aztimm

Did you read my post above? This single thread about Spirit has 170 replies:
http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/other...ervations.html

In a dedicated forum, I think that thread would be more like 15 or so.

RichMSN

You've successfully proven that the number of threads is *not* the proper measure to look at in this case. I hope that other members of TB see this and take this into account.

joshwex90

Even so, I still don't believe there would be enough traffic. I understand that this is a "mega-thread," which should count for more than just a single thread, but I'm not so convinced based off that that there'd be solid traffic in the NK forum

aztimm

Having followed the Travel Health & Fitness (THF) forum from the beginnings, I'll add a few other things--

* it is very difficult to assess who will access a new forum before it begins, if/how often they'll post. There were a few threads in Omni that some regulars contributed to (myself included), but since the forum began, there's definitely some new people who pop in.

* a proper forum develops a sense of community. Since THF began, I've noticed regulars, and definitely a friendly/welcoming vibe.

* mega-threads are fewer in THF now. sure, a couple continue, but I'd guess most threads in that forum have under 30 posts.

* there's some topics in THF that probably were never addressed in the past, but have appeared over the past few months since the forum began.


I certainly don't intend to become a regular flyer of Spirit. But there obviously are people who do fly regularly. As Flyertalk is often mentioned in the news when it comes to travel, shouldn't it be on the cutting edge and have a dedicated forum for this airline? Shouldn't Flyertalk be welcoming to the one-off travelers who want info or to vent about Spirit, as they do about US Airways or other airlines that have dedicated forums?

As I indicated above, finding info on Spirit is a bit of a challenge in the current FT environment. Either sorting through that mega-thread, searching through the other sporadic posts, or more than likely the users leave FT and look elsewhere.

VictorCharlieTen

Spirit are a growing and newsworthy airline. Yes, often controversial, but in my mind that further argues for a dedicated thread.

In the current catch-all forum, they usually dominate the top ten. And lets not judge their potential traffic by the catch-all, as a dedicated forum with its visibility will only serve to make numbers higher.

This isn't about whether you LIKE Spirit. It is about their presence in the category. And for that reason alone it is difficult to say no.

They are newsmakers and in some cases, trendsetters. When it comes to Spirit, I want more visibility. More discussion. More exposure.

Vote yes.

gkbiiii

Herb Kelleher & Southwest was a controversial airline, in my boyhood in the 1980s. Sam Walton & Walmart were controversial (are still today) do to their lowball pricing and revolutionary methods. Both Southwest and Walmart changed their industries.

I believe Spirit to be the logical combination of the Southwest legacy for the Caribbean and Latin America (Both Central America and Northern South America). There has never been a low cost carrier (ultra-low cost) to attempt what Spirit has, on an International Scale, in the Americas.

Is Spirit CEO, Ben Baldanza, a great visionary, on the likes of Sam Walton & Herb Kelleher; it seems too early to know the answer.


Lets try to look at the issue and take Spirit out of the equation. Lets think of Spirit as Airline X. Airline X currently has a larger fleet and flies more places than forum member Virgin America. Unlike forum members JetBlue (which got automatic forum acceptance) and an airline X had to wait a full six years (from the moment the motion was shelved).

Now lets bring Spirit back into this analysis: over the past six years its rapid expansion internationally. Spirit now flies to more desitnations internationally, than Southwest, AirTran, Virgin America, JetBlue, & Frontier; COMBINED, yet all of these others have a official forum, but Spirit.

What Southwest did for Americans since it's founding in the 1970s, Spirit has done for the peoples of Latin America and the Caribbean today. Much like during the time of airline regulation, fares now are excessive within the Americas. In other words, the flag carriers are bleeding the region to death, much like the majors were doing in the USA before Southwest!!

Example, this year a RT flight either within Guatemala to Tikal or between San Salvador & Guatemala City were both over $350 on TACA, you know the Flag Carrier Monopoly. Why should it have been (October 2011) cheaper for me to fly back to Florida on Spirit and a one hour flight in Central America?


Spirit is an important airline for the regions it serves. Like Southwest in the USA, it has allowed many people to visit their families in a region, that would be cost prohibitive otherwise. Both the Caribbean and Latin America have a high fare reputation for decades.

Now as stated earlier, the number of Spirit posts are NOT reflective of the true interest of the airline, due to the significant level of discussion in each topic thread.

It should be noted that Spirit does have a FF program with Elite levels & domestic J class seating, something that neither Southwest, Frontier (Frontier does have Elite levels) or JetBlue.

I consider JetBlue, Virgin America, & Frontier to be boutique carriers that serve special niche markets. The best comparison is Southwest which best matches Spirit. Though it only has one type of service, no international network, a very limited FF program, few partners, yet it does have a lively forum.

When you consider the arguments I have made, Spirit can be seen in a different, more complex light.

N830MH

No, apparently not. Because it was very few people who post in ONAFFP. I don't think its happening in the future. Unfortunately, they won't be create new Spirit Forum.

kokonutz

This is an important point and calls for research a bit deeper than what Sharon provided in terms of simple thread-count.

