Rapid Rewards devaluation coming April 17, 2015
Apr 22, 2015, 6:19 pm
#511
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: LAS-DEN
Programs: WN CP & B-list. Disillusioned fmr UA-1P/2P,F9-Ascent; Fmr AA-Plat,CO-Gold,NW-Silver,TWA-Elite
Posts: 1,630
There is zero reason for me to pay an AF for a WN visa when I can get 2% cash back guaranteed with no AF from my Fidelity Amex and 3% cash back from my JCB card ($15 AF but usually covered by other bonuses). Chase WN now makes sense only for those who get bonus points for high spend on WN tickets.
As for the ROI on flight miles, UA/AA still work very well for the moderate/high fare business traveler and even more so for elites. For low value cheapo fares its really a case-by-case basis but even then the EQM may be more valuable on UA/AA for the higher level elite perks - international upgrades, etc. v. WN companion cert (though YMMV).
Personally I generally would not fly WN longer than 2 hours (ironically breaking this rule later this week!) and I avoid connections like the plague, so it's generally not an option for transcons. OTOH it is my airline of choice for <2 hours, assuming the fare is right. IMO convenience and flexibility (i.e. TTF) outweighs a few EQMs. If TTF ever disappears (i.e. mandatory change/cancel fees) WN will lose its major selling point.
As for the ROI on flight miles, UA/AA still work very well for the moderate/high fare business traveler and even more so for elites. For low value cheapo fares its really a case-by-case basis but even then the EQM may be more valuable on UA/AA for the higher level elite perks - international upgrades, etc. v. WN companion cert (though YMMV).
Personally I generally would not fly WN longer than 2 hours (ironically breaking this rule later this week!) and I avoid connections like the plague, so it's generally not an option for transcons. OTOH it is my airline of choice for <2 hours, assuming the fare is right. IMO convenience and flexibility (i.e. TTF) outweighs a few EQMs. If TTF ever disappears (i.e. mandatory change/cancel fees) WN will lose its major selling point.
You can still cancel entirely but it becomes a credit for a future flight to use in less than a year.
With the citi 2%, you'll earn at least 6 pts/$ on the paid flight, offered at least an 8% (6%X1.25cents) bonus, tier points, and companion pass points, plus any promos. Plus the flexiblity to use on other airlines if the fare is cheaper than WN.
There's very few reasons to use a SWA Visa IMO.
With the citi 2%, you'll earn at least 6 pts/$ on the paid flight, offered at least an 8% (6%X1.25cents) bonus, tier points, and companion pass points, plus any promos. Plus the flexiblity to use on other airlines if the fare is cheaper than WN.
There's very few reasons to use a SWA Visa IMO.
I somewhat agree. I do think that it would be worth shifting some business to Citi for the 2% cash back. I think there is some value in getting the points re-deposited back into your account when the price goes down or when you cancel a ticket, vs. having the TTF hanging out there.
The SWA VISA was a good deal as a path to Companion Pass, but now is it smart to close that account, then re-do the deal in 6 months or a year, thus re-earning CP?
I find it useful to let my daughter (under 18) fly on the points, as she doesn't fly as often as I do, thus the TTF expiration can be an issue.
The $99 fee for the SWA VISA isn't that bad as you get 6,000 points, worth about $85, thus you are only paying $14 for the card for a year.
But yeah ... Citi definitely is an alternative worth considering. Heck... get one because there is no fee, then use it as you feel it is best. Note that Citi is MasterCard and SWA is VISA, so there may be a few places where one is accepted but not the other (although at Sam's Club, you can't use VISA, but can use MasterCard).
Apr 22, 2015, 7:08 pm
#512
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: ORD/MDW
Programs: AA EXP, DL-Plat, WN-CP | Hotels: Choice-Gld, IHG-Plt, Rad-Gld, HH-Dia, Hyatt-Glob, Marriott-LtPlt
Posts: 2,889
Sadly, at this point, I'm still sitting on a healthy balance of RR points. And, I think the devaluation will simply keep sliding worse (without notice, of course). So, I want to get as many redemptions at 70 pts/$1 of WGA Base Fare as I can for a while, which means as long as the ratio is 70, I'll be using points for all personal travel on WN for a while.
Apr 23, 2015, 4:20 am
#513
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: SEA
Programs: HH Silver
Posts: 2,400
My Plus card just renewed, and I got my 3000 point anniversary bonus. Think I will cancel. I had been keeping this card just because the anniversary points basically washed out the fee. Since it is no longer keeping pace, I don't see any reason to keep it any longer. I have had it since 2007. Wonder how many other people will start cancelling their cards now? At least in a couple years I can reapply and get the new card bonus....
Apr 23, 2015, 7:09 am
#514
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 96
My Plus card just renewed, and I got my 3000 point anniversary bonus. Think I will cancel. I had been keeping this card just because the anniversary points basically washed out the fee. Since it is no longer keeping pace, I don't see any reason to keep it any longer. I have had it since 2007. Wonder how many other people will start cancelling their cards now? At least in a couple years I can reapply and get the new card bonus....
