treat of the evening. Everything is self-service, which is not what I expect from a First lounge. I can pour my own drinks, but it is nice to get a fancy drink mixed or to eat proper food at a proper table.

Added: As a first time visitor it seems I didn't explore the lounge well enough. All comments on lack of food is hereby redrawn, and I will have to re-visit galleries first before I can properly judge!

And what's with the horses with lamps on their heads?!? Is that luxury in most peoples mind? I find them tacky and laughable. It is an item I would expect to find in the creative 18-year-old's first apartment, made of stuff he found in a dumpster...


My transfer was within terminal 5, so the walking distance wasn't too bad. Terminal 5 is split up into several buildings, so it still means you need to transfer over quite a long distance, including taking a transfer train. The transfer was easy enough, with clearly marked passages and fast tracks for elites. Funny enough the queue was longer in security for the fast track than for the normal passage...
Anyway, if the transfer on the outbound was almost as easy as in HEL, the return proved to be bad.

The return was also a terminal 5 to 5 connection, but that is all that was simple with this connection. I arrived into LHR on schedule, only to find the airport to be shut down at this time of day. I am not kidding. The world's (2nd?) largest airport, and BA's only euro-hub, is not open for transfer passengers when scheduled BA planes arrives. BA has actually 2 night flights from HKG, returning to LHR within a few minutes, at around 4:45 (probably many more flights that I don't know of). That makes this lack of connection capabilities even stranger.

The security for transfer doesn't open until 5:15, meaning the staff arrives at 5:15 and starts to set up the machinery then. So there is a good half hour before you can even get security screened for connecting. And the lounges are not open either. And when they finally open, the staff have to start by preparing the showers for guests, so it takes even more time before you can use them. I never thought taking a shower on a 2+ hours stopover would be stressful, but it was.


Summary
Scheduling connections when there is no connection security available is just a disgrace. Closing all lounges during normal flight operating hours is not what I expect at all. Galleries first was not near my epectations of a first lounge, but still nicer than AY lounge. However there is no lounge service in the world that can compensate for the lack of transfer capability. Especially not if that lounge is closed too...

Winner round 3: via HEL (so AY)

intuition

As the first euro-leg was quite good, I now had high expectations on the outbound longhaul leg. I don't think I have been this disappointed in many years...
The crew was not at all happy. No smiles anywhere, besides one FA, who was hysterically happy. Loud and overstating everything "That is sooooooo nice" In any other setting I would have taken her for drunk. Staff collected a few coats, but forgot half of the cabin. Some pre-take-off drinks were served, but again they forgot to offer this to many pax.
It kept on in this style for the duration of the flight. Disorganized, unfriendly, slow, unattentive service. One example: they forgot to clear the apetizers, and then tried to serve main course. The FA just stood there and did nothing. I looked at her for a few seconds until I understood that she wasn't going to do anything until the plates were cleared. As soon as I lifted the plate and glass she just put down the main course and left, saying "someone will be with you soon to clear your plate". Of course no one ever came, and I had to put the stuff on the floor.
The incidents are too many to list. Most of the incidents are things that can happen on any airline, but I never had them all happen to me on the same flight.

One thing about the service I found really annoying was how they approched passengers seated in window seats. On this plane, the window seats are reversed, pax facing rear of plane. There is a (very narrow) access path behind the ailse seat, but FA's never used this. Instead they leaned over the aisle pax, which means they suddenly appeared from above and behind me. It started with a hot towel suddenly just hanging infront of my face from "nowhere" and all conversation, drinks and food came this way too. I just can't understand how you can service your customers without even looking them in the face. But that was how it was consistently done on this flight.

The seat was a disappointment too. This rear-facing solution seems good, and it creates a pretty good privacy "suite" if your in window seat. But the advantages ends there. They are very narrow so BA can fit 8 seats abreast. The cabin is large and undevided (= noisy), and facing rear means you are the target for all noise from front facing passengers having conversations.

The seats are also connected to eachother, wich means that if any seat neighbour moves, folds his table, re-arrange the screen (and so on) your seat will also move. This goes for the seat next to you, but also for the seat behind you, as the footrest is not a part of each seat but mounted on the back of the next seat. It must be manually lowered and raised, and that will make your neighbour seat shake.
The seat also has "automatic" armrest, which means you cannot adjust the armrest at all. As long as you are sitting up, your seat will be even more narrow because of this, and if you are not equipped with the exact right arm lenght for this design you will be uncomfortable. Only when you recline the chair completely, the armrests goes away.
Also, there is no drink table! As long as you have a drink around, you need to have the dining table out.


