Flights went up over night

Old Sep 22, 2017, 3:53 am
  #1  
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Flights went up over night

Flying BEG to CMH round trip with flexible dates 10/10 was the original date to 11/15 ( flexible dates)

prices were sub 600 usd all week including take off with Air Serbia which gives me 2 free checked bags to the USA.

I get on ITA Matrix today prices have jumped 150$ over night and nothing with air Serbia now it keeps sending me to air Austria which charges 150 euros for the second bag.

chance of it dropping? please help.....advise....... kinda stuck.
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Old Sep 22, 2017, 4:07 am
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Originally Posted by capljina614

chance of it dropping? please help.....advise....... kinda stuck.
Prices fluctuate all the time - here's a Google Flights tracker of a ticket I am waiting to buy.

However, given that your flight is apparently departing in less than 4 weeks, it would appear likely that the only fluctuations on your tickets will be upwards [in general, the sooner departure is, the higher the prices are. People with flexibility can move to other dates/routes to obtain later prices - people who *must* travel can therefore be charged higher prices as the date of departure looms. The cheapest tickest often have advance purchase restrictions, and the longer you wait, the more such cheap tickets disappear, either because the seats sell out, or because the departure date is too close for that fare to still be offered]. That said, it can't be ruled out that prices may come down again, however briefly.

My advice would be to use skyscanner, kayak, momondo or any other similar price comparison tool, and find the cheapest vendor of the ticket (many OTAs will probably offer the same flights for a little cheaper than going directly to the airline(s))
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Old Sep 22, 2017, 4:18 am
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what could be a reason that I seem to not be able to find anything through air Serbia for the first leg? I was only able to find something when constructing a multi city ticket.

if I buy a round trip direct ticket from BEG- JFK and subsequently buy a one way from JFK-CMH on the same day will I have to collect my bags and re check them with the airlines? or if a buy a multi city trip that forces it to pick air Serbia as the first leg do bags get checked all the way through?


if it says " air Canada operated by Lufthansa" who's baggage terms apply?

Last edited by capljina614; Sep 22, 2017 at 4:31 am
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Old Sep 22, 2017, 4:26 am
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Originally Posted by capljina614
what could be a reason that I seem to not be able to find anything through air Serbia for the first leg? I was only able to find something when constructing a multi city ticket.

if I buy a round trip direct ticket from BEG- JFK and subsequently buy a one way from JFK-CMH on the same day will I have to collect my bags and re check them with the airlines?
You'd have to re-check bags at JFK anyway when you go through customs.
However, buying 2 separate tickets may be problematic if one of your flights is delayed. Also, most tickets in the US include zero free luggage.

if it says " air Canada operated by Lufthansa" who's baggage terms apply?
Lufthansa's.
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Old Sep 22, 2017, 4:36 am
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Originally Posted by capljina614
what could be a reason that I seem to not be able to find anything through air Serbia for the first leg?
Air Serbia has apparently suspended sales for the JFK route for at least part of your intended travel period
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Old Sep 22, 2017, 4:49 am
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they resume a week later with air Serbia

domestic baggage charges with American carriers for two bags is faaaaaar less than what Austrian is asking.

If I find an itinerary with a multi-city option that gives me air Serbia for the first leg that goes:

https://imgur.com/a/ZIle9

do the bags get checked all the way through?

pretty much my general concern is that I can not find anything with air Serbia as the first leg of the itinerary. as they allow 2 free checked bags.

Last edited by capljina614; Sep 22, 2017 at 5:18 am
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Old Sep 22, 2017, 6:12 am
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Originally Posted by capljina614

https://imgur.com/a/ZIle9

do the bags get checked all the way through?
As this appears to be a single ticket, issued on one e-ticket number, it would seem to indicate that you would benefit from "Interlining", i.e. the checking of your bag from Air Serbia to Air Canada at Heathrow.

However, I cannot guarantee that there is an interline agreement and that it would be observed for you, so you may have to collect your luggage on arrival at Heathrow (Air Serbia arrives at T4) and bring it with you to to Air Canada check-in (Air Canada uses the Star Alliance T2 at LHR).

