Affinity Miles And Obtaining Awards
Nov 13, 2002, 1:45 pm
#1
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Affinity Miles And Obtaining Awards
...and a very belated "Thank You" to someone out there.
Years ago (probably 1998) here on FlyerTalk, someone posted on how they purposefully didn't have any affinity bonus miles (hotel, phone company, credit card, etc.) post to their primary airline's frequent flyer program, as it seemed to improve their chances for obtaining lower mileage requirement, capacity controlled Saver awards, when they were not generally available.
I took that person's advice, have never regretted it, and to this day consider it the most valuable piece of advice I ever got here.
All that my Mileage Plus (United) account contains is actual flight miles and flight related bonues. All my affinity miles go to an airline frequent flyer program that I don't fly that often anymore (Delta most of the time).
Then, as that person experienced, when Saver awards could not be obtained normally due to capacity control, and all other options didn't pan out, the request for exception, when backed up with, "Look at my account. Every one of those miles comes from direct business with you folks. No dinning or MCI or credit card miles. All yours"...was acknowledged. And within a few minutes on hold or a call back later, an exception was made and Saver awards were almost always "found."
I know that with the current tide of "no waivers, no favors" out there, that this strategy may have less success in the future. But as of just the other day, it still carries a great deal of weight.
I tried for about an hour to find by searching the archives who this person was that gave this advice, as I have long forgotten. But if you are reading this right now...many, many Thanks for the great tip. I've never hit an immovable capacity control brick wall with it, and have never had to use a Standard award because of it.
BTW, it has always been quite humorous to call Mileage Plus and ask that they remove some piddly affinity bonus miles that snuck into my account by some old profile or oversight. When they ask me why, I tell them. And they usually respond, "Nice strategy."
Years ago (probably 1998) here on FlyerTalk, someone posted on how they purposefully didn't have any affinity bonus miles (hotel, phone company, credit card, etc.) post to their primary airline's frequent flyer program, as it seemed to improve their chances for obtaining lower mileage requirement, capacity controlled Saver awards, when they were not generally available.
I took that person's advice, have never regretted it, and to this day consider it the most valuable piece of advice I ever got here.
All that my Mileage Plus (United) account contains is actual flight miles and flight related bonues. All my affinity miles go to an airline frequent flyer program that I don't fly that often anymore (Delta most of the time).
Then, as that person experienced, when Saver awards could not be obtained normally due to capacity control, and all other options didn't pan out, the request for exception, when backed up with, "Look at my account. Every one of those miles comes from direct business with you folks. No dinning or MCI or credit card miles. All yours"...was acknowledged. And within a few minutes on hold or a call back later, an exception was made and Saver awards were almost always "found."
I know that with the current tide of "no waivers, no favors" out there, that this strategy may have less success in the future. But as of just the other day, it still carries a great deal of weight.
I tried for about an hour to find by searching the archives who this person was that gave this advice, as I have long forgotten. But if you are reading this right now...many, many Thanks for the great tip. I've never hit an immovable capacity control brick wall with it, and have never had to use a Standard award because of it.
BTW, it has always been quite humorous to call Mileage Plus and ask that they remove some piddly affinity bonus miles that snuck into my account by some old profile or oversight. When they ask me why, I tell them. And they usually respond, "Nice strategy."
Nov 13, 2002, 2:05 pm
#2
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I have long advocated this strategy (for relatively high mileage collectors), but for different reasons. In my case the reason is being able to find availability from one of several airlines.
Also - AA gives lifetime elite for 1M miles collected (from all sources) so it is worthwhile to designate AA as your secondary airline if you can hit the 1M target.
As an exception - I'll take affinity miles on my primary airline if there are associated bonuses.
BTW - I've always redeemed saver awards too.
[This message has been edited by PG (edited 11-13-2002).]
Also - AA gives lifetime elite for 1M miles collected (from all sources) so it is worthwhile to designate AA as your secondary airline if you can hit the 1M target.
As an exception - I'll take affinity miles on my primary airline if there are associated bonuses.
BTW - I've always redeemed saver awards too.
[This message has been edited by PG (edited 11-13-2002).]
Nov 13, 2002, 2:16 pm
#3
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Brooklyn, NY, US
Posts: 2,311
Another bonus to putting tons of miles into an airline you don't often fly is that if you redeem them for premium class travel you don't have to worry about having any status with the airline to get "good" service (premium check-in, lounge access, etc.).
Of course, you could do the same by buying premium class tickets on other airlines, but that goes against the point.
Nov 13, 2002, 4:00 pm
#4
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Maybe I am dense, but I don’t understand why an airline would favor this. Lets look at two frequent flyers:
Frequent Flyer 001 – has 200,000 miles in his account, all from flights and flight bonuses
Frequent Flyer 002 – has 250,000 miles in his account, 200,000 from flights and flight bonuses, and 50,000 from partner/affinity miles.
Why would an airline favor 001 over 002? Don’t the airlines sell the partner/affinity miles to hotels, phone companies, credit card companies, etc? If so, it should be a profit source for the airline, not a reason to downgrade that frequent flyer.
As Denzel Washington said in the movie Philadelphia, would someone please explain this to me like I am a four year old.