I'm actually on the fence myself (I seconded the motion because I thought Spirit deserved a vote after the 'shenanigans' that went on around the first vote six or so years ago). I will dig into those mega-threads a little more deeply before making a final decision.

RichMSN

Thanks for the second.

I've voted for the motion for 3 reasons: (1) The traffic is bigger than the number of threads and (2) I think more people will post if there's a dedicated forum and (3) Spirit does seem to dominate the Other forum, which to me means it's time to move them out.

If I was someone looking for information on DL (for example), I would probably type something into Google -- something like "Delta SkyMiles discussion". FT shows up as #4 with that phrase. I'd probably look at FT then to see what it was and maybe I'd register.

It sounds great in theory to have a catch all bucket called "Other", but that only (maybe) brings people who are registered here and understand quite well the layout of the board. So I won't sit back and say that because there's only X posts in there that I think there would only be X posts in a dedicated forum -- I always think there will be more. Enough to sustain a board? I don't know, but there's only one way to find out and that's by running one for a reasonable amount of time and looking at it again near the end of the TB year.

We should be much more open to trying forums and we also (around September 15, IMO) should be doing a critical review of all the forums to determine if some just aren't needed.

Rojo

Lets not forget that NK caters to a different clientele. It is very VFR oriented. Nevertheless, these people are members of Free Spirit and have the Free Spirit Credit Card. It will be a good opportunity for FlyerTalk to expand to people that are not mile junkies (like most of us), but do want to know more about how to take advantage of what they think is an asset to them (free spirit miles). Flyertalk might even open their eyes by letting them discover the mileage run world... and who knows what will happen after!

SkiAdcock

Actually I just did. Other than the single mega-thread, the Spirit threads have very few posts in them. Using the same dates (Feb 12-Jan 10) as the threads above, the posts in threads are:

3,1, 170 (mega-thread), 16, 1, 16, 5, 9, 0, 0, 5, 4, 10, 3, 0, 7, 6, 5, 2, 2, 3, 2, 4, 23, 0, 2, 11, 0, 4, 28, 67, 1, 2, 1, 2, 6, 1, 1, 12, 9, 6, 1, 11, 5, 24, 3, 0, 0, 2, 1, 5, 6, 3, 7, 3, 3, 0, 1, 0, 8, 2, 4, 9, 0, 0, 0, 2, 0, 5, 14, 2, 0, 6, 12, 5, 1, 5, 3, 3, 17, 4, 5, 47, 8, 3, 2, 7, 2, 152, 1, 7, 7, 0, 1, 1, 1, 1, 8, 2, 1, 10, 1, 1, 6, 2, 8, 0, 1, 4, 12


Agree with both of the above, which is why I'm still leaning against this.

So presumably you don't have a problem w/ every single airline that exists having a forum if we're doing it for the '1-off traveler'? BTW - I'm not quite certain that FT is going to fail the cutting edge criteria if we don't have a Spirit forum. I get what you're trying to say, though.

As koko said above, we don't start forums based on whether we like the airlines or kill them because we dislike them.

To an extent. Others might argue that Ryanair & EasyJet do the same for their regions. You make some valid points, but I'm not sure it's enough to justify a forum to itself.

Also, as noted above, contrary to what some of you have been saying, not only are there not many threads, there aren't many posts in the threads that do exist, so I disagree with your assessment of significant discussion in each thread.

I get what you're saying, but not totally in agreement. I'm not really into starting forums as 'tests' & then hope to close them down later, regardless if it's Spirit or otherwise. BTW - you need to read the guidelines re: that critical review.

I've not voted yet & I'm willing to listen to arguments, but I'm leaning against because I don't think there's going to be enough traffic to justify it.

For those that are touting Spirit being top dog in the Other forum, that probably has something to do w/ LAN getting its own forum - a forum that is VERY active, btw.

Cheers.

RichMSN

To be honest, I'm not all that concerned with the Forum Creation guidelines. I know that will blasphemy to some, but I'm of the opinion we're better off trying things and occasionally making things go away. It's likely how I will proceed in the next 2 years here.

But as I said, I'm only one vote. Creating a forum (and making one go away) requires 6, so others may have more work to do to get those other 5 votes.

dhammer53

[QUOTE=SkiAdcock;17975276]

A forum be created for Spirit Airlines.


Sharon,

I was agreeing with the OP (you). I should have mentioned that. Sorry for the confusion.

One more thing, if the Spirit forum eventually dies a slow death (in 6 months), the TB can always pull it.

thomwithanh

I wouldn't wish NK on my worst enemy... but a forum to help us who have no choice but to navigate the wonder known as Spirit Airlines would be fantastic.

gkbiiii

[QUOTE=dhammer53;17983949]
How about if we agree to give the Spirit Forum a six month probationary period, at the end there would be a up or down vote on rather to keep it? In the future, I think this would be a good idea for all threads.

It is hard to predict for some, if they will succeed for fail; thus a trial period seems a just thing to do, for the bellwether of sustainability.