Go Back  FlyerTalk Forums > Travel&Dining > TravelBuzz
Reload this Page >

Is Smoking on a Hotel Room Balcony A No-No?

Is Smoking on a Hotel Room Balcony A No-No?

Old Jan 15, 2012, 10:42 am
  #76  
djs
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: BOS
Programs: UA, Hertz Gold, AA Gold, DL Silver
Posts: 825
After reading all the responses here, I am left wondering when the last time someone here who thingks the non-smoking rules at hotels are stupid/meant to be ignored, don't apply to them etc light up a cigarette on an airplane? If they haven't anytime recently why not? Clearly the law prohibiting smoking is an illegal one and anyone who chose to fight it in court would score a major victory for those who can't go 3.5 hours without smoking.
djs is offline  
Old Jan 15, 2012, 11:44 am
  #77  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: RNO
Programs: AA/DL/UA
Posts: 10,745
Originally Posted by djs
After reading all the responses here, I am left wondering when the last time someone here who thingks the non-smoking rules at hotels are stupid/meant to be ignored, don't apply to them etc light up a cigarette on an airplane? If they haven't anytime recently why not? Clearly the law prohibiting smoking is an illegal one and anyone who chose to fight it in court would score a major victory for those who can't go 3.5 hours without smoking.
balcony = airplane? That's quite a leap of logic!
Kevin AA is online now  
Old Jan 15, 2012, 12:17 pm
  #78  
Original Poster
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Washington, DC
Programs: US-CP, UA, Marriott Rewards, HHonors, Avis,
Posts: 4,549
Originally Posted by djs
After reading all the responses here, I am left wondering when the last time someone here who thingks the non-smoking rules at hotels are stupid/meant to be ignored, don't apply to them etc light up a cigarette on an airplane? If they haven't anytime recently why not? Clearly the law prohibiting smoking is an illegal one and anyone who chose to fight it in court would score a major victory for those who can't go 3.5 hours without smoking.
Personally I don't think that the rules don't apply to me, but there's quite a bit of ambiguity over what constitutes "in" the hotel. I would imagine that smoking on the plane's wing would be ok, assuming of course you weren't bound by the "no smoking on the Tarmac" rule. The wing is most definitely not inside the plane been though it's attached.

I do know several companies (my employer being one) who have nonsmoking campuses. You can't smoke in the parking lot; you can't smoke inside your car if you're on their property. At all of the ones I've seen, there's clear signage at the parking lot entrance, more signs here and there on the property, and all the ashtrays have been removed. While I'm sure they exist, I've never seen any hotel with a non-smoking campus/property/etc.

I suppose hotels are just trying to walk the fine line between pleasing non-smokers and pi**ing off the smokers by stating rooms and public areas are non-smoking but placing ashtrays at entry-ways (which implies smoking is at least tolerated at that area) and not stating a policy at all about the balcony.
dcpatti is offline  
Old Jan 15, 2012, 1:07 pm
  #79  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 15,323
This reminds me of the zealots when discussing people placing their feet on bulkheads (and I am not going to get into whether they are clean/smally/socked/naked/shoes,etc) who ask, would you put your feet up on the wall of your friends house when seated on a sofa, to which the answer is "hell yes if he bolted the sofa six inched from the wall".

Zealots. I would estimate that 99% of non-smoking properties that I have visited that have balconies PUT ASHTRAYS on their balconies, so that would mean that YES in fact you can and any smoker should FEEL FREE to smoke on their balcony. Furthermore I see that it must be a huge problem among a certain type of people whose "Lanai's" (what an obnoxious word, yes you have been to Hawaii and know that its the word they use) always seem to attract smoke. Guess what, Hawaii is hauge Japanese tourist destination, and smoking on balconies in Hawaii will be banned when hell freezes over, Hawaii has enough fiscal problems without driving away the huge percentage of Japanese tourists who smoke, forget about the "Hoale's".

