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The Heat is On - another longhaul economy trip in under 60 hours

The Heat is On - another longhaul economy trip in under 60 hours

Old Jun 4, 2007, 11:42 pm
  #16  
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Sydney Qantas First Class Lounge Menu (outside dining area)

BREAKFAST
AVAILABLE UNTIL MIDDAY

Organic Egg, Smokehouse Bacon and Tomato Relish Sourdough Roll

Organic Egg Omelette with Leg Ham, Leek and Gruyere

Organic Egg Omelette with Tomato, Ricotta and Chives*

Whole Grain Toast with Avocado, Snow pea Sprouts, Lime and Cracked Pepper *

FIRST CHOICE
IF YOU PREFER TO HELP YOURSELF A RANGE OF ITEMS HAVE BEEN FRESHLY PREPARED FOR YOU TO SELECT FROM AT YOUR LEISURE

Fruit Salad, Bircher Muesli, Sheep’s Milk Yoghurt, Organic Honey

From the Bakery
Daily Selection of croissants, Danish pastries and freshly baked muffins, served with your choice of condiments

* Healthier option

ALL DAY DINING
AVAILABLE FROM MIDDAY

A Selection of Tapas

Freshly Sliced Prosciutto

Salt Cod Fritters

Fried Stuffed Olives

Meatballs in Spicy Tomato Sauce

Mains
Seasonal Soup – ask your waiter for today’s selection

Organic Egg Omelette with Leg Ham, Leek and Gruyere

Salad of Poached Chicken and Leeks Vinaigrette*

Manna From Heaven Mushroom and Parmesan Tart

CHEESE
PLEASE ASK YOUR HOST FOR TODAY’S CHOICES

Cheese, served with Accompaniments Farm House Cheddar, Rouzaire Brillat Savarin – Calendar Cheese Company


WINE LIST

White Wine

Knappstein Three 2006, Clare Valley, South Australia

Cape Mentelle Semillion Sauvignon Blanc 2005, Margaret River, Western Australia

Meerea Park Epoch Semillion 2005, Hunter Valley, New South Wales

Giant Steps Chardonnay 2004, Yarra Valley, Victoria

Dominique Portet Fontaine Rose 2006, Yarra Valley, Victoria

Champagne

Moet & Chandon Brut Imperial

Veuve Cliquot Ponsardin

Moet & Chandon Rose

Red Wine

Yering Station Pinot Noir 2005, Yarra Valley, Victoria

Meerea Park Shiraz Viognier 2005, Hunter Valley, New South Wales

Torbreck Cuvee Juveniles 2005, Grenache Shiraz Mourvedre, Barossa Valley, South Australia

Parker Estate Terra Rossa Cabernet 2004, Coonawarra, South Australia

Dessert Wine

De Bortoli Noble One 2004, Riverina, New South Wales


BEVERAGE LIST

Aperitifs

Campari, Cinzano Blanco, Noilly Prat

Spirits

Glenlivet 18yo Malt Whiskey
Chivas Regal 12yo Scotch Whiskey
Johnnie Walker Black Label
Bombay Sapphire Dry London Gin
Tanqueray Gin
Wyborowa Single Estate Vodka
Bellvedere Vodka
Bacardi White Rum
Inner Circle Dark Rum
Bundaberg Dark Rum
Wild Turkey Bourbon
Jack Daniels Bourbon
Cuervo Tequila

Beers

Cascade Light, Cascade, Heineken, Crown Lager, James Squire

Digestives, Liqueurs and Ports

Bailey’s Irish Cream
Cointreau
Drambuie
Tia Maria
St Agnes 5yo Brandy
Martell Biscuit VSOP
Grant Burge 20yo Tawny
Morris Liqueur Tawny
Morris Liqueur Muscat
Morris Liqueur Tokay
Harvey’s Bristol Cream Sherry


NON ALCOHOLIC

Range of freshly squeezed juices
Orange Juice, Apple Juice, Tomato Juice
nudie Passionfruit and Orange Energiser Drink, designed by Neil Perry
nudie Mango and Passionfruit Juice
nudie Strawberry and Banana Juice
San Pellegrino Acqua Panna Natural Mineral Water
San Pellegrino Sparkling Mineral Water
San Pellegrino Chinotto, San Pellegrino Limonata, San Pellegrino Aranciata Rossa
Ginger Ale, Lemonade, Cola, Diet Cola


HOT BEVERAGES

COFFEE
ESPRESSO COFFEES USE THE PREMIUM GIANCARLO BLEND FROM GRINDERS COFFEE

Espresso, Long Black, Café Latte, Flat White, Cappuccino, Mocha, Decaffeinated, Filter, Liqueur Coffee

