GUWonder

"Anti-competitive"? Talk about weird word choice.

1. A lot of the their FAs are not from the Middle East.

2. The above is not a great compensation package for those who are nationals of the UAE (EK's home country); nor is the above considered great compensation for nationals of neighboring GCC countries either; nor is the above a great compensation package for European OECD country nationals working for EK.

3. The percentage of Emirates FAs from the UAE is negligible. [I have a better chance of running into the ruling families of the UAE than I do of running into an Emirates FA who is a UAE national.]

4. Far better compensation packages in the extraction industries.

5. Cost of living in Dubai is far higher than it generally is in the home countries of the segment of its FAs who are from the Middle East.

Home-sickness, a desire for a more settled life, and/or the pursuit of greater return for their labors -- all that eventually made jumping ship an easy decision.

[Greater return for their labors is not only about what compensation elements are explicitly provided for in a contract and delivered during a contract period; it is also about the opportunity costs involved in not pursuing alternatives, particularly when moving is inevitable as the UAE doesn't offer most persons there an affordable path to citizenship or even permanent residency.]

GUWonder

They increasingly fly to places where more people need to go. Growing to go after more rapidly growing markets seems to be something that many of the US and European majors are not doing as well as a bunch of carriers from former European colonies or even from the place previously known as the Sick Man of Europe (i.e. Turkey).

NYC96

Talk about judgmental? anyway. I would consider a salary, health benefits, free flying, a FREE place to live and starting pay of 1,600 a month well above many jobs here in the US. If these benefits dont compete with the rest of the job market and these flight attendants are quitting after a few years, then, yes I would find them, anti-competitive.

suranyi

But not yet. I only fly domestic US, and once in a while from the US to Europe. None of these up-and-coming airlines fly where I need to go, and I've not heard of any plans for them to do so.

Klm is Dead - Long Live KLM

Increasingly you are not a relevant customer for the airlines who are doing a better job of serving more promising markets.

Just because we are not important customers does not mean that certain airlines will not capture the most important and most profitable growth of the airline industry in those markets that are relevant.

KoKoBuddy

$1600 a month is about $9 an hour. Kids working at In'N'Out burger make more than that. Get real.

NYC96

GET YOUR FACTS straight:

APPARENTLY YOU MISSED THE OTHER BENEFITS I stated??????

I would consider a salary, health benefits, free flying, a FREE place to live and starting pay of 1,600 a month well above many jobs here in the US.

Just one of those benefits brings it up to well above many jobs here:

Free place to Live: $2000.00 a month where I live.

florin

Oh come on. Let's take a closer look:

You get a ROOM. You don't get to pick where you stay or any of the other conditions. (I doubt you have much of a choice in terms of room mates and it's certainly not something that you found and liked.)

That is NOT "free flying". You get ONE round trip ticket PER YEAR! You can get some discounted tickets, probably under NRSA conditions, but that is it.

It's NOT "free flying" and "free place to live". Get YOUR facts straight.

NYC96

Most "new Hires" cant afford to live on their own, so yes, they get a room. That's common practice in the United States-----> Roommates! but, what isnt practiced here is getting it for---> FREE. I'd love to save hundreds and/or not worry about paying rent on a new hire salary!

tickets under NRSA conditions arent free technically, neither is your reward tickets, but YOU use them, dont you? Ok, let's meet in the middle, they're reduced rate travel for employees.

Rebelyell

Based on the comments on this board, most flyers don't want "glamour."

If you suggest on this forum that airlines should have some minimum dress code, say no tank tops or wife-beater shirts then many will scream about how they love wearing their worst clothes to fly.

Suggest that people with screaming infants should be relegated to a special section of the plane -- not first class -- and you will get a lecture about the right of people with money to buy their child a seat wherever they wish.

Suggest that the super-obese should be required to buy an extra seat and you will get a lecture on political correctness. Suggest that people who stink to high heaven not be allowed to board and you will get a lecture on the need for more "tolerance."

Putting glamour back into flying is about more than just providing some luxury touches. It's about having an airline willing to insist that the customers act in a genteel manner and being willing to refuse service to those who fail to do so. I'm not sure any U.S. carriers are willing to take the risk of providing decent service. The braying of offended barbarians is too frightful to them.

Amelorn

Glamour? I'd settle for basic courtesy and a process that is not a constant, sustained assault on my dignity.

This, of course, must come from both the airlines and the customers. The airlines are responding to customer demand. One asks: "Why does BA/Cathay/SAS/AF treat me so much better than DL/UA/CO/AA." They're responding to the target audience. America wants CHEAP CHEAP CHEAP, and it shows. I can't tell you how often I've seen irate vacationers who think their $80 ticket makes they even remotely significant. The group of businessmen on first class $800 per ticket on the BNY-Mellon account? Yep. They matter.

Airlines would provide larger economy seats...if the customers were willing to pay X% more. European and Asian premium economy offerings probably arose from this target demographic. (I would imagine. I am not certain of the exact business logic behind this fare class).


Short of redesigning air travel to somehow exclude the "TV dinner and football" etiquette crowd, I don't see any major changes on the horizon.

hfly

[removed unhelpful, uncivil, off-topic remark]

1) Actually KLM, you will not find ANY female UAE flight attendants on EK, they do not hire them, you will not find Saudi ones on Saudia, Qatari ones on QR, Kuwaitis on Kuwait Air, nor Omanis on Oman Air, You will find about 3 on Gulf Air, but only from last year. They do not hire them. You will also find very few from one country on the others carrier, as this is not what these airlines do. So what is your point? It is not coincidence, it is their policy. For that matter any Emirati woman with a modicum of education can get a starting government job if she wishes to work at a starting salary of about $40k per year, irrespective of what she is doing, so again what is your point?

2. The EK starting salary is quite good, not just for the region, but full stop. about $20k per year TAX FREE plus the benefits which include housing. Any knowledge what a starting salary for an FA in the US is? Guess what, $25k or so depending on the airline, GROSS, then taxes, then paying for housing (BTW ask young FA's if they knew/liked the 3 or more other FA's that they share their houses and crash pads with??!!), and worse health insurance. the flight benefits across the two are pretty even. BTW, [removed unhelpful, uncivil, off-topic remark] an Egyptian 26 year old with a Masters degree working in government in Egypt is lucky to make $5k a year, in the private sector $10k?? Right?? Then look around at the median incomes in most of the countries where EK recruits, and you will also see that EK generally pays more than they could earn at home doing many things.

Doppy

Do FAs work 40 hour weeks? (That's a real question - I don't know how many hours they work.)

I doubt In'N'Out provides tax free income, and free housing and medical insurance. I'm not saying that $20k a year is a ton of money, but I think hfly is right that it's pretty comparable to entry level FA pay in the US.

hfly

I had not meant my opening sentence to be uncivil, but did seek to remind seemingly older and professional people from first World countries that the money on offer in much of the World is far less than what they would expect, and that what EK offers is often far far better than these people could earn at home.

CLTmech

That will depend on how you calculate or view the hours for a monthly schedule bid . FA's (and pilots) are only paid by flight hour, and time between flights (sit in airport waiting, prep cabin for next flight) is basically unpaid time. A 4-day scheduled trip may have between 2-8 flight hours based on the routing/flights, and 3-10+ duty hours (45min show before 1st leg of each day & say 30min after last leg). FARs cap the day at 8 hrs flight time and 16 hrs duty time with a minimum 8 hours between duty-off and the next duty-on (could be greater depending on union contract).