TWA and others, I have not advocated that smokers smoke in non-smoking rooms or properties, the point I was trying to make is that in most places when you rent accomodation, whether for a day or the rest of your life, you can actually do whatever you want in it, and a hotel cannot control whether you smoke or not. You can bleat on about what you believe a contract to be, however despite what some people with lesser knowledge believe, not everything is enforcable just because it is signed up to. Generally when it comes to cleaning charges, as discussed before they are there as a ruse by enlightened management that knows that whatever they claim or insist on, they are legally NOT allowed to ban smoking in their area. Whether they try to collect or not, is another matter, and you will find that they generally DO NOT, or if they do will in fact drop it if teh guest protests or attempts to go legal. Hotels have lost way too many cases that they do not want to talk about regarding this subject.
hfly is offline  
Old Jan 15, 2012, 3:52 pm
  #80  
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 3,784
Originally Posted by djs
After reading all the responses here, I am left wondering when the last time someone here who thingks the non-smoking rules at hotels are stupid/meant to be ignored, don't apply to them etc light up a cigarette on an airplane? If they haven't anytime recently why not? Clearly the law prohibiting smoking is an illegal one and anyone who chose to fight it in court would score a major victory for those who can't go 3.5 hours without smoking.
I'm always courteous enough to step out on the wing when I want a smoke in the air. It the closest thing to a balcony on the plane.
brendog is offline  
Old Jan 15, 2012, 4:22 pm
  #81  
Suspended
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 22,778
Originally Posted by hedur
So...anyone who prefers to not breathe second (or third) hand cigarette smoke, AND prefers to not have their expensive hotel room and/or clothes reek of smoke is a "smoking zealot" or "smoking Nazi"?
We are, with the exception of those on oxygen support. all inhaling smoke/particles of various types, including smoke, first hand, second hand,third hand or 20th hand.

Originally Posted by hedur
Despite the coments to the contrary, the smokers have made it clear that they are the out of touch extremists in this thread.
How so? I have not seen any smoker here say that they will smoke anywhere regardless of what the rules are? I cannort speak for those who have no expressed their view here.


Originally Posted by hedur
The only time we care is when your habit forces us to inhale your smoke simlpy because our sliding glass door is open on our balcony.
I don't think smokers or any one should be forced to inhale anything they don't wish to inhale, nor has anyone here suggested that. What people are saying is that there are certain places where you might encounter smoke. NO one is advocating ignoring signs or disobeying rules.

Originally Posted by hedur
A good hypocrisy test would be this: if the hotel decided to dump an extremely large steaming pile of feces within smelling distance of your room, would you have a problem with it?

Yeah, that's what I thought.
The hotel will have a bigger problem than I would. I could go to another hotel, but the hotel will have to answer to health department. The hotel will probably shut down.
The analogy is completely off the mark. Dumping fecal matter, I am sure, against local laws.

Originally Posted by PVDtoDEL
What's wrong with smoking in non-smoking rooms? Perhaps the part that you aren't supposed to smoke in a non-smoking room?
I think you misunderstood. He did not suggest that people smoke in non-smoking rooms. He was talking about separate smoking and non-smoking rooms.
Originally Posted by djs
After reading all the responses here, I am left wondering when the last time someone here who thingks the non-smoking rules at hotels are stupid/meant to be ignored, don't apply to them etc light up a cigarette on an airplane? If they haven't anytime recently why not? Clearly the law prohibiting smoking is an illegal one and anyone who chose to fight it in court would score a major victory for those who can't go 3.5 hours without smoking.
Your claim is not supported by facts, that one can elicit from opinions expressed here. NO one has suggested that rules should be ignored or they don't apply to them. When people make statements like the one above, makes one think of people with a mission to conquer, hence the reason for using "nazi" in this context.
I am suure you know that smoking in the plane is not the same thing as smoking on a balcony. There is no explicit rule against smoking on the balcony in most hotels. Non-smoking policy in hotels is just that, policy while non-smoking rule on an aircraft has the force of law. I am sure ypu understand the difference.
Yaatri is offline  
Old Jan 15, 2012, 5:04 pm
  #82  
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Salish Sea
Programs: DL,AC,HH,PC
Posts: 8,974
Originally Posted by Yaatri
I think you misunderstood. He did not suggest that people smoke in non-smoking rooms. He was talking about separate smoking and non-smoking rooms.
Proof that high blood pressure has a detrimental effect on reading comprehension perhaps ?

Carry on. Please.
Wally Bird is offline  
Old Jan 15, 2012, 5:48 pm
  #83  
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: NOC/LAX
Posts: 432
Originally Posted by Yaatri
We are, with the exception of those on oxygen support. all inhaling smoke/particles of various types, including smoke, first hand, second hand,third hand or 20th hand.
You are, of course, entitled to you opinion, even when that opinion is dead wrong. The term "smoking Nazis" would be much better applied to those who feel the need to impose their second hand smoke on innocent travelers whose only desire is to try to enjoy their hotel balcony without inhaling disgusting (and potentially harmful) odors.

Originally Posted by Yaatri
How so? I have not seen any smoker here say that they will smoke anywhere regardless of what the rules are?
The rudest posts by far have been from smokers:

Originally Posted by brendog
PS: If I ever see you, I'll make sure to blow smoke in your general direction.
That was an emotional response to a common sense post. But it's the people who don't want to be forced to breathe second hand smoke who are the zealots. Right.