Hot Chocolate

TEA
A SELECTION OF TEAS BROUGHT TO YOU BY T2 FROM SOME OF THE FINEST TEA PLANTATIONS IN THE WORLD

Peppermint
Lemongrass and Ginger
English Breakfast
Earl Grey
China Jasmine
Chamomile
Chai
Sencha
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Old Jun 5, 2007, 1:10 am
  #17  
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Originally Posted by Shano
If successful in doing this, how would you then get back landside?
Use lift to go back down to the transfer area on the arrivals level. Play the novice and humbly tell them you were side-tracked and wish to exit thru immigration/customs. ...
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Old Jun 5, 2007, 5:44 am
  #18  
 
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Great Report Kiwi Flyer! ^ ^
From various reports (yours included naturally) the what I would term 'boarding pass ask' does appear a bit trying! We could make up a very satirical flow-chart on the subject.

Also just reading through has made me think - Flyertalk could probably teach the designers a thing or too with a list of common lounge design faults.
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Old Jun 5, 2007, 6:21 pm
  #19  
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Sydney to Bangkok (SYD-BKK) on BA 747-400 (low J config)

Refreshed although still rather tired I headed out to the gate a little early (well before any call in the lounge), or so I thought. I wasn't sure how full the flight would be as the seatmap, booking class availability tool and bookings available on BA's website were not consisted. On the day of departure BA was selling SYD-BKK return for around A$1000 incl tax, which indicated not so full, but yet seatmap and availability tool suggested rather full (but not oversold). So I decided to play it safe and head to the gate early so I could be sure of nearby overhead bin space.

When I got to the gate, boarding was already well underway with a long queue at the BP machine and few passengers sitting on the chairs. Again, I was able to saunter past the long line and use the empty premium and elite boarding line.

At the time of booking, and for some months after, the manage my booking seat map was strange with just one row in the forward economy mini-cabin. On the second day before departure it reverted to a more expected 2 1/3 rows (3 rows in the middle and 2 rows on either side), so I took the opportunity to switch to the rear of the mini cabin, selecting an aisle seat where the window was already selected but not the middle, in order to maximise my chances of empty middle seat. Once boarding was completed I was pleased to see it had worked. Indeed the mini-cabin had about 3 or 4 empty seats, vs none in the main cabin behind us.

We had a moderate delay on departure. Apparently there had been some threat made and a few armed police spent over 30 minutes wandering back and forth in the aisles. Not sure what they were looking for, as with all pax seated the views of carryons stowed at feet would be minimal. I guess the threat wasn't specific as we were not asked to deplane, identify bags or anything other than to stay in our seats. Eventually they left and we were allowed to depart somewhat late. I'm not sure the announcement made was that reassuring. Given the presence of the police was noticed by all passengers other than blind freddy, they had to say something. But what do you say?

The seats are cramped, noticeably moreso than on Qantas, and especially compared with Air NZ which I'd flown recently around the world. When the seat in front was reclined I felt forced to recline also. As for getting out easily when the seat in front is reclined - forget it. The fixed aisle armrest means a choice is made between practising for the next limbo contest and pulling on the seat in front to squeeze past. Mindful of how I don't like my seat being pulled on behind, I opted for the flexi approach. But if I'd been sitting in the window seat that may well have been different, especially after a few drinks (limbo is hard enough for me even without the effects on coordination of a few, okay a lot, of drinks).

IFE was loop system with about 18 so-so choices.

First meal was dinner. A choice of beef or chicken (what a surprise ), but the trolley being used on my side of the aircraft seemed to only have beef - I didn't matter what you asked for, beef is what you get. The meal was not very edible, and the wine cheap and nasty, and so I was glad to have had lunch and some drinks in the lounge.

I wanted to sleep during the flight and managed a couple of hours light dozing. Not as much as I hoped.

The bottled water was nice for economy. Shame they only had enough for 1 per passenger.

About 2 hours before landing we get a "light meal" in a bag. A large roll that has next to no filling, just a couple of pieces of lettuce. A salad. A cookie. More drinks.

We landed in the dark (of course) in between thunderstorms sweeping past Suvarnabhumi airport. The taxi on arrival was rather long. There's nothing like a long taxi after a cramped longhaul flight to infuriate - the thought of soon being able to untangle limbs and stretch out is uppermost in the mind, and yet the minutes tick by as slowly make way first towards the terminal and then past other piers to our gate.
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Old Jun 5, 2007, 6:53 pm
  #20  
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Bangkok Suvarnabhumi airport transit

We exited through door 1L and I made my way rapidly to the new Qantas first class lounge. Fortunately I am a fast walker when I need to be, somewhat familiar with the layout of the airport and we had a gate far enough away from the lounge that I could pass most of the