Is Star Gold card required?

Old Sep 22, 2016, 10:54 pm
  #16  
 
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Originally Posted by televisor
*A carriers are already able to verify status electronically (otherwise they wouldn't print status on a BP), it's somewhat ridiculous that they can't just query your status based on your FF number (which is usually also on your BP, if you entered as part of your booking and/or during checkin). In fact this is *probably* what most other airlines are doing, when they let you in with just a BP scan. There's no reason that fraud would be any more prevalent when not using a card (they already seem to scan the card, which I'm guessing lets them verify my status electronically).
Thank you!
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Old Sep 23, 2016, 12:12 am
  #17  
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Originally Posted by YuropFlyer
The thing is, they're apparently unable to verify the status properly. If one wants, he could display himself as whatever he pleases on the boarding pass, without actually holding that status. That's why they want to see the status card (even though some airlines don't ship out physical cards anymore..)
The BP scan confirms *G status. It's at least as reliable as the physical card.

LX is violating *A rules by requiring the physical card. Which is really kind of ironic for such a rule-bound culture. I had quite the little debate with the dragons at ZRH about this back in April.

Originally Posted by Often1
"
The *A rules permit carriers to require the card and some do.
That is not what the *A access rules say. From the *A website:

As a Star Alliance Gold customer, you have access to any member airline lounge that displays the Star Alliance Gold logo. You will need to present your boarding pass for a Star Alliance flight departing from the local airport. If your boarding pass does not carry the Star Alliance Gold indicator, you will need also to show your valid Star Alliance Gold card.

Last edited by Kacee; Sep 23, 2016 at 12:18 am
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Old Sep 23, 2016, 12:22 am
  #18  
 
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Originally Posted by Kacee
The BP scan confirms *G status. It's at least as reliable as the physical card.

LX is violating *A rules by requiring the physical card. Which is really kind of ironic for such a rule-bound culture. I had quite the little debate with the dragons at ZRH about this back in April.



That is not what the *A access rules say. From the *A website:
It's so ironic that Germans and the Swiss are ber strict about rules yet they voluntarily break them. Just keep the Star Alliance rules printout and roast the dragons.
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Old Sep 23, 2016, 3:04 am
  #19  
 
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Originally Posted by Kacee
The BP scan confirms *G status. It's at least as reliable as the physical card.

LX is violating *A rules by requiring the physical card. Which is really kind of ironic for such a rule-bound culture. I had quite the little debate with the dragons at ZRH about this back in April.



That is not what the *A access rules say. From the *A website:
Fat fingered a fully written answer.. damn

Anyway. No. I can fake any Status on a boarding pass scan.

In the time I ride the Heidi train.

I can't produce a fake card in the same time.. it needs (criminal) planing to produce a card in advance etc. etc.

Any TA can enter ANY status into the system. If you know a TA, they can enter HON into your booking, no matter your real status.

Again, this is to increase the gate, not to build a 10m high wall (Greetings to Mr. Trump )

It makes it HARDER to cheat into the lounges.

On airlines only doing boarding pass scans, it's easy as pie to get into the lounges.

Regards to the Malay guy in SIN.. oh, and actually he's now in real trouble for doing so, so DO NOT EVEN THINK ABOUT DOING IT.

I'm talking about the pure technical aspect of it. You can fake whatever you want onto your boarding pass, mobile, PDF or real old-school one.

Showing a physical card is making it trickier to fake any status. It needs more criminal energy. It needs more "guts" to do so.

Holding your boarding pass with a fake *G status against the Gate doesn't take much guts.

Having to provide a fake card to some real person does.
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Old Sep 23, 2016, 6:27 am
  #20  
 
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The challenge is this:

There is a back-end data exchange between Star Carriers on a regular interval that shares the FFP numbers of each carrier's current *S and *G members. This data from all Star Carriers is stored in each carrier's database. This is how SQ knows that the UA number associated with your booking is currently "worth" Star Gold, and prints UA*G on your boarding pass.

The question is how often and when each carrier checks a stored FFP number against such a database, i.e. only when the PNR is created or also at check-in?

And crucially for this discussion: Does the airline validate a boarding pass against its records when you enter a lounge? It is hard to manipulate the data the airline has in its systems, but it is easy to manipulate a boarding pass barcode so that said code claims you hold *G status. If the lounge entry system just reads the BP and does not validate it against the back-end, you have just managed to illegally enter a lounge.

Hence presumably the insistence on a physical card...
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Old Sep 23, 2016, 9:26 am
  #21  
 
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So I am a guest at the ZRH SEN Lounge multiple times a week - ever since they introduced the electronic card in the M&M app I do not carry my SEN card with me anymore. Never had any issues getting into the SEN Lounge.

A couple of weeks ago they even stopped asking to see the virtual card when I proactively told them "it is a LX card". I even tweeted about it and got a nice reply from Swiss (https://twitter.com/swiss_flyer/stat...14677108523012)

Same thing applies for VIE Lounges by the way!
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Old Sep 23, 2016, 1:01 pm
  #22  
 
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Originally Posted by airoli

And crucially for this discussion: Does the airline validate a boarding pass against its records when you enter a lounge? It is hard to manipulate the data the airline has in its systems, but it is easy to manipulate a boarding pass barcode so that said code claims you hold *G status. If the lounge entry system just reads the BP and does not validate it against the back-end, you have just managed to illegally enter a lounge.