Originally Posted by Yaatri
I don't think smokers or any one should be forced to inhale anything they don't wish to inhale, nor has anyone here suggested that. What people are saying is that there are certain places where you might encounter smoke. NO one is advocating ignoring signs or disobeying rules.
It's a matter of common courtesy and common sense. If I am enjoying my breakfast on the balcony (a common practice at hotels) and someone a room or two away decides to light up outside (at a non-smoking hotel) I will be forced to either a) inhale all the disgusting fumes while eating my breakfast or b) go inside and shut my door and eat my (now getting cold) breakfast inside.

Of course this is fine by the smoking Nazis because their right to smoke on their balcony trumps all.

Originally Posted by Yaatri
The hotel will have a bigger problem than I would. I could go to another hotel, but the hotel will have to answer to health department. The hotel will probably shut down.
The analogy is completely off the mark. Dumping fecal matter, I am sure, against local laws.
As I already stated, the obvious point is that no one wants to inhale disgusting odors while enjoying their balcony. If you, as a smoker, wouldn't want to inhale feces fumes while trying to eat your breakfast, than you shouldn't expect anyone to inhale cigarette fumes while trying to enjoy theirs. Again, the only difference would be that inhaling the cigarette snoke is (potentially) hazardous while inhaling the scent of feces, as offensive as it is, is not.

The original question, "Is Smoking on a Hotel Room Balcony A No-No?", has a very simple answer. You may be allowed to do it based on your reading of hotel policy but that doesn't make it a courteous thing to do. But most here don't care about that. As long as they get to smoke, to hell with everyone else.
hedur is offline  
Old Jan 15, 2012, 6:25 pm
  #84  
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 2,042
I haven't ever found the amount of smoke that drifts over from another room's balcony to be enough to be bother me and I've got seriously impaired lungs. Smokers have to have a place to smoke. Now that smoking rooms are becoming ever rarer, smokers start to seek out hotels with balconies and windows that open. Smokers are not going to be able to go even a one night stay without a cigarette, no matter if the hotel is supposed to be entirely smoke free. Let's be realistic and allow smokers with viable alternatives to polluting the non-smoking rooms.
Tizzette is offline  
Old Jan 15, 2012, 7:52 pm
  #85  
Suspended
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 22,778
Originally Posted by hedur
The rudest posts by far have been from smokers:
Smoker does not equal rude, nor no-smoker equal polite, or vice versa. Let's get that straight first.
Originally Posted by hedur
That was an emotional response to a common sense post.
What is it some guys. Is only analogy that comes to their mind is about fecal matter or urine? The remark was made rrsponse to a silly remark about urinating from a balcony. It's fun to distort people's views isn't it? Urinating from a balcony can already lead to prosecution under other state and local laws. No sign is necessary. Urinating from a balcony is neither a common occurrence, nor a suitable analogy.
The response to shows how stupid the analogy of urinating from balcony of a hotel was.
Originally Posted by hedur
But it's the people who don't want to be forced to breathe second hand smoke who are the zealots. Right.
No one is being forced. The reality is that there are people who smoke on the street, in parks and other open spaces where it's not forbidden by law. There is no law that guarantees any one air, free of smoke or any other smelly thing. This is where compromise comes in. Compromise between a smoker and a non-smoker. If there is someone smoking in the balcony, and it bothers you, stay inside. Someone could be smoking on the ground. How fare are you willing to go? When you use language such as "forced to breath", you lose all credibility with me. No one is being forced.
Originally Posted by hedur
It's a matter of common courtesy and common sense. If I am enjoying my breakfast on the balcony (a common practice at hotels) and someone a room or two away decides to light up outside (at a non-smoking hotel) I will be forced to either a) inhale all the disgusting fumes while eating my breakfast or b) go inside and shut my door and eat my (now getting cold) breakfast inside.
It's common courtesy to not make unreasonable demands on other people, who are not doing anything illegal or against the rules or physically getting in your face/way. You can have breakfast in a balcony, no one is stopping you. If a hotel does not prohibit smoking on the balcony, or does not enforce it's no-smoking policy, your issue is with the hotel, not other guests. Don't patronise a hotel that does not guarantee you smoke free place. This sense of entitlement is where the problem is. If you want to be absolutely sure that you are never exposed to smoke, you will have to isolate yourself from the world.
Originally Posted by hedur
Of course this is fine by the smoking Nazis because their right to smoke on their balcony trumps all.
Did you say their right? I have not used the language of right here. However of you think it's a right, I am sure every smoker here will appreciate that.
Originally Posted by hedur
As I already stated, the obvious point is that no one wants to inhale disgusting odors while enjoying their balcony. If you, as a smoker, wouldn't want to inhale feces fumes while trying to eat your breakfast, than you shouldn't expect anyone to inhale cigarette fumes while trying to enjoy theirs. Again, the only difference would be that inhaling the cigarette snoke is (potentially) hazardous while inhaling the scent of feces, as offensive as it is, is not.
Speak for yourself. Some people don't and some people do, while some don't care. Geez, that fecal obsession again. I wonder if obsession with feces and urination should tell us something.
Originally Posted by hedur
The original question, "Is Smoking on a Hotel Room Balcony A No-No?", has a very simple answer. You may be allowed to do it based on your reading of hotel policy but that doesn't make it a courteous thing to do. But most here don't care about that. As long as they get to smoke, to hell with everyone else.
If it's not prohibited, it's allowed. Sorry. One may choose not to smoke on a balcony if it's not prohibited. If you want someone to not make that choice, try a polite request. Don't approach with a sense of entitlement. You will be surprised.
Yaatri is offline  
Old Jan 15, 2012, 7:54 pm
  #86  
FlyerTalk Evangelist, Ambassador: World of Hyatt
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: NJ
Programs: Hyatt Globalist, Fairmont Lifetime Plat, UA Silver, dirt elsewhere
Posts: 46,919
Originally Posted by Tizzette
I haven't ever found the amount of smoke that drifts over from another room's balcony to be enough to be bother me and I've got seriously impaired lungs. Smokers have to have a place to smoke. Now that smoking rooms are becoming ever rarer, smokers start to seek out hotels with balconies and windows that open. Smokers are not going to be able to go even a one night stay without a cigarette, no matter if the hotel is supposed to be entirely smoke free. Let's be realistic and allow smokers with viable alternatives to polluting the non-smoking rooms.
Thank you for injecting some sanity into this conversation. ^^
Mary2e is offline  
Old Jan 15, 2012, 8:51 pm
  #87  
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Programs: UA 1P
Posts: 545
If you reserve and pay for a non-smoking room, you have a reasonable right to expect you will not be exposed to the smell of cigarette smoke, whether it's in the room or on the balcony - particularly if the hotel advertises itself as a non-smoking property.

