jlemon

Indeed they did....but what kind of 747s did LH fly at this time in terms of the configuration?

jrl767

that's a leading question if I have ever seen one

most likely their 747-230B Combi

jlemon

Yep! Here are the westbound Lufthansa scheds operated with 747 Combi aircraft which continued on to South America from San Juan....

LH 512: Frankfurt (FRA) 1:40p - 5:00p San Juan (SJU) 6:15p - 7:55p Bogota (BOG) 9:20p - 11:40p Lima (LIM) 1:05a - 3:45a La Paz (LPB)
Op: Mondays and Wednesdays only
Equip: 74M

LH 514: Frankfurt (FRA) 1:40p - 5:00p San Juan (SJU) 6:15p - 7:55p Bogota (BOG) 9:20p - 11:40p Lima (LIM)
Op: Fridays only
Equip: 74M

There were a good number of airlines operating 747 Combi flights back in 1983 besides Lufthansa including:

* Air Canada
* Air France
* Air Gabon
* Alitalia
* Avianca
* China Airlines
* El Al
* KLM Royal Dutch
* Qantas
* Sabena
* South African
* Swissair
* UTA
* Varig

Sabena was also operating DC-10 Combi (D1M) service at this time. And I may have not identified all of the 74M operators back in 1983 so please feel free to add to my list.

My first ever flight to Europe was on a 747 Combi. I flew round trip LAX-AMS in business class on board a KLM Royal Dutch 74M. And I believe that KLM may be the last scheduled B747-400 Combi operator out there at the present time.

Speaking of combi aircraft, here's yet another bonus quiz item.....

Identify an airline that operated scheduled Boeing 727 Combi service in western Europe. ANSWERED

jrl767

also speaking of Combi aircraft, Alaska's 737-400 fleet is down to their last few weeks of service ... I managed to free up a day in my calendar last month to go SEA-JNU on a Combi and return via the JNU-PSG-WRG-KTN-SEA milk run on a conventional -400

RoyalFlush

Not trivia or quiz related, but vintage airline memorabilia related here.

ICT Airport is auctioning off some really old signs. TWA, Braniff, HP, Northwest, CO Meatball logo, others.

I'm shocked the bid is only $160 after the auction being live and online for nearly three weeks.

see https://www.purplewave.com/auction/170926/item/DL9866

jlemon

Thanks for posting this! I'd love to acquire the CO sign with the wonderful old meatball.....and I'm positive that Lady K would be absolutely thrilled if I then attempted to hang it up on a wall somewhere in our home....

WHBM

I had quite forgotten that one. B Cal didn't run to San Juan for long, there is virtually no commercial contact from there to London. As can be seen from the timings, the flights were not out and back, but went on elsewhere. Were the Caracas/Bogota/Lima group the next stops ? It was about 1984 when these South American routes were forcibly transferred to British Airways, in exchange B Cal being given the more profitable routes to Saudi Arabia, as a last ditch attempt by the UK government to save B Cal from going under.

WHBM

Icelandair for a long time in the 1960s-70s only bought Combi 727s, which they used to various European points. There was not a lot of passenger demand from the various destinations to Iceland (old Icelandair stories always seem to revolve around inebriated groups of Icelandic ship crews headed to/from European ports), and transatlantic connecting passengers were on a different carrier, Loftleidir, at the time. Lots of things have to be imported to Iceland where there is little manufacturing, while in return export seafood is their principal export. Plane must have smelt great.

Combis were effectively done for by a South African Airways 747 Combi which got an inflight fire in the cargo section while over the Indian Ocean. the crew maintained radio contact for a while describing it, and flight attendants donned firefighting kit to go through the door into the cargo compartment. The aircraft was never heard from again. Additional fire precautions introduced as a result made Combis uneconomic.

jlemon

Well, I wondered about this. The July 1, 1983 Worldwide OAG does not list any through service operated by British Caledonian via San Juan. Only LGW-SJU schedules were listed.....

jlemon

Correct! For example, in 1983 Icelandair (FI) was operating Boeing 727-100 Combi (72M) service between Keflavik International (KEF) and Copenhagen, Frankfurt, Glasgow (GLA), Gothenberg, London Heathrow, Oslo and Stockholm. I believe that at this same time Icelandair was also operating Boeing 727-200 and Super DC-8 equipment with these types being flown in straight passenger configurations. And another combi operator based in Iceland at this time was Eagle Air (IS) operating Boeing 737-200 Combi service between KEF and Amsterdam, Dusseldorf and Zurich.

jlemon

Ah, does this mean that all of Alaska Air's Boeing 737-400 Combi aircraft will be retired shortly? I know that AS been retiring their series 400 passenger aircraft and I also know the airline has ordered new Boeing 737-700 all cargo freighters. I wonder if these aircraft are meant to completely replace the series 400 combis.....

jrl767

yes, per the linked thread the last Combi trip is AS66 ANC-CDV-YAK-JNU-SEA on 18 Oct (although there's a recent update to an earlier post that says the last one's retirement date is 26 Oct)

they're actually having three of their -700s converted to all-cargo configuration (and may be acquiring other secondhand jets) ... I may be wrong, but I think the only "cargo" version of any 737 model that Boeing ever offered was the -200 "Convertible" with the large left-side cargo door forward of the wing

jlemon

I traveled on AS 66 back when the flight was operated with a Boeing 737-200 combi.....

As for Alaska Air's Boeing 737-700 freighters, I stand corrected as the airline does state these aircraft are "newly converted":

https://www.alaskaair.com/content/cargo/new-freighters

And it's also interesting to note that AS is operating its series 700 freighters not only on intrastate flights in Alaska as well as between destinations in Alaska and Seattle but is also planning to do so between Los Angeles and Seattle.

WHBM

The best I can find is this photo of the San Juan B Cal team (no wonder they lost money with that many employees at a twice-weekly intermediate stop), and a statement that it "was an intermediate stop on the South American routes".

http://www.british-caledonian.com/BC..._Parrilla.html

And also this - a last day air mail envelope that 30 March 1985 it ran Bogota-Caracas-San Juan-Gatwick, aircraft G-DCIO (yes, that was it's tail number).

http://www.philately.cyng.org.uk/SFB-BCAL11.html

(scroll about 1/4 way down).

jlemon

I've now included a couple of hints for this one.....and now ANSWERED