Hence presumably the insistence on a physical card...
Well said. I'm quite sure there is no "live check" when your boarding pass gets scanned at the lounge entrance. That would be a sure way to properly defend against fraud, but would require some ressources.

That leaves 3rd party lounges, which often only check your boarding pass for status and I'm fairly sure do not any further live checking. SOME do want to see your status card, but far from all (according to my experience)

All in all, my feeling is that LX (and other airlines) know that some dedicated fraudsters probably made their way into their lounges some times, but decided that measurements that make their tricks fully impossible are too expensive, thus picked this "middle way" to make it at least harder (and kinda more criminal..) to access a lounge.
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Old Sep 23, 2016, 6:37 pm
  #23  
 
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Originally Posted by miamiflyer8
It's so ironic that Germans and the Swiss are ber strict about rules yet they voluntarily break them. Just keep the Star Alliance rules printout and roast the dragons.
You can roast them as long as you want. They will always prefer some plastic bought on the internet over a database linked boarding pass.
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Old Sep 23, 2016, 7:50 pm
  #24  
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Originally Posted by YuropFlyer
I can fake any Status on a boarding pass scan.
Yes I'm sure that pax hacking the code so they can access the SEN rather than BUS lounge is a huge racket, costing LX potentially millions of CHF each year . . . good thing those cagey Swiss lounge dragons are just too smart to fall for it
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Old Sep 24, 2016, 2:06 am
  #25  
 
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Originally Posted by Kacee
Yes I'm sure that pax hacking the code so they can access the SEN rather than BUS lounge is a huge racket, costing LX potentially millions of CHF each year . . . good thing those cagey Swiss lounge dragons are just too smart to fall for it
Have you actually read all that was said? Exactly this was the core statement, that the amount of people cheating their way into the lounges is so low that LX (and other airlines) will see the money lost on a few cheaters as less bad compared to setting up an "all-live" system with all Star Alliance members..

By increasing the difficulty to gain access, at least.
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Old Sep 24, 2016, 9:46 am
  #26  
 
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Also the question whether you are a LX or LH SEN is annoying.
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Old Sep 24, 2016, 11:13 am
  #27  
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OP reporting out, had no trouble getting in the A Senator Lounge today, with BP and digital card.

FYI - SFO-ZRH in J was a very nice flight, service, food.

But ZRH-ATH in j seemed like a clown car for some reason! From boarding to meal service, just one silly mess up after another. Was like it was not the same airline. Glad they got the long haul right!!

Last edited by 1k-all-the-way; Sep 24, 2016 at 11:29 am
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Old Sep 25, 2016, 12:44 am
  #28  
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Official rules from Star Alliance Employees portal (no password required):

https://portal.staralliance.com/empl...ports/branding

Star Alliance Gold (SAG) Customers Travelling in any Class:

Customers have access to any Star Alliance member carriers' owned lounges with the Star Alliance Gold logo at the entrance. To gain access:

• The Customer must present a boarding pass for travel on a Star Alliance flight departing from the local airport.

• The Customer must present proof of SAG-level status. This is indicated on the boarding pass by XX*G, where XX is the carrier code of the carrier with whom the customer has SAG-level status. If the boarding pass does not show this, but the customer can prove Star Alliance Gold status via a valid frequent flyer programme SAG-level card, access must be granted. In cases where the customer does not have the physical card, another valid indication of SAG-level status can be accepted.

• Where a discrepancy exists between the loyalty status levels displayed on the frequent flyer programme card, boarding pass, other document presented and/or the Star Alliance Premium Customer Database, the highest displayed level will be honoured. For example, boarding pass shows xx*S (xx = airline code *S=Star Alliance Silver), but customer presents a valid FFP card showing the Star Alliance Gold logo: customer must be given access to the lounge.

If in doubt, it is best to consult an airline representative before turning away a customer. A Star Alliance Gold customer who qualifies for lounge access is entitled to bring one guest, who must also have a boarding pass for a Star Alliance flight leaving from the relevant airport the same day.

Note: United Airlines customers may only access the United Clubs within the U.S. when travelling in conjunction with a Star Alliance international flight.

• Customer must also present a boarding pass for travel on a Star Alliance flight departing from the local airport.

• Customer is entitled to one guest.
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Old Sep 26, 2016, 8:44 am
  #29  
 
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Originally Posted by Often1
"Faking" would be a bad term to use in a country that treats "forgery" as a very serious crime...
Of course you shouldn't use that term toward the lounge dragons. The country won't notice but the LDs won't let you in which pretty much ruins the party.

Switzerland's strict anti forgery laws are pretty much limited to currency and receipts used in State related business. Not even sure that a *G card, let alone a digital one, constitutes a legal document.
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Old Sep 26, 2016, 1:07 pm
  #30  
 
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Originally Posted by f4freeJunior
Also the question whether you are a LX or LH SEN is annoying.
Well AFAIK you could tell them you're an LX SEN even if you are from LO. They have no way of knowing right_
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