Of course, you will have to collect your bag on arrival in the US, and clear it through customs at the point of arrival - if flying with Air Canada, this would instead be done at Toronto/Montreal or wherever you are connecting, where there is US pre-clearance in operation. [I cannot remember if pre-clearance in Canada requires you to physically bring your bag through customs, or if they just show you your bag on a screen, as happens at pre-clearance in Dublin]

Originally Posted by capljina614
pretty much my general concern is that I can not find anything with air Serbia as the first leg of the itinerary. as they allow 2 free checked bags.
Given that Air Serbia won't be operating the transatlantic leg, you can forget about getting the Air Serbia allowance of two checked bags. On multi-carrier itineraries, the "most significant carrier" rule applies, which in general, for a Europe-to-US ticket, would mean that the allowance of the airline operating the actual transatlantic sector would be the allowance that applies to the entire ticket.

Last edited by irishguy28; Sep 22, 2017 at 6:19 am
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Old Sep 22, 2017, 6:20 am
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Originally Posted by irishguy28
Given that Air Serbia won't be operating the transatlantic leg, you can forget about getting the Air Serbia allowance of two checked bags. On multi-carrier itineraries, the "most significant carrier" rule applies, which in general, for a Europe-to-US ticket, would mean that the allowance of the airline operating the actual transatlantic sector would be the allowance that applies to the entire ticket.
Given that Air Serbia won't be operating the transatlantic leg, you can forget about getting the Air Serbia allowance of two checked bags.[/QUOTE]

incorrect. while that is true for the majority rule, flights to the usa use their origin carrier/origin market for bag allowance

for flights ending in the USA AirSerbia (JU) allows 2 free checked bags even with layovers and connection to different airways confirmed with the home office and airport in Beograd

further more; US DOT Regulation 399.87 applies to all flights on tickets whose origin or ultimate destination is the USA. And since April 2015 Canada introduced its own regulation 144-A-2014 which applies essentially the same rules as the US. These are known as the First Marketing Carrier rule

https://www.tripadvisor.com/Travel-g...ine.Trips.html
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Old Sep 22, 2017, 6:31 am
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Sorry, but I think your reading of that "FMC" rule is optimistically mistaken

Besides, it is unlikely that the ticket you lilnked to above would be issued on Air Serbia ticket stock - it seems far more likely that it would be issued on Air Canada stock. Air Canada only allows 1 23kg bag in Economy Class for free on transatlantic economy tickets.

Air Serbia has different baggage rules for European flights (BEG-LHR only qualifies for 1 23kg bag for free) than for transatlantics (2 23kg bags for free) - so to read all this as saying that you would beenfit from Air Serbia's transatlantic 2*23kg allowance when your ticket instead has a flight on Air Serbia that, by itself, only qualifies for 1*23kg - this being the applicable "First Marketing Carrier allowance" - and connecting to an Air Canada flight that, by itself, only qualifies for 1*23kg, is to read all these texts in a very hopeful manner.

But still, please let us know what you book and whether you can get a second bag for free [both as regards what the e-ticket says about the baggage allowance, and what the actual experience of travel is]!

(Having read the link you gave to tripadvisor, the "FMC" rule states that the baggage allowance of the flight of the first marketing carrier applies. In your JU BEG-LHR example, the baggage allowance is only 1*23kg bag, so despite what you apparently were told by the JU staff, Air Canada would not accept a second 23kg bag for free [and I suspect also that JU would not either]. See also the example I have reproduced below, where the "FMC" allowance of 0kg (on a domestic US segment) carries through and over-rides the free luggage allowance that would otherwise have been given on international JL-operated legs (which is 2 bags).)

Your linked page itself links to http://www.iflybags.com/

Try entering BEG to YYZ on JU, and compare the baggage allowance (1 23kg bag) versus BEG to JFK on JU (2 23kg bags).
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Last edited by irishguy28; Sep 22, 2017 at 7:02 am
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Old Sep 22, 2017, 6:35 am
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Originally Posted by irishguy28
However, I cannot guarantee that there is an interline agreement and that it would be observed for you
I can now tell you that the Air Canada website lists JU as one of their non-Star Alliance interline partners. Baggage should be checked through automatically between JU and AC flights on the same ticket. But it is always a very good idea to show the baggage tags to ground staff of the first flight on the different airline, just in case there are issues transferring between airlines on such tickets.
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Old Sep 22, 2017, 6:58 am
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I can't find anything regarding that it matters if the ticket is bought in Europe? what I do know for certain is that flights ending in the USA the origin market/carriers baggage policy applies.