Apr 23, 2015, 7:38 am
#515
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: SEA
Programs: HH Silver
Posts: 2,400
Haha. Learn something new every day. Thank You!
Apr 23, 2015, 8:46 am
#517
Moderator: Southwest Airlines, Capital One
Join Date: Sep 1999
Location: California
Programs: WN Companion Pass, A-list preferred, Hyatt Globalist; United Club Lietime (sic) Member
Posts: 21,617
Apr 23, 2015, 9:34 am
#518
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 6,286
Is this information correct? My experience in 2013 canceling and then trying to apply for a new premier card offer approximately a year after closing out a premier card (that had been opened many years earlier for a different sign-up bonus) resulted in being told that Chase could only "reopen the previous account" and that I was not eligible for any bonus.
Edit: Looks like it may be a recent policy change:
Positive Churning News Regarding Chase Sapphire & Other Cards
Edit: Looks like it may be a recent policy change:
Positive Churning News Regarding Chase Sapphire & Other Cards
Last edited by ursine1; Apr 23, 2015 at 9:46 am
Apr 25, 2015, 8:50 am
#520
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: LAS-DEN
Programs: WN CP & B-list. Disillusioned fmr UA-1P/2P,F9-Ascent; Fmr AA-Plat,CO-Gold,NW-Silver,TWA-Elite
Posts: 1,630
Not really off topic, at least IMHO. The important question with regard to devaluation is: Was it so deep that you should stop using your SWA VISA?
As discussed above, Citi gives you a 2% cash back bonus and SWA VISA has been devalued from about 1.6x% to 1.49%. However, that is the "raw" cash back bonus rate. If you factor in the value of getting, then using Companion Pass (CP) and you can successfully cancel and reacquire SWA VISA cards in your name and your RR#, your spouse's name and his/her RR#, and your business (presumably assignable to either you or your spouse's RR#), you should be able to stay in CP for a very long time.
Depends on your business and your spouse's business/employment.
As discussed above, Citi gives you a 2% cash back bonus and SWA VISA has been devalued from about 1.6x% to 1.49%. However, that is the "raw" cash back bonus rate. If you factor in the value of getting, then using Companion Pass (CP) and you can successfully cancel and reacquire SWA VISA cards in your name and your RR#, your spouse's name and his/her RR#, and your business (presumably assignable to either you or your spouse's RR#), you should be able to stay in CP for a very long time.
Depends on your business and your spouse's business/employment.
Apr 26, 2015, 7:30 am
#521
Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 3
Don't know if this is off topic or not. but I am getting $.0161 from MCO-AUA (Aruba) after taxes. It's $422.50 R/T with cash, while its only 21840 points plus $70.60 in taxes & fees R/T. This is 13% more than what Southwest points were valued at when they were fixed. Right?
Apr 26, 2015, 9:20 am
#522
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: ORD/MDW
Programs: AA EXP, DL-Plat, WN-CP | Hotels: Choice-Gld, IHG-Plt, Rad-Gld, HH-Dia, Hyatt-Glob, Marriott-LtPlt
Posts: 2,889
Don't know if this is off topic or not. but I am getting $.0161 from MCO-AUA (Aruba) after taxes. It's $422.50 R/T with cash, while its only 21840 points plus $70.60 in taxes & fees R/T. This is 13% more than what Southwest points were valued at when they were fixed. Right?
You are getting either exactly the same value or a worse value than you would have before the most recent devaluation.
Apr 26, 2015, 11:18 am
#523
Join Date: Aug 2014
Programs: AA Plat, WN CP, SPG Gold, Hilton Gold, Hyatt Plat, Club Carlson Gold
Posts: 35
As discussed above, Citi gives you a 2% cash back bonus and SWA VISA has been devalued from about 1.6x% to 1.49%. However, that is the "raw" cash back bonus rate. If you factor in the value of getting, then using Companion Pass (CP) and you can successfully cancel and reacquire SWA VISA cards in your name and your RR#, your spouse's name and his/her RR#, and your business (presumably assignable to either you or your spouse's RR#), you should be able to stay in CP for a very long time.
Apr 26, 2015, 11:37 am
#524
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 96
Yes, the CP is valuable, but once you get the CP, why continue to put spend on SW Visa cards? Isn't the incremental value of getting RR points through CC spend lower than a 2% back CC? Or am I missing something here...?
Apr 26, 2015, 2:53 pm
#525
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: RDU
Programs: Marriott Gold Elite, Hyatt Explorist, AA, Delta, Southwest CP, Citi Prestige, MLife Platinum
Posts: 103
The CP does not increase the earnings rate on any card and people need to remember it has a separate value whether used with a cash purchase or with points. Also, I would say the points earned to get the companion pass are the valuable ones - once you have it, points are not worth twice as much since you are going to fly free either way on the CP. Spending points on the non-companion are not twice as valuable, they only save the purchase of 1 ticket.