If you want to enjoy a cigarette in your hotel room or on your hotel room balcony, you have a reasonable right to reserve a smoking room in a hotel that permits smoking and puff away to your heart's content. You do not have a reasonable right to smoke at a non-smoking property.
LTBoston is offline  
Old Jan 15, 2012, 9:46 pm
  #88  
Suspended
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Calgary, Alberta
Programs: Hyatt Diamond, Fairmont Platinum, Aeroplan Diamond, HHonors Gold, SPG Gold
Posts: 18,686
Originally Posted by PVDtoDEL
What's wrong with smoking in non-smoking rooms? Perhaps the part that you aren't supposed to smoke in a non-smoking room?
The premise of discussion is that in non-smoking hotels, can you smoke on the balcony? If its a non-smoking hotel, then its self explanatory.. If its a designated smoking area within a hotel that allows it, there is no protest here..
Ancien Maestro is offline  
Old Jan 15, 2012, 9:50 pm
  #89  
Suspended
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 22,778
Originally Posted by LTBoston
If you reserve and pay for a non-smoking room, you have a reasonable right to expect you will not be exposed to the smell of cigarette smoke, whether it's in the room or on the balcony - particularly if the hotel advertises itself as a non-smoking property.

If you want to enjoy a cigarette in your hotel room or on your hotel room balcony, you have a reasonable right to reserve a smoking room in a hotel that permits smoking and puff away to your heart's content. You do not have a reasonable right to smoke at a non-smoking property.
I absolutely agree that you if reserve and pay for a non-smoking room, that's what you should expect, and get. Balcony is grey area. In an ideal world it would be nice that everyone got what they wanted. But reality is a ...... Hotels don't promise to give you the room you reserve, car rental agencies don't promise to give you the car you reserve, or airlines, the seat you reserve or request. Usually they try to give you what you want/request.

What do you do if your neighbour smokes on his patio, or at the edge of his property line? What would you do if you lived in an apartment and a teneant above, below or beside your apartment smokes in their balcony?

I can see why a nonsmoker would not be happy about a smoker in the balcony next door. If it bothers you, you can either request the smoker to not smoke, or if you wish, complain to the hotel manager. You will be well within your rights to do that. If the hotel does not try to stop the smoker, it's clear that the hotel just put up the sign, but had no plans to enforce it.

