The "advantages" of assigned seating
#46
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: USA
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Posts: 1,573
The point is that you don't have to line up early. There's no advantage to doing so. You can line up for A when they're boarding BS and you will be on board in < 2 mins.
#47
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 921
It's the age old game show...playing with numbers!
In other words, 60% liked open seating. Why would a company say "The majority of people like something...so let's get rid of it!"? We've seen the results of the vocal minority trying to get their way, and succeeding, only to find out that many of those people never used the service often anyway, were one-time users of the service, or didn't even use the service but said they did.
In the meantime, the frequent users of the system suffer, and the company itself suffers because now the people that liked the company are now mad at the changes.
40% of WN flyers surveyed a decade ago wanted open seating gone. Given seat density and load factors of today, it's hard to think that disposition shrank.
In the meantime, the frequent users of the system suffer, and the company itself suffers because now the people that liked the company are now mad at the changes.
#48
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Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: MCI
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As for the example of sitting in the lounge until the door is about to close (as opposed to when boarding starts), who really does this? I've only done it twice - both times flying LH when their agent was taking me directly to the aircraft - and I even then, knowing the LH doesn't just let their first-class passengers miss flights willy nilly, I was nervous as hell about it. (Hey, shouldn't we go now? No, not yet?)
If I'm flying AA and hanging out in the lounge, I still find my way to the gate 30 minutes prior to boarding. Most gates don't really operate the priority queue as a truly separate queue, so showing up late ends up being a pain even if you're in F. The WN process is actually superior to the typical legacy process, whether you have elite status or not.
#49
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 5,813
I sometimes line up 5 minutes early because I want to stretch my legs or because there's nowhere to sit in the gate area (I often arrive to the gate area 5-10 mins before boarding starts and those who arrived 2 hours in advance or whatever have spread out over all the seats). Standing in my boarding position is no better or worse than standing elsewhere in the terminal.
The point is that you don't have to line up early. There's no advantage to doing so. You can line up for A when they're boarding BS and you will be on board in < 2 mins.
The point is that you don't have to line up early. There's no advantage to doing so. You can line up for A when they're boarding BS and you will be on board in < 2 mins.
#50
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Blue Ridge, GA
Posts: 5,509
In other words, 60% liked open seating. Why would a company say "The majority of people like something...so let's get rid of it!"? We've seen the results of the vocal minority trying to get their way, and succeeding, only to find out that many of those people never used the service often anyway, were one-time users of the service, or didn't even use the service but said they did.
In 2006, 60% preferred "some form of open seating" while 40% wanted assigned seating.
Airlines are squeezing people into smaller seats, making passengers cramped, cranky and craving comfort.
They need to ask again.
#51
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Only RR program members participated. Doubtful that many had never flown Southwest.
In 2006, 60% preferred "some form of open seating" while 40% wanted assigned seating.
Airlines are squeezing people into smaller seats, making passengers cramped, cranky and craving comfort.
They need to ask again.
In 2006, 60% preferred "some form of open seating" while 40% wanted assigned seating.
Airlines are squeezing people into smaller seats, making passengers cramped, cranky and craving comfort.
They need to ask again.
In terms of comfort, it's open seating that works in my favor: I know I'm never going to occupy a middle seat. I'm *almost* always going to get the seat I want. Even when T-24 check-in results in B30, and I get a little worried about maybe having to take a window instead of an aisle...I still get an aisle.
Assigned seating on a near-in booking would leave me with more windows (assuming I have status) or middles (if I don't have status).
#52
Join Date: Oct 2001
Programs: LTP, PP
Posts: 8,698
In terms of comfort, it's open seating that works in my favor: I know I'm never going to occupy a middle seat. I'm *almost* always going to get the seat I want. Even when T-24 check-in results in B30, and I get a little worried about maybe having to take a window instead of an aisle...I still get an aisle.
I don't want assigned seating either.
But it really sucks to overpay for BS or otherwise have a decent boarding position and been stuck in the middle for a transcon or other lengthy flight because your 1 hour hop is late.
That needs to be fixed somehow.
