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Comments Welcome Voting Underway-Amend Talkboard Guidelines Voting Results Disclosure

Comments Welcome Voting Underway-Amend Talkboard Guidelines Voting Results Disclosure

 
Old Feb 3, 2012, 11:00 pm
  #31  
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Originally Posted by kokonutz
If it is timely end to rancorous debate we seek, we should support this proposal.
In looking at many motions over the years there aren't many rancourous debates. A few hot button issues (usually related to Omni), but not the norm.

I'm still on the fence on this one, and while I was leaning against but then towards yes I'm leaning against again.

I think we're micromanaging something that's worked in the past for several years & probably will continue to work for several years in the future.

TB members have 2 weeks to vote - that encompasses any travel time but also if they want to take in input from FTers, that input as well. Which is a good thing.

I think we do a disservice to BOTH TB members & FT members when we say hey, we're gonna post it's passed/failed, so to FTers it doesn't matter two patooties what you think at this point. But hey for TB members that didn't vote before, no worries, as long as you vote we don't care what you think either at this point but thanks for eventually voting so it looks pretty at the end when we post results.

So if it's announced it's passed on day 3, 5, 6, 7, 9, 12 or 14 - we're not talking truly, truly changing FTers experiences for the worst by magnitudes if they have to wait a few extra days to find out if something passed/failed. In other words, the FT world will not fall apart if FTers who check TB have to wait the full 14 days on the few occasions that happens.

Note I say that as a regular FTer who actually proposed a forum a few years back that got turned down & then a few years later when it was approved. I was ok with waiting on the process both times & didn't see any need to have it altered.

Cheers.

Last edited by SkiAdcock; Feb 4, 2012 at 6:18 am
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Old Feb 4, 2012, 5:11 am
  #32  
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Originally Posted by goalie
While in principle, I agree with the motion, I did vote no because it does not (imho) go far enough-namely the fact that I believe public comment should close before a vote/voting period commences as imho, there is a lot of back and forth on an issue after an issue has been decided (either yes or no) but not yet published. I've posted elsewhere both publicly and privately that I'd like to see
I absolutely, vehemently disagree with the idea that discussion should ever be shut down. Not only are there entirely valid reasons to keep discussion open (i.e. ensure all FlyerTalkers, even those who don't frequent TalkBoard, have time to air their opinion, help TalkBoard members who want to weigh the full amount of comment by the community have the time to do that, etc.), it's also impossible to truly shut discussion down: if one TalkBoard Topics thread is closed, another will pop up somewhere (either inside or outside the TalkBoard Topics forum).

As Sharon said:

Originally Posted by SkiAdcock
Which is also one reason I respectfully disagree w/ goalie that discussion should be shut down before voting. Someone might not have been aware of the discussion thread before lockdown, but would make a valid comment pro/con in the comments welcome/voting underway thread if they came across that and that comment(s) could possibly confirm or change my opinion.
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Old Feb 4, 2012, 7:08 am
  #33  
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Originally Posted by SkiAdcock
...TB members have 2 weeks to vote - that encompasses any travel time but also if they want to take in input from FTers, that input as well. Which is a good thing.
I agree it is a good thing, but this proposal doesn't change this at all. So this is a non-issue.

Originally Posted by SkiAdcock
...I think we do a disservice to BOTH TB members & FT members when we say hey, we're gonna post it's passed/failed, so to FTers it doesn't matter two patooties what you think at this point. But hey for TB members that didn't vote before, no worries, as long as you vote we don't care what you think either at this point but thanks for eventually voting so it looks pretty at the end when we post results.
It is the reality today in that once a motion has the needed votes to pass/fail, any other votes after that won't change the outcome. And TB members can see that in real time (i.e. when they are casting their votes.)

So let me ask you a question. When you vote for a motion, if the needed number of pass/fail votes have already been submitted do you feel that the other TB members feel that "we don't care what you think either"? If not, then why would you think that the general FT membership would feel that way.

In the end, the only thing this really changes is to allow the general FT membership to know when an outcome has already been decided a little earlier. Which for some of the more contentious motions, may help drop the "heat" level a little bit earlier.
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Old Feb 14, 2012, 11:28 am
  #34  
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Motion passed...

On February 14, 2012, Talkboard passed 6-3:

The TalkBoard guidelines will be amended as follows:

D. Public Notice Procedures
i. Once a motion has been put before TalkBoard for a vote the Vice President/Secretary shall post a new thread in the public TalkBoard Topics forum announcing the vote along with the voting end date as quickly as feasible. Once that thread is posted, the TalkBoard Vice President/Secretary will submit a request to the FlyerTalk Host or representative to create an site-wide announcment of the vote with a link to the discussion/voting thread in the TalkBoard Topics Forum. The Announcement will be available until either voting is completed and a decision is made or the voting period ends.
ii. Motions on topics related to the internal administration of TalkBoard as determined by the President and some topics requested for discussion or input by the FlyerTalk Host will be exempted from this public posting requirement.
iii. The purpose of posting voting topics in the public TalkBoard Topics forum is to solicit member feedback on any motions that are up for a vote and to allow for comments after a vote is made. It is at the sole discretion of the individual TalkBoard members whether they choose to post in the public discussion thread, there being no requirement to do so.
iv. Once an active motion has received sufficient Yes votes for approval or sufficient No votes that approval is not possible, the Vice President/Secretary or the President shall post this fact in the public TalkBoard Topics thread announcing the vote.
[strike]iv.[strike]v. Once voting is completed and the TalkBoard President has formally announced the results of the vote in the TalkBoard forum the Vice President/Secretary shall announce the full results of the roll call vote in
a. the public TalkBoard Topics thread announcing the vote
b. a new thread in the Town Hall forum.

Voting yes: Cholula, jackal, kokonutz, nsx, RichMSN, SkiAdcock
Voting no: bhatnasx, goalie, Spiff
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