F dropped after F award

Old May 11, 2010, 10:38 am
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F dropped after F award

Two weeks ago I booked an F award (using US miles) that has me flying FRA-PHL on LH426. In checking options today through the ANA Tool for another ticket, I noticed that F seats are no longer offered on this flight (not simply that F is unavailable, but that the a/c does not offer it). I confirmed this on LH's website. Assuming I want full F service back to the states for the full F miles I redeemed, any thoughts on what my options are? I assume I need to deal with US on this, but I'm not sure what they can do in terms of opening anything up (or requesting this of) LH. I'm sure this has happened to others before, and that there are posts about it, but I found it a difficult thing to search and find answers. So sorry in advance and thanks for any help.
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Old May 11, 2010, 12:01 pm
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I've had no luck getting US (or UA or AA for that matter) to open up inventory on other airlines... they've always been willing to rebook me for no fee into any flights with availability, but they have been unable to get partner airlines to release award inventory.

One case, I had an SQ flight in C from SIN-NRT cancelled and was rebooked onto an A380 last year... which was great, except it forced a disconnect with my NH flight home. US was unable to get SQ to open up inventory on other flights that would have worked for me.

Another case, last week I noticed that UA134 was switched from a 3-class 767 into a 757. I had redeemed US miles for an international F award, continuing to MUC, and United simply switched the 3-class SFO-ORD 767 from flight 134 to flight 972 80 minutes later. The later flight still worked for my connection, so I was hoping US could just convince United to put me on it, but no dice. (This is where it helps to have your award ticket booked with the carrier you're flying, as United has gladly opened up inventory for me on flights they've ticketed and operated in the past.) I also called the United 1K line, and the agent I spoke with put a call in to inventory management, but the response I got was that since it was a US ticket, US had to be the one to change it.

So I think you're in a tough situation, unless you can find new availability. I do think you have a pretty good shot at getting US to refund miles into your account, though, even if you have already flown part of your itinerary, since you were involuntarily downgraded... I've had both US and AA do this for me on partner flights where I was downgraded with no no resistance.

Definitely post your experience, regardless... I've been curious if there's some other way to get inventory opened up.
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Old May 11, 2010, 5:15 pm
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Originally Posted by ps9a

One case, I had an SQ flight in C from SIN-NRT cancelled and was rebooked onto an A380 last year... which was great, except it forced a disconnect with my NH flight home. US was unable to get SQ to open up inventory on other flights that would have worked for me.
.
Did SQ rebook you? If it was US, how did they switch you to the A380?
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Old May 11, 2010, 5:49 pm
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Originally Posted by UA Fan
Did SQ rebook you? If it was US, how did they switch you to the A380?
Yup... SQ rebooked me on the closest available flight which happened to be an A380. That part was great, since I couldn't have gotten award seats in C on that plane otherwise, but I couldn't make it work, since I couldn't connect to my ongoing flight.
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Old May 11, 2010, 6:08 pm
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Originally Posted by ps9a
Yup... SQ rebooked me on the closest available flight which happened to be an A380. That part was great, since I couldn't have gotten award seats in C on that plane otherwise, but I couldn't make it work, since I couldn't connect to my ongoing flight.
Pretty impressed with SQ. They didn't even do this much when they cancelled one of my folks flights. Weird that they would do such a thing half heartedly, couldn't they see the entire resv?
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Old May 11, 2010, 6:53 pm
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Originally Posted by cobbs1
Two weeks ago I booked an F award (using US miles) that has me flying FRA-PHL on LH426. In checking options today through the ANA Tool for another ticket, I noticed that F seats are no longer offered on this flight (not simply that F is unavailable, but that the a/c does not offer it). I confirmed this on LH's website. Assuming I want full F service back to the states for the full F miles I redeemed, any thoughts on what my options are? I assume I need to deal with US on this, but I'm not sure what they can do in terms of opening anything up (or requesting this of) LH. I'm sure this has happened to others before, and that there are posts about it, but I found it a difficult thing to search and find answers. So sorry in advance and thanks for any help.
You can ask US if they will switch you to EWR, which has Full F service. This may or may not happen, but you should try.
Otherwise, I guess they need to refund you the difference in miles between the F and C award.
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Old May 11, 2010, 9:05 pm
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I'm aware that there are other flights to the East coast ex-FRA that have F (e.g., into EWR, JFK, IAD), but none show availabilty for an award when I need to return. As for returning some miles to me, I'm doubtful US will do that seeing that I have three other legs on this trip in F. Sounds like my best bet is to monitor availability, and if another route with F becomes available, call US and make the switch (expecting that US will waive the $250 per ticket change fee given the involuntary downgrade).
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Old May 12, 2010, 9:04 am
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If you are booked and confirmed for F than I would say that you might be entitled to involountary downgrade compensation by LH.... Which I believe is quite a lot of money, meaning you could actually make money for flying on award
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Old May 12, 2010, 9:50 am
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Originally Posted by cobbs1
Two weeks ago I booked an F award (using US miles) that has me flying FRA-PHL on LH426. In checking options today through the ANA Tool for another ticket, I noticed that F seats are no longer offered on this flight (not simply that F is unavailable, but that the a/c does not offer it). I confirmed this on LH's website. Assuming I want full F service back to the states for the full F miles I redeemed, any thoughts on what my options are? I assume I need to deal with US on this, but I'm not sure what they can do in terms of opening anything up (or requesting this of) LH. I'm sure this has happened to others before, and that there are posts about it, but I found it a difficult thing to search and find answers. So sorry in advance and thanks for any help.
Was your reward actually booked and ticketed in F?
Besides a locator #, do you have a ticket # as well?
And does it show F ( A) class?

