Programs: UA Premier Executive - yay!, HH Silver, TSA Disparager Gold, KHIAI Club
Posts: 8,410
My experience with TSA while wearing a Trollkiller designed shirt: BWI and ORD
I'm not happy with TSA's nude-o-scope screenings. I like to wear these shirts as a sign of peaceful protest to let TSA that not everyone likes their policies despite their assertions to the contrary. Since Kippie is gone and I can't wear that t-shirt, I decided to pick one up that Trollkiller designed. Image from the shirt is below:
I had a short MR today (BWI-ORD and back) and decided to wear the shirt. My only regret is that I should have done my homework better as I think I got the enhanced patdown but I'm not sure. My shirt was under a jacket/vest just in case UA wanted me to cover up.
Morning started off with the shuttle from off-airport parking. Shuttle was empty so no one to ask about/talk to about the shirt.
Got into the airport and headed to the airline revenue protector TDC. Got there and they said nothing. So far so good. Get up to the conveyor, put my stuff on the belt and remove my vest. I start hearing comments and giggling about my shirt. Get to the moat dragon, walk thru, no alarm. They read my shirt, and said I was selected for the nude-o-scope. Second time in 2 weeks - last week's was supposedly random. I suppose this one was too. Gee, imagine that! TK's shirt got me a secondary, something I never once got with the KHIAI shirt. I'm not saying I didn't expect it and it's TK's fault - I'm just surprised they took the bait. I, of course, declined. So instead of immediately sending me to the penalty box, I stand on a carpet near it but not quite directly in front.
When the male assist comes to escort me to the penalty box, he asks if I'd really rather be pat down than go thru the scanner. Seemed to me like "is this your final answer?" That earned an emphatic hell yeah. So in to the penalty box I go.
One thing I could tell from BWI is that they're NOT used to people telling them no to the strip search. One commented how unusual it was for someone to decline the nude-o-scope. My thought was "well, if you actually EXPLAINED what it was and what it did, a lot more people would probably decline.
I then get a very thorough patdown - much more so than last week. We're talking slow pat down over everyrthing - repeated taps down what seemed to be every inch of my body. Only thing he didn't touch was my crotch, but went around my pelvic area and my butt with the back of his hand. Finds my belt, makes me take it off and put it on the chair. Finds my complaint form and wallet, same thing.
What was different this week is the HHMD was done last and only over my lower legs.
Only reason I didn't complain right then and there is that I wasn't 100% sure I was getting the enhanced patdown. In retrospect, I think I did. Someone correct me if I'm wrong. I also feel it was 100% retaliatory based on the my shirt and also the significant different from the patdown I got last week for refusing. I didn't think they'd be dumb enough to take that bait though.
Good news is that they didn't call a cop. So I have no qualms about wearing it again.
I talked to several people about my shirt in the waiting area for the flight. The FAs on my flight liked the shirt, though one told me she enjoyed strip searches!
My flight landed at ORD a half hour early, so I decided I'd exit and go thru security to see how they'd handle it. Screeners stopped me as I exited, but only to view the shirt. They seemed to like it. Went back upstairs and went thru security in the elite line for UA in Terminal 1. The shirt created a buzz at the checkpoint, but most seemed to like it and they joked with me about it. Belt set off the WTMD and the guy said "oops, gotta get naked now." I laughed, as they were generally a lot more positive and professional than BWI. One asked if I was looking for a patdown and I told him I already had one at BWI this morning. I walked thru with nothing more than the standard TSA harassment - no secondary at all. ORD doesn't have nude-o-scopes, at least in T1.
ORD's experience really didn't surprise me as I've never had a problem there and it was much like wearing my KHIAI shirt - laughs about it, makes the point, I run the security gauntlet and I'm on my way with no secondary. Several pax also commented on my shirt at ORD too, saying they liked it.
Overall, 2 very different experiences. BWI made me pay for wearing it, ORD was professional about it. I'll likely be filing a complaint about BWI. Had I been 100% certain I was getting an enhanced patdown, I'd have raised a stink right there. Since I wasn't, I'll have to write in.
As far as the shirt goes, It's getting attention and the message out as I often have a chance to talk with pax about it. It makes the point to both TSA (that we don't like the invasion, not everyone's happy with their "security") and pax (raises awareness). I'll gladly wear it again next time I travel in December.