Frequent Flyer 001 – has 200,000 miles in his account, all from flights and flight bonuses
Frequent Flyer 002 – has 250,000 miles in his account, 200,000 from flights and flight bonuses, and 50,000 from partner/affinity miles.
Why would an airline favor 001 over 002? Don’t the airlines sell the partner/affinity miles to hotels, phone companies, credit card companies, etc? If so, it should be a profit source for the airline, not a reason to downgrade that frequent flyer.
As Denzel Washington said in the movie Philadelphia, would someone please explain this to me like I am a four year old.
Nov 13, 2002, 5:10 pm
#5
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You are not dense and it's a good question that I knew would be coming.
Yes you are correct. The airlines do sell miles.
But it's just the same as how one airline gives extra benefits for miles flown on them and not the same benefits for those flown on alliance partners. They consider direct business as non-diluted and more valuable.
Why?
In my experience, it's the perception all your miles come from direct business with United, the airline. Not from sold miles through United Loyalty Programs Inc. to MCI and then to Mileage Plus.
So when a reservationist looks at my account and sees, say a million miles, or looks at my lifetime totals as sees little or no miles from "other" sources, and they can see that all or the majority of it is from flying and not buying pudding, it may (and in my and others experience, does) impress them enough to go the extra mile for you.
In other words, you get to say to them in effect, "All these miles have come from my ... in the can, and not from eating from a can. Don't you think you can poke your keyboard and shake something loose for this loyal United customer and air warrior?"
It's all about preceptions and exceptions. And helping them see things they way they want to see it (whether they know it or not).
And the more ammo you can have to use in your persuasion gun (this, your YTD miles, your current status, your lifetime status, your revenue), can go just that much more to your advantage.
And I know that it may not make logical sense to many. But when have the airlines always done things logically? I'm just saying how it works in the real world for me (and others).
[This message has been edited by PremEx (edited 11-13-2002).]
Yes you are correct. The airlines do sell miles.
But it's just the same as how one airline gives extra benefits for miles flown on them and not the same benefits for those flown on alliance partners. They consider direct business as non-diluted and more valuable.
Why?
In my experience, it's the perception all your miles come from direct business with United, the airline. Not from sold miles through United Loyalty Programs Inc. to MCI and then to Mileage Plus.
So when a reservationist looks at my account and sees, say a million miles, or looks at my lifetime totals as sees little or no miles from "other" sources, and they can see that all or the majority of it is from flying and not buying pudding, it may (and in my and others experience, does) impress them enough to go the extra mile for you.
In other words, you get to say to them in effect, "All these miles have come from my ... in the can, and not from eating from a can. Don't you think you can poke your keyboard and shake something loose for this loyal United customer and air warrior?"
It's all about preceptions and exceptions. And helping them see things they way they want to see it (whether they know it or not).
And the more ammo you can have to use in your persuasion gun (this, your YTD miles, your current status, your lifetime status, your revenue), can go just that much more to your advantage.
And I know that it may not make logical sense to many. But when have the airlines always done things logically? I'm just saying how it works in the real world for me (and others).
[This message has been edited by PremEx (edited 11-13-2002).]
Nov 13, 2002, 10:44 pm
#6
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: Oak Park, IL
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What do you mean by "lower mileage requirement, capacity controlled Saver awards, when they were not generally available"
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Ms.DtG
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Ms.DtG
Nov 13, 2002, 11:11 pm
#7
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I mean when they aren't available on the flights you want. As in no Saver Award inventory available.
Standard Awards are ones that don't have capacity controls, but cost much more in mileage.
[This message has been edited by PremEx (edited 11-13-2002).]
Standard Awards are ones that don't have capacity controls, but cost much more in mileage.
[This message has been edited by PremEx (edited 11-13-2002).]
Nov 13, 2002, 11:17 pm
#8
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I guess the trade off to having all your miles go into your primary account is that you would have more miles to use for anytime awards. My main airline is AA, and it's filled with non-flying miles - probably more than in flight miles. Of course, because AA allows for lifetime status, there is an incentive to have EVERYTHING I can go there. Once I reach lifetime Platinum I will think some of this differently.
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Ms.DtG
Nov 14, 2002, 12:05 am
#9
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Yes, if United had the same policy regarding what type of miles qualify for Million Mile/Lifetime status that American has, my strategy may have been quite different.
But I may have considered switching gears over to the pure flight miles strategy once I had already hit the Million mark.
But I may have considered switching gears over to the pure flight miles strategy once I had already hit the Million mark.
Nov 14, 2002, 8:50 am
#10
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Brooklyn, NY, US
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<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by PremEx:
Yes, if United had the same policy regarding what type of miles qualify for Million Mile/Lifetime status that American has, my strategy may have been quite different.</font>
Yes, if United had the same policy regarding what type of miles qualify for Million Mile/Lifetime status that American has, my strategy may have been quite different.</font>
The lifetime elite benefits would be pretty cool no matter what, though.
Lifetime gold is a pretty small perk, but lifetime PLT at 2mm would be great- double miles for life!
