hindukid

I was wondering how much downtime is needed on a plane for service cleaning etc. For example say CO is flying IAH-CDG and it takes 10 hrs going and 11 hrs returning. Could CO fly RT everyday with the same plane. Does the plane have to take one day off for routine maintenance. What's the minimum turnaround time. 60, 90, 120 minutes?

onlysuites

Interesting question... Even I would like to know the answer to this.

tev9999

I'm not sure, but widebodies would take longer to turn with extra cleaning, catering, etc. than your typical domestic 737 flight. If not, they could probably use the plane IAH-CDG-EWR-CDG-IAH over the course of two days - the shorter flight would allow extra ground time.

Mr. Vker

Thai Airways flies from JFK-BKK non stop 6 days a week, using 2 A340-500's.

The flight is 17 hours each way with 6 hours between flights.

Departs BKK Midnight

arrives JFK 6:00am (Same day) but 17 actual hours later.

departs noon JFK

Arrives BKK at 4pm (next day) but 17 actual hours later and it all starts over at midnight.

I figure in a 40 hour period (round trip BKK-JFK-BKK), its in the air for 34 hours and has 1 six hour layover.

My family and I are doing this flight on June 24 (starting at JFK).

B747-437B

There are far too many variables that go into this to give a definitive answer.

That said, average daily aircraft utility in the range of 15-16 hrs for a longhaul aircraft and of 10-11 hrs for a shorthaul aircraft is what most carriers aspire to achieve. If you can manage those numbers fleetwide, you are doing pretty well.

rkkwan

Let's look at some specific ultra-longhaul routes in the world, flying niche aircrafts:

SQ has 5 A345s, running two daily roundtrips SIN-LAX/EWR. So, 4 flights a day, each about 18-19 hours long. That's 74 flight hours spread over 5 planes for about 15 hours each plane, each day in the air.

Thai has 3 A346s, running 4 weekly flights to JFK and 4 weekly flights to LAX. So, in a week it's 16 flights total, 17-18 hour each fligth. That's 280 hours per week, or 40 hours per day for 3 planes, or 13.3 hours each.

AC has 2 A345s, running one route YYZ-HKG daily. So, also, 15hr in the air each plane, each day.

[CX has 3 A346s, mainly for one route JFK-HKG, but they use the extra planes for other routes regularly, so hard to say how much time in the air actually.]

But an aircraft doesn't need maintenance after every roundtrip. Cleaning, catering, and fueling is all it needs. So, yes, a particular aircraft may only need about 2 hours on the ground for 19 hours in the air, for the longest routes like SIN-EWR, if they don't need to run on a regular schedule.

DanTravels

We should all just be thankful that people like Bert Rutan and Steve Fossett aren't running airlines. 50-hour nonstop flights would be commonplace by now.

ContinentalFan

I too think it's a great question and I'd love to know the answer. I guess there's the technical answer--how long can you run these things--and the more practical answer: how long do airlines typically run these carriers. We've received a good answer to the second part of the question.

I'd suggest looking at what FedEx does--they can run planes close to round the clock if they have to: unlike passengers, packages don't care when they file. I just tried to find data on equipment usage at FDX, but haven't found it. Anyone got ideas on usage of FedEx equipment?

rkkwan

Actually, they do care when they fly. Most of the domestic flights are all overnight, and I'm afraid many of their planes get relatively low utilization. They just sit at MEM all day.

The international ones will get better utilization, but those also run on regular schedule.

Kiwi Flyer

The A345s do even more than that. Add the 4 flights daily between SIN and CGK (90 minutes each) and you get a total of 16 hours each plane.

gglave

>how long can you run these things

The US Air Force has a pair of VC-25As (numbers 28000 and 29000) that are specialized Boeing 747-400s frequently referred to as "Air Force One".

These planes are capable of mid-air refueling and I recall reading that, with the aforementioned mid-air refueling, they can 'stay up forever.' I don't know if they have special engines, or if this is just the nature of modern aircraft, with huge duty-cycles on the engines and other moving parts.

Cheers,
Geoff Glave
Vancouver, Canada

Kiwi Flyer

As an example of high utilisation, NZ's 767s are averaging 17:20 per day!

hindukid

Interesting. Looking at the AC example it seems that a plane does not need a day off for maintenance. But then it would seem as if Singapore would be able to handle each route with only 2 planes. Kind of seems like they are wasting that fifth plane. Maybe it is essentially a backup.

Anybody know how a typical 9-10 hour us-europe flight is run. It seems to me like KL, BA, and AF would make very efficient use of their planes if they just fly IAH-EUROPE and turn around. They could cover the daily flight with one plane. Anybody know if this is what they actually do. If anybody flies a particular flight all the time, is it always one of two planes.

I know it seems stupid, but sometimes I'll plan "my airline". I need to know what kind of restrictions I have to work with.

andrzej

I know that BA uses 1 plane on the LGW-TPA route. The 777 looks very impressive parked next to the AA's Mad-Dogs, 737s and 757s...but it's only there for 2 hours. It parks in London for 4 hours.

BTW, that's the ONLY 777 that runs a regular scheduled service to/from TPA, that's why it looks impressive.... (I'm not even sure if there are any 767s servicing TPA)

BoeingBoy

"I guess there's the technical answer--how long can you run these things--and the more practical answer: how long do airlines typically run these carriers."

That sums it up.....

Technically, an airplane can fly as much in 24 hours as it's range and minimum turn-around time at the stops will allow, at least over the short term and assuming nothing breaks that can't be fixed on the turn-around. This is where the long-range airplanes flying long-range routes have a utilization advantage because they can spend more time airborne relative to sitting on the ground. In theory, you could see utilization as high as 20-22 hours per 24.

Of course, in practice you almost never see maximum utilization because of slot restrictions, preferred departure times, etc.

For shorter range aircraft - 737's, A320's, and the like - most flying stops between roughly midnight and 6 am except for transcons, so both maximum (due to the shorter range) and actual utilization are much lower. I think Jetblue had the highest utilization for passenger carriers before getting the 190's at about 13 hours per day, and that was with a high percentage of transcons and JFK to Florida flying. As someone else said, averaging 11 hours a day utilization on their narrow-body fleet is about the best most airlines can hope for.

Jim