Super
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Kip Hawley is an Idiot - a truth that even a 4 year old understands.
Programs: UA Premier Executive - yay!, HH Silver, TSA Disparager Gold, KHIAI Club
Posts: 8,410
They had a sign out before the WTMD where the nude-o-scope was. Standard one we've all seen before. It's optional ... blah blah. Got the feeling that it was optional, but it wasn't, if you know what I mean.
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Kip Hawley is an Idiot - a truth that even a 4 year old understands.
Overall, 2 very different experiences. BWI made me pay for wearing it, ORD was professional about it. I'll likely be filing a complaint about BWI. Had I been 100% certain I was getting an enhanced patdown, I'd have raised a stink right there. Since I wasn't, I'll have to write in.
Super
No surprise that you weren't treated professionally at BWI. The TSA management at that location is worse than usual.
From your description of it, it sounds like a standard full-body patdown.
The so-called 'enhanced patdown' is exactly the same, only it, apparently, also directly touches the crotch areas and the front of a woman's breast area.
Or so the video shows, anyway. It hasn't actually made it into the SOP yet, so I don't know anything more about it except that one video on the TSA webpage.
Programs: UA-1k, HH Silver, Giving Tootsie Pops to UA employees, & now a retired hockey goalie
Posts: 10,128
Quote:
Originally Posted by HSVTSO Dean
From your description of it, it sounds like a standard full-body patdown.
The so-called 'enhanced patdown' is exactly the same, only it, apparently, also directly touches the crotch areas and the front of a woman's breast area.
Or so the video shows, anyway. It hasn't actually made it into the SOP yet, so I don't know anything more about it except that one video on the TSA webpage.
so could it have been retaliatory for wearing the shirt as there was no alarm . my two hockey pucks says yes but of course a retaliatory screening is something the tsa (corportate) has stated they do not do . but if on the oft chance they did do a retaliatory screening at bwi, it would be very hard to prove as the criteria for being randomly selected is ssi, right?
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just my humble opinion but i used to try and stop hockey pucks so what do i know . Nighthawks fans are everywhere
Obvious to me the Tee chosen is a tongue-In-Cheek "Look At Me" attention getter which invites a smiley kind of frisk experience. To Lumpy's mind that is THE oxymoron. To get an unwarranted public criminal frisk at the whim and the hands of these motherhelpers is not amusing. Not by any stretch.
Grounds for retaliation on your part. Legal, hopefully.
You want to keep lining up for it, my, what an interesting choice.
Used to be your country and your airport, too, but the memory is beginning to fade...
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"Never try to teach a pig to sing. It wastes your time and annoys the pig."
... also directly touches the crotch areas and the front of a woman's breast area....
This is really despicable and disgusting that actions like these are being used in this day and age and being done by the government. Utterly pathetic, IMO.
so could it have been retaliatory for wearing the shirt as there was no alarm . my two hockey pucks says yes but of course a retaliatory screening is something the tsa (corportate) has stated they do not do . but if on the oft chance they did do a retaliatory screening at bwi, it would be very hard to prove as the criteria for being randomly selected is ssi, right?
Mhm. Couple things:
First off, HSV doesn't have a WBI device, MMW or otherwise, so I haven't gotten to read up on anything but the most generalized of overviews on it.
As for being retaliatory?
According to the OP, he declined going into the WBI device. Cool. But as TSA has said, many times, and has been shown through a fair bit of statements made by people here and on the TSA Blog - if you take the option to refuse the WBI screening, then you will receive a pat-down. The video of Mr. Chaffetz's screening also seemed to indicate that he received a full-body pat-down, though I can't be 100% sure about that since it was blurred over (the motions made by the TSO indicate a FBPD to me, though).
How exactly can it be considered "retaliation," in an aggressive sense of the word, on the part of the screeners if they're doing what they seem to be supposed to be doing? Now I'd be a little more open to the idea if he agreed to the WBI scanning, and then was sent over for a full-body patdown anyway. That, however, doesn't appear to be the case here.
Not all criteria for additional screening is protected information (the pat-down for someone wearing a big, comfy hoodie comes to mind). Sometimes there simply is none - when performing unpredictable screening, there is no criteria for pulling folks over (or for doing it at the WTMD, if I'm in that position without a male secondary screener). The only thing about it is a requirement that we cannot profile people nor use any kind of pattern (or something that can be considered a pattern). It is designed and meant to be completely arbitrary.