#53
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Blue Ridge, GA
Posts: 5,509
#54
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But it really sucks to overpay for BS or otherwise have a decent boarding position and been stuck in the middle for a transcon or other lengthy flight because your 1 hour hop is late.
That needs to be fixed somehow.
That needs to be fixed somehow.
Originally Posted by LegalTender
Because selling an extra-legroom option with free-for-all boarding is difficult.
The vintage 1971 "nobody is special" culture is obsolete.
But as more and more people become consciously aware of this, I think a relatively egalitarian carrier like Southwest could benefit. Especially in markets where Southwest's base fare aligns closely (or identically) to the base AA/UA/DL fare.
Of course WN isn't 100% egalitarian, but the implementation of AL and AL+ are softer than a legacy status: they aren't used to beat up non-elites too badly. That's in stark contrast to the legacies, where flying as a non-elite is, well, miserable in every way.
#55
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Blue Ridge, GA
Posts: 5,509
Open seating problems aren't "niche" issues.
GK floated assigned seating in conjunction with the $500 million IT upgrade. He always walks it back, and then later boasts how the new system is ideally suited.
Not all markets are WN-dominant like MCI.
It's daydreaming to think WN can poach flyers in markets filled with comfort seating options with open seating. I think they're at a crossroads.
GK floated assigned seating in conjunction with the $500 million IT upgrade. He always walks it back, and then later boasts how the new system is ideally suited.
Not all markets are WN-dominant like MCI.
It's daydreaming to think WN can poach flyers in markets filled with comfort seating options with open seating. I think they're at a crossroads.
#56
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: home = LAX
Posts: 25,933
Has Southwest brought back the discussion of implementing F, E+, or something similar? I wasn't aware this was on the table. With flights close to 100% full, it might not be a high priority to do this. I know it gets talked about here every few years...it seems like Southwest studies it and decides not to do it.
But now that they've got a new reservation system, some decisions they decided one way may get decided in a different way the next time they look at them, because a "crippled" reservation system won't be an excuse any more not to do it.
Having said that, don't hold your breath. They have to be confident that the new reservation system works well first, and then they have to first use it to tailor schedules more than they could in the past and stuff like that (which doesn't involve changing the interior of planes). Decisions that would change the interior of planes are presumably much further off from being revisited, simply because there are so many other changes the new reservation system makes possible that don't change the interior of planes, and they'll presumably focus on those first.
#57
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: RNO
Programs: AA/DL/UA
Posts: 10,774
This is great because it works for your situation, I assume you don't connect often.
I don't want assigned seating either.
But it really sucks to overpay for BS or otherwise have a decent boarding position and been stuck in the middle for a transcon or other lengthy flight because your 1 hour hop is late.
That needs to be fixed somehow.
I don't want assigned seating either.
But it really sucks to overpay for BS or otherwise have a decent boarding position and been stuck in the middle for a transcon or other lengthy flight because your 1 hour hop is late.
That needs to be fixed somehow.
#58
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The EXP/1K type flier is already lost or won based on things besides the seating process. They either want the global route map and *real* premium cabins (long-haul) on their legacy carrier, or they like the specific point-to-points that Southwest has.
I don't have a huge dog in the fight...other than to say if Southwest moves to assigned seating, I'd probably move a lot of my LGA, PHX, and CHI travel over to AA. With Lifetime Gold there, I can sometimes see decent seats ahead of time, and then move to MCE during OLCI.
#59
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 5,813
Assigned seating may win some travelers, but getting rid of open seating may also lose a lot of business travelers who buy their tickets 3 to 7 days from departure. Those travelers - who today would often be stuck with no choices at all until OLCI - at least know they can get aisle seats on WN.
#60
Moderator: Southwest Airlines, Capital One
Join Date: Sep 1999
Location: California
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Posts: 21,621
I don't have a huge dog in the fight...other than to say if Southwest moves to assigned seating, I'd probably move a lot of my LGA, PHX, and CHI travel over to AA. With Lifetime Gold there, I can sometimes see decent seats ahead of time, and then move to MCE during OLCI.