most significant carrier applies to when you have to re-cehck in. To be precise, it is not the origin carrier, but the marketing carrier of the first segment. In this case, that appears to be JU. Thus, the JU allowance will apply to all segments of the ticket out to CMH and back (if there is a return booked on the ticket).

the link I posted is really in depth about the comparison of the 2 rules. anyways I hate that I used to last post of the day for this

used ita matrix and scanner to find
BEG - CDG - CVG

80 dollars more expensive than yesterday but it does use Air Serbia for Beograd to Paris
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Old Sep 22, 2017, 7:00 am
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Originally Posted by capljina614
I can't find anything regarding that it matters if the ticket is bought in Europe?
I've adapted my reply - see above - and it's not good news

You will only get Air Serbia's 2*23kg allowance if you travel on a JU flight between BEG and JFK. If, instead of this flight, you only have a shorthaul JU flight included in your ticket, you will only get an allowance of 1*23kg.
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Old Sep 22, 2017, 7:18 am
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Originally Posted by irishguy28
I've adapted my reply - see above - and it's not good news

You will only get Air Serbia's 2*23kg allowance if you travel on a JU flight between BEG and JFK. If, instead of this flight, you only have a shorthaul JU flight included in your ticket, you will only get an allowance of 1*23kg.
enter BEG to CMH on that site.

I think your grossly overlooking that there is a rule other than most significant.

US DOT Regulation 14 CFR 399.87 and CTA Regulation 144-A-2014 (First Marketing Carrier)


The US Department of Transportation (DOT) introduced its own regulation for baggage allowances and fees, and in April 2015 the Canadian Transportation Agency replicated these into Canadian law. Their focus is on ensuring that the allowance and fees remain the same for all flights on the same ticket. And they apply to all flights on tickets that originate or have an ultimate destination of the US. And note that while IATA 302 is an industry code of practice the US and Canadian DOT are law. Connections through the US or Canada (e.g. UK-US-Costa Rica) arent subject to these rules and IATA 302 would apply.

The US law states -

For passengers whose ultimate ticketed origin or destination is a US point, US and foreign carriers must apply the baggage allowances and fees that apply at the beginning of a passengers itinerary throughout his or her entire itinerary.

irregardless of stop overs and connection.
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Old Sep 22, 2017, 7:24 am
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Originally Posted by platoon
enter BEG to CMH on that site.
I can only assume that the website assumes you are travelling BEG-JFK on JU in order to get to CMH; hence you would have the 2*23kg limit.

Trust me - entering BEG-YYZ on JU is far more representative of the ticket you are actually considering buying.

I would advise you to talk to a human travel agent, if getting a free second bag is a dealbreaker for you. I am 99% certain that you are going to end up with a hefty baggage fee for a second bag if you book anything other than a ticket including BEG-JFK direct non stop on the JU-operated flight.

Last edited by irishguy28; Sep 22, 2017 at 7:30 am
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Old Sep 22, 2017, 7:27 am
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Originally Posted by irishguy28
Yes, and the first marketing carrier is JU, on a BEG-LHR sector, which only comes with a 1*23kg allowance - thereby being the allowance for the entire trip.

See again the example I posted above. With an AA domestic flight as the first sector, AA's domestic 0kg allowance becomes the allowance for the entire ticket - regardless of the fact that AA have an actual baggage allowance for international trips [so the argument above, that JU's allowance of a type for a type flight that is not actually appearing in the ticket - the JU TATL 2*23kg allowance - should apply, falls down], and regardless of the fact that the JL international sectors in the example would have a 2*23kg allowance themselves...if only there hadn't been this AA domestic sector at the beginning, pushing its allowance onto all subsequent sectors via this "FMC" rule.


0kg and a $25 bag fee applies across the entire ticket, as this is the allowance attributed by the "first marketing carrier" to the first sector of the ticket.
you know you are completely ignoring that first marketing carrier applies throughout a whole ticket trip itinerary for flights who's destination is the USA?
what AA domestic sector in the beginning? he's flying FROM Beograd to the usa?


HE'S IN SERBIA IN THE BALKANS GOING TO THE USA
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