According to the OP, he declined going into the WBI device. Cool. But as TSA has said, many times, and has been shown through a fair bit of statements made by people here and on the TSA Blog - if you take the option to refuse the WBI screening, then you will receive a pat-down. ...
How exactly can it be considered "retaliation," in an aggressive sense of the word, on the part of the screeners if they're doing what they seem to be supposed to be doing? Now I'd be a little more open to the idea if he agreed to the WBI scanning, and then was sent over for a full-body patdown anyway. That, however, doesn't appear to be the case here.
Seems odd that he would be selected for a "random" WBI twice in the span of a couple of weeks. How many times do you think he would need to wear the shirt and be selected before we could call it retaliatory? (real question, not a slam)
What if 10 people wore the shirt and they all got selected, would that be retaliatory?
Superguy, I am glad you like the shirt and I am extra happy that others liked the shirt. You have no idea how hard it is not going into full on sales mode after reading your post. I have a complete "BILLY MAYS HERE" commercial running through my head.
Yep this made my Sunday.
I don't think you technically got the enhanced pat down as they did not tickle your privates, but I think you got a more thorough pat down than normal.
I do think it was due to the shirt.
What do you think would happen if I replaced the English wording with Arabic?
Superguy, I am glad you like the shirt and I am extra happy that others liked the shirt. You have no idea how hard it is not going into full on sales mode after reading your post. I have a complete "BILLY MAYS HERE" commercial running through my head.
Is it possible to get an airport shop to sell the shirt? That would be cool - walking past the shop and seeing it in the window.
__________________ When a stupid man is doing something he is ashamed of, he always declares that it is his duty. - George Bernard Shaw
First off, HSV doesn't have a WBI device, MMW or otherwise, so I haven't gotten to read up on anything but the most generalized of overviews on it.
As for being retaliatory?
According to the OP, he declined going into the WBI device. Cool. But as TSA has said, many times, and has been shown through a fair bit of statements made by people here and on the TSA Blog - if you take the option to refuse the WBI screening, then you will receive a pat-down. The video of Mr. Chaffetz's screening also seemed to indicate that he received a full-body pat-down, though I can't be 100% sure about that since it was blurred over (the motions made by the TSO indicate a FBPD to me, though).
How exactly can it be considered "retaliation," in an aggressive sense of the word, on the part of the screeners if they're doing what they seem to be supposed to be doing? Now I'd be a little more open to the idea if he agreed to the WBI scanning, and then was sent over for a full-body patdown anyway. That, however, doesn't appear to be the case here.
Not all criteria for additional screening is protected information (the pat-down for someone wearing a big, comfy hoodie comes to mind). Sometimes there simply is none - when performing unpredictable screening, there is no criteria for pulling folks over (or for doing it at the WTMD, if I'm in that position without a male secondary screener). The only thing about it is a requirement that we cannot profile people nor use any kind of pattern (or something that can be considered a pattern). It is designed and meant to be completely arbitrary.
(Because Jim hates it when I say 'random' )
The difference, Dean, is that last week when the OP declined to be strip searched he received only a cursory pat day:
Quote:
I then get a very thorough patdown - much more so than last week.
I think it is quite clear that TSA wants to use invasive, humilating pat downs to force people through the MMWs. And as I have stated before, if that is the goal, then these pat downs are sexual assault as they are designed to make us change our behavior.
I think it is quite clear that TSA wants to use invasive, humilating pat downs to force people through the MMWs. And as I have stated before, if that is the goal, then these pat downs are sexual assault as they are designed to make us change our behavior.
I'm beginning to wonder if TSA is becoming the employer of choice for perverts.
My experience with TSA while wearing a Trollkiller designed shirt: BWI and ORD
Gee, imagine that! TK's shirt got me a secondary, something I never once got with the KHIAI shirt. I'm not saying I didn't expect it and it's TK's fault - I'm just surprised they took the bait. I, of course, declined. So instead of immediately sending me to the penalty box, I stand on a carpet near it but not quite directly in front.
. my two hockey pucks says yes but of course a retaliatory screening is something the tsa (corportate) has stated they do not do 