For the homebound flight service was much better. I was upstairs on the 747 (where BA manages to cram in 4 seats abreast). Crew was happy and friendly, and all service was carried out "face-to-face", i.e. no dropping in from behind. It made all the difference in the world! They were attentive and trying to satisfy some odd whish I had. Oddly enough, no inflight snacks were kept in the upstairs cabin, I was told to go down to collect what I wanted. Apart from that and not recognizing elites, I'd say the service was close to that of CX, which is well above AY.

My seat neighbour went to bed instantly and was a peaceful sleeper, so I was more comfortable this time, but all the design flaws of the seat are stil there. AY's seats are far from perfect. They are angled-flat and lack stowage compartments, and are getting dated. But I never had an AY seat rumbled by a neighbour.


Summary
For ease of sleep, seats are in the same league, even if I did find more annoyances with BA's seat. All in all, the seats are not making the decisive difference in this round.
On AY service is so-so. Obviously I am not happy about that, which is why I set out to do this benchmark. But on AY service is consistently so-so. BA seems to be very hit&miss. Their high is above AY, but their low is well below AY. Maybe I was just unlucky for this one flight, but I am just not interested in flying 10 flights and calculate the average. I need every flight to be at least decent and there is no way BA can win this round.

Winner round 4: Surprisingly AY

intuition

BA wins round 2 big. And if my flying pattern was intra europe, BA would be a clear candidate for my future travel. But it isn't. For my longhaul travel, overnight schedules and ease of sleep onboard; high quality of service onboard and in lounges; short flying time and simple and reliable connections - these are the things I value.
When it comes to quality, AY has a long way to come to meet my admittedly high expectations. But BA has an even longer way. And for connections, routes and flying time AY is the clear winner in this benchmark.
So in total, BA is not going to be my new choiche of airline.


Next up - AY vs LH!

clubman

I'm really confused about the above comments, are you sure you were in the First Lounge? (which incidentally is really a "Gold" lounge rather than a First lounge)

The food buffet has a good and extensive range of food choices and if you prefer to be served, there are menus not only on the tables in the dining area but also throughout the lounge, and you can order from any member of staff walking around, and while the drinks (including bubbly) are available to help yourself, any member of the lounge team will be more than happy to bring you a glass.

If it wern't for your comments about the lamps (which I agree with) I would have thought you were in the normal galleries rather than First (unless they have them too?) but your comments about lack of food, and no proper tables lead me to think you really couldn't have explored the lounge much beyond the entrance (well there is no way you made it to the dining area that's for sure...).

1P

This happens all the time on BA. I have taken now to refusing to help them. I say to them: clear the appetizers first and then come back with the main course. They are learning, gradually. If enough people do this, they'll get it right in the end.

Whenever this happens to me, I just grab whatever they've dropped in front of me until they LEARN how to do it properly. It's amazing how fast they can learn — if we teach them!

HMPS

Intuition

My compliments on an objective report. A well researched and presented.

We need more such " Eyewitness" accounts rather than supposition based defense of an airline.

intuition

I was in south lounges complex, and went to the right, so I think i was galleries first. But I did not walk around it all, so I probably missed the dining area. I kept myself to the champange bar area. So my comment on lack of proper food is hereby redrawn :-)

clubman

Real shame as you would have enjoyed the food, though I'm surprised you missed the menus which are scattered around the lounge...

By the way, regarding your comments about the CW seat being narrow I agree with you on that, especially compared to some of the recent J products I've tried (like LXs new product, CO's BF etc) and the lack of any fixed tray is a pain, but I have to say that the privacy the window seats provide you with is brilliant and that I have not found with anyone else's J product, plus I do find the seat itself very soft and comfy.

intuition

Yep, instant feedback on stuff we don't approve of is probably the best. I was just so surprised over the lack of mannors, I couldn't come up with anything to say.
I am the person with great patience, so it takes a while before I get bugged enough to say anything. And at that point I will not be able to convey the message in a friendly manner, so I risk making the situation worse instead.


In my mind it is clear what was happening onboard BA - They have devided the chores among the FAs, and when one or two of them is lagging behind with their chores, the others will refuse to help as "it is not my job to do that" or "if I do her job too, my own tasks will lag behind". This is a (company) culture thing and I don't care for it.

intuition

Thanks! I will try to keep it up.

The reptile-like defenses of "my airline" is annoying, but easy to fall into. (I am sure I have done it myself sometime.) As is the NEVER AGAIN bashing threads, written with too many upper case letters...

intuition

I didn't see any menus! All I remeber seeing was signs saying "wifi password is on the bottom of the screens" (which it wasn't)
I walked around a bit, but as one section looked like a quiet reading section, I kept out of there. Will do a better exploration next time!

I have heard a buzz about LX new J, and will see if I can go with them sometime. They are very low key here in Sweden, Lufthansa is the one that is visible in marketing.

clubman

LX's J is far far superior to LH's and if you get the chance I highly recommend trying it.