The Registered Traveler program was the topic for a vast majority of Joe Pags two-hour show this morning on the largest AM radio station in Houston. There is an article on their website and his podcast should be up later today or tomorrow.
There were a number of callers spouting the mantra of Anything for Security and this seems to be a pretty conservative show, but I was then surprised to see the tone of many change and were viewing it as smoke and mirrors. Thanks primarily to the info gleaned from all of you, I did call in and explained in better detail about Fly Clear, its issues and TSA issues. It seemed to change the attitude of the host and other callers throughout the rest of the program. One small step.
__________________ We cannot defend freedom abroad by deserting it at home.
I'm going to join just to skip the line. I think people are missing the point. You PAY UAL all this money for tickets and then they let you skip the line. If all you really cared about was skipping the line then $100 a year is a hell of a lot cheaper than paying UAL crazy prices all the time and flying 25,000 miles. If one year you're not a Premier member then you can still skip the line. Or if you fly another airline.
As far as the fingerprints and the scan I really don't give a crap. The gov't has my fingerprint from the CA BAR background check and even if they didn't I have nothing exciting going on that would make me care who has my fingerprints.
But that's the great thing about the USA - to each his own.
I can understand those that do not want biometric data collected. I have worked in DC for a while...so they have had all of my info for many years. BTW...what you see in clear cards could very well become the passport of the future. The register traveler program is government based. If you are a clear member, you card must work in all other devices...clear or not. Since this is a new program...I am not sure of the "non-clear" lanes in the US. I know Jacksonville FL just rolled out a "non-clear" registered traveler program. As someone that fly weekly in DIA and MCO airports...I highly recommend. But I think the decision to signup for me was based only on the airports that I used that had the service. DIA will have clear lanes this winter. It has allowed me to breeze through the MCO line on many occasions. I typically fly out of MCO at peak times.
No one should have to pay and give up information to have a quasi-"normal" screening experience.
OK, if you're planning on starting an armed revolt, I can understand the disadvantages of giving the government an iris scan. OTOH, if you're more concerned about nongovernmental actors (mis)using your identify, the iris scan looks like a great idea.
A "for instance" - Let's say I'm traveling and I lose my wallet and passport. If there's a record available of my iris scan and fingerprint, I just go present myself to the authorities, ask them to confirm my identify, and they can quickly figure out if I am who I claim to be.
I lost my wallet about a year ago and having a valid passport made my life a lot easier in proving who I was. How is unique biometric marker that different?
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Quote:
Originally Posted by COS_Flyer
OK, if you're planning on starting an armed revolt, I can understand the disadvantages of giving the government an iris scan. OTOH, if you're more concerned about nongovernmental actors (mis)using your identify, the iris scan looks like a great idea.
A "for instance" - Let's say I'm traveling and I lose my wallet and passport. If there's a record available of my iris scan and fingerprint, I just go present myself to the authorities, ask them to confirm my identify, and they can quickly figure out if I am who I claim to be.
Wow, just wow. Please, go ahead and "just present yourself" to "the authorities" so that they can figure out if you are who you claim to be. Feel safer now? More secure? How exactly does doing this help relieve your stated concern of someone else misusing your identity? Which "authorities" exactly, are so reassuring to you?
Quote:
Originally Posted by COS_Flyer
I lost my wallet about a year ago and having a valid passport made my life a lot easier in proving who I was. How is unique biometric marker that different?
Well, if you spend most of your time presenting yourself to the authorities to confirm to them (and, perhaps to you) who you are, a retanal scan is a really good idea. I suspect most of us, though, are quite secure that we know who we are, and don't see anything but negative repercussions from having to or needing to continually convince those in authoritah who we are. Maybe a bar code tattoo would make you an even better and uniquely identified sheep.
Wow, just wow. Please, go ahead and "just present yourself" to "the authorities" so that they can figure out if you are who you claim to be. Feel safer now? More secure?
If I'm stranded halfway across the country or halfway around the world, actually I would be glad to keep whoever lifted my IDs from using them for nefarious purposes, and for the purposes of getting a DL or passport re-issued. How else is the person from whom I'm seeking assistance with these tasks supposed to verify that I am who I claim to be? I suppose I could have them call my wife and have her describe me, but there's probably a number of people who would match my description, but not my iris scan. Fortunately, I've never gotten stranded outside the US without a passport, but I would think that having the information on file would be very helpful in proving my identity.
Passports can be lost. Wallets can be stolen. but my iris scan cannot. That's the advantage to me. And yes, this attitude does presume that I'm living in and enjoying the protections of a Democratic Republic, not a repressive Big Brother-style dictatorship. If I were on the run from State in a dangerous third world country, I would of course think differently. If it were 95 degrees out, I wouldn't be wearing a jacket, either. But its not.
In brief, I think worries about the state or even a private contractor using my iris scan to verify my identity are misplaced. But of course, the program is not mandatory - and I'm not arguing that it should be. If you think 2024 will be like Orwell's 1984, then don't get scanned.
Edited to add: If you use a credit card for travel, your card issuer (a "private contractor") already knows all the stuff that the CLEAR application asks for. True, they don't have your fingerprint or iris scan, but they do have your purchasing and payment history. I'd be more concerned about the purchasing and payment data than about my iris scan.
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"I prefer clarity over agreement" - Dennis Prager
Passports can be lost. Wallets can be stolen. Computer records of iris scans can be hacked. That's not much of an advantage to me.
But if the iris scan is to be used to associate a biometric marker with me, I'm not clear on how another person could actually take on my biometric marker data. Are you suggesting that my biometric marker data could be associated with another individual? You could certainly cause a specific traveler a lot of heartburn by mismatching his name with someone else's biometric marker - but if you associated my data with someone else's name, they would get tagged as a mismatch the first time the system did a check. So its not as if someone could pretend to be me and get away with it. What exactly is the nature of the problem with a potential hack?
Its interesting to note that at least the banner ads showing on my screen for this thread are for the CLEAR program...
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By hacking, I mean that a different person's iris scan can be attached to your name, thus allowing identity fraud and leaving you in as much trouble (or more?) than if someone stole your passport.
__________________ CollegeFlyer is now LawSchoolFlyer. zomg i passed teh bar!!!
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CollegeFlyer
By hacking, I mean that a different person's iris scan can be attached to your name, thus allowing identity fraud and leaving you in as much trouble (or more?) than if someone stole your passport.
I suspect you'd be in a far tighter spot if invasive ID techniques such as retinal scan are widely embraced. Software bug, hacked record and any group with authoritah firmly believing that {Retinal Scan = bullet proof ID = Good Security} would make a big challenge for the victim, in numerous scenarios. Imagine if the authorities adopted widespread use of DNA matching, but someone hacked the system and removed the record of your DNA, say in the system that listed all US citizens. Eventually someone might accept that the system had errors. and your record is legitimately missing, but good luck dealing with the front lines until the months it takes to get that straightened out have passed!
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My partner and I just signed up a few weeks ago and got our cards. Used it at SFO last weekend. We were whisked in front of the line. I do not know why the biometrics are needed since we go through exactly the same screening. So it's essentially paying for VIP treatment. As for the biometrics, I had to get fingerprinted for several things including the INS and the Medical Board. And I was born in a country where everyone can have an ID card with a picture (like we have DLs and SS cards).