2. Why did Marriott implement the Smoke-free Hotel policy?
The majority of guest requests favor a non-smoking hotel environment. The only way to provide this experience is to not allow smoking within the building. Therefore, we have applied this preference throughout our hotels. We do provide designated smoking areas outside the building to accommodate the needs of guests who smoke.
Back to top

4. How will smokers be accommodated? Will they be able to smoke on the property?
Although smoking is not permitted within hotel buildings themselves, guests who smoke are permitted to do so outside in designated areas.
Back to top

5. What measures will Marriott take to enforce the Smoke-free Hotel policy?
The policy is integrated in the Marriott Quality Assurance process. All associates have been trained to respond to potential violations of the policy. For example, housekeepers are trained to observe signs of smoking in the hotel. Guests are reminded at the time of booking and upon arrival at the hotel that smoking is not permitted inside the building. Pre-arrival email notifications also include a reference to the policy. There is a significant room recovery fee for guests who do not comply in order to cover the extensive cost of restoring guest rooms to a smoke-free condition.
I am not in the favour of smoking indoors, in closed spaces, while driving, or around people who don't smoke. I have pasted portions of Marriott's non-smoking policy. It's silent about balcony. It does, however, say that smoking is allowed outside the building in designated places. Either by omission, or by commission, Marriott has left inside and outside not properly defined. If there is an ash tray in the balcony, it would be reasonable to assume that smoking is not a "NO NO" there.
Yaatri is offline  
Old Jan 15, 2012, 9:53 pm
  #90  
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: NOC/LAX
Posts: 432
Originally Posted by Yaatri
Smoker does not equal rude, nor no-smoker equal polite, or vice versa. Let's get that straight first..
Oh my. Please show me where I said being a smoker automatically equals being rude?? As it happens, the posts by the smokers have been the rudest in this thread, despite their cries to the contrary.

Originally Posted by Yaatri
What is it some guys. Is only analogy that comes to their mind is about fecal matter or urine? The remark was made rrsponse to a silly remark about urinating from a balcony. It's fun to distort people's views isn't it? Urinating from a balcony can already lead to prosecution under other state and local laws. No sign is necessary. Urinating from a balcony is neither a common occurrence, nor a suitable analogy.
The response to shows how stupid the analogy of urinating from balcony of a hotel was.
The post was about much more than urinating from a balcony and had very good points. Try reading it again.

Originally Posted by Yaatri
No one is being forced. The reality is that there are people who smoke on the street, in parks and other open spaces where it's not forbidden by law. There is no law that guarantees any one air, free of smoke or any other smelly thing. This is where compromise comes in. Compromise between a smoker and a non-smoker. If there is someone smoking in the balcony, and it bothers you, stay inside. Someone could be smoking on the ground. How fare are you willing to go? When you use language such as "forced to breath", you lose all credibility with me. No one is being forced.
Hilarious that you think smokers should have all the rights and those just trying to enjoy their balcony should "stay inside" if they don't like it. There is no compromise being offered by the smoker. Even though it's a non-smoking property they are going to smoke on their balcony if they feel like it because no one matters but them. Believe me, the message is loud and clear.

Originally Posted by Yaatri
It's common courtesy to not make unreasonable demands on other people, who are not doing anything illegal or against the rules or physically getting in your face/way. You can have breakfast in a balcony, no one is stopping you. If a hotel does not prohibit smoking on the balcony, or does not enforce it's no-smoking policy, your issue is with the hotel, not other guests. Don't patronise a hotel that does not guarantee you smoke free place. This sense of entitlement is where the problem is. If you want to be absolutely sure that you are never exposed to smoke, you will have to isolate yourself from the world.
The "sense of entitlement" here is all on the side of those who feel anyone who doesn't want to breathe their smoke can "stay inside" if they don't like it.

Originally Posted by LTBoston
If you reserve and pay for a non-smoking room, you have a reasonable right to expect you will not be exposed to the smell of cigarette smoke, whether it's in the room or on the balcony - particularly if the hotel advertises itself as a non-smoking property.

If you want to enjoy a cigarette in your hotel room or on your hotel room balcony, you have a reasonable right to reserve a smoking room in a hotel that permits smoking and puff away to your heart's content. You do not have a reasonable right to smoke at a non-smoking property.
^ Total common sense. Probably too much to be accepted around here, I'm afraid.
hedur is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Manage Preferences - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service -

This site is owned, operated, and maintained by MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Designated trademarks are the property of their respective owners.