Nov 14, 2002, 11:53 am
#11
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I find it difficult to believe that a UA Reservation Agent can make the call to give away a Saver Award, where one does not exist, based solely on the fact that one does not have an partner miles in their mileage accounts? In effect this agent is "giving away" 50 ~ 100% more miles by giving away a Saver award vs. a Standard award.
I guess if a lot of people can verify this with multiple examples I might be a believer. Personally I have ~ 1.33% partner miles currently, (all from the UA Mileage Plus Visa card) and I'd guess that has been constant for four years. I have not had any problems getting the Saver award, or awards on a Star Alliance partner using UA miles, that I wanted. I have however been very flexible in my requirements for (Saver) award travel.
I guess if a lot of people can verify this with multiple examples I might be a believer. Personally I have ~ 1.33% partner miles currently, (all from the UA Mileage Plus Visa card) and I'd guess that has been constant for four years. I have not had any problems getting the Saver award, or awards on a Star Alliance partner using UA miles, that I wanted. I have however been very flexible in my requirements for (Saver) award travel.
Nov 14, 2002, 12:01 pm
#12
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hmmmmm, this gets me thinkin'
WOULD THE AIRLINES ever BUY miles BACK from ME?...
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If speed is not your thing, distance may as well be. Enjoy and embrace it all!
WOULD THE AIRLINES ever BUY miles BACK from ME?...
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If speed is not your thing, distance may as well be. Enjoy and embrace it all!
Nov 14, 2002, 12:12 pm
#13
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<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by dream7:
Maybe I am dense, but I don’t understand why an airline would favor this. Lets look at two frequent flyers:
Frequent Flyer 001 – has 200,000 miles in his account, all from flights and flight bonuses
Frequent Flyer 002 – has 250,000 miles in his account, 200,000 from flights and flight bonuses, and 50,000 from partner/affinity miles.
Why would an airline favor 001 over 002? Don’t the airlines sell the partner/affinity miles to hotels, phone companies, credit card companies, etc? If so, it should be a profit source for the airline, not a reason to downgrade that frequent flyer.
As Denzel Washington said in the movie Philadelphia, would someone please explain this to me like I am a four year old.</font>
Maybe I am dense, but I don’t understand why an airline would favor this. Lets look at two frequent flyers:
Frequent Flyer 001 – has 200,000 miles in his account, all from flights and flight bonuses
Frequent Flyer 002 – has 250,000 miles in his account, 200,000 from flights and flight bonuses, and 50,000 from partner/affinity miles.
Why would an airline favor 001 over 002? Don’t the airlines sell the partner/affinity miles to hotels, phone companies, credit card companies, etc? If so, it should be a profit source for the airline, not a reason to downgrade that frequent flyer.
As Denzel Washington said in the movie Philadelphia, would someone please explain this to me like I am a four year old.</font>
In your scenario, I would think there would be no different in treatment. If your Flyer 1 and Flyer 2 held the same current status (which is obviously a big factor), I doubt UA would punish Flyer 2 for taking advantage of credit card, dining, and other bonus miles.
Seems like if United was adversely affected by those other mileage sources, they'd discontinue the programs. We know they aren't adversely affected though: they make a profit when you use the UA Visa or an iDine restaurant.
Nov 14, 2002, 12:13 pm
#14
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<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by Marathon Man:
WOULD THE AIRLINES ever BUY miles BACK from ME?...</font>
WOULD THE AIRLINES ever BUY miles BACK from ME?...</font>
But Hilton and MilePoint will.
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More Room Throughout Coach: the Website of Free Miles and Free Markets
Nov 14, 2002, 12:19 pm
#15
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<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by transpac:
I find it difficult to believe that a UA Reservation Agent can make the call to give away a Saver Award, where one does not exist, based solely on the fact that one does not have an partner miles in their mileage accounts? In effect this agent is "giving away" 50 ~ 100% more miles by giving away a Saver award vs. a Standard award.
I guess if a lot of people can verify this with multiple examples I might be a believer. Personally I have ~ 1.33% partner miles currently, (all from the UA Mileage Plus Visa card) and I'd guess that has been constant for four years. I have not had any problems getting the Saver award, or awards on a Star Alliance partner using UA miles, that I wanted. I have however been very flexible in my requirements for (Saver) award travel. </font>
I find it difficult to believe that a UA Reservation Agent can make the call to give away a Saver Award, where one does not exist, based solely on the fact that one does not have an partner miles in their mileage accounts? In effect this agent is "giving away" 50 ~ 100% more miles by giving away a Saver award vs. a Standard award.
I guess if a lot of people can verify this with multiple examples I might be a believer. Personally I have ~ 1.33% partner miles currently, (all from the UA Mileage Plus Visa card) and I'd guess that has been constant for four years. I have not had any problems getting the Saver award, or awards on a Star Alliance partner using UA miles, that I wanted. I have however been very flexible in my requirements for (Saver) award travel. </font>
It may be a matter of perception, but I fail to see how one is more loyal if one only accumulates miles by flying. One could have 100% flight miles in their account, and still be taking flights on other airlines. And I would think that one is more loyal to a brand if they are availing of all the opportunities - flights, partners etc. since the airline makes money through partners.