If so, I am certain LH will accomodate you on another routing, even if
reward seats are not open.
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Old May 12, 2010, 9:53 am
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Originally Posted by IluvSQ
Was your reward actually booked and ticketed in F?
Besides a locator #, do you have a ticket # as well?
And does it show F ( A) class?

If so, I am certain LH will accomodate you on another routing, even if
reward seats are not open.
This sounds reasonable. I am not familiar with LH fare buckets, etc. But probably IluvSQ has more experience.

Yes, OP, you also need to check with LH on this matter, if US does not help you out.
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Old May 12, 2010, 9:57 am
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Originally Posted by captainiglo
If you are booked and confirmed for F than I would say that you might be entitled to involountary downgrade compensation by LH.... Which I believe is quite a lot of money, meaning you could actually make money for flying on award
You hit it right on the money. I recently had a problem like this with a European airline. Because it was a downgrade, and the flight was more than 1500kms to/from outside the EU, they are required to pay you 75% of the C fare for the segments you are downgraded on. It is the OPERATING carrier's responsability, not US. Don't be fooled. The one way C fare from PHL-FRA is $3869. So, you will be due compensation in the amount of $2901.75 within 7 days of the incident. You would do best to contact LH directly and NOT US.
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Old May 12, 2010, 11:57 am
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I am booked - and as far as I know am ticketed - in F for my entire trip, including this FRA-PHL leg. I don't see a ticket number anywhere, though on my trip detail from US, the Cabin for this leg is identified as O. O is the designator US uses for award F.

As for compensation, is it really the case that I'd be entitled to nearly $3K given that it was a downgrade from F to business on an award (as opposed to a pay) ticket? If so, I would much appreciate it if someone would point me to the rule that states this? Thanks
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Old May 12, 2010, 12:36 pm
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I may have answered my own question. Is this the authority:

http://eur-lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ/...01:0007:EN:PDF


Article 10, entitiled "Upgrading and downgrading" provides:

* * * *

2. If an operating air carrier places a passenger in a class
lower than that for which the ticket was purchased, it shall
within seven days, by the means provided for in Article 7(3),
reimburse
(a) 30 % of the price of the ticket for all flights of 1 500 kilometres
or less, or
(b) 50 % of the price of the ticket for all intra-Community
flights of more than 1 500 kilometres, except flights
between the European territory of the Member States and
the French overseas departments, and for all other flights
between 1 500 and 3 500 kilometres, or
(c) 75 % of the price of the ticket for all flights not falling
under (a) or (b), including flights between the European
territory of the Member States and the French overseas
departments.

As for whether compensation is due for downgrading on an award ticket, Article 3, entitled "Scope", provides:

* * * *
3. This Regulation shall not apply to passengers travelling
free of charge or at a reduced fare not available directly or
indirectly to the public. However, it shall apply to passengers
having tickets issued under a frequent flyer programme or
other commercial programme by an air carrier or tour
operator.


It does not appear that compensation would be due until one actually takes the flight in an involuntarily downgraded class, as opposed to my situation where my trip is not until the fall. Nevertheless, this should provide leverage in dealing with LH.

Lucky for me that I happened to catch this downgrade, and then be in position to do something about it prior learning the bad news at the airport. I doubt I ever would have received prior notice of it since US may not know and LH may not know how to contact me, assuming it would try.
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Old May 13, 2010, 2:06 pm
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Originally Posted by IluvSQ
Was your reward actually booked and ticketed in F?
Besides a locator #, do you have a ticket # as well?
And does it show F ( A) class?

If so, I am certain LH will accomodate you on another routing, even if
reward seats are not open.
*A F award should be booked and ticketed in O, not F (A).

Originally Posted by UA Fan
Pretty impressed with SQ. They didn't even do this much when they cancelled one of my folks flights. Weird that they would do such a thing half heartedly, couldn't they see the entire resv?
Were you folks *G ? Pay attention ps9a's profile listed he is 1K.
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Old May 13, 2010, 4:03 pm
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cobbs,

if I were you I would leave my booking as is... and deal with it at checking. LH is very generous when it comes to downgrades from F to C (4K Euros). for such a short flight the seat in C is totally bearable considering the extra cash in your hand...

so stick with it and don't get rerouted on this segment, just have your booking showing your F reservation at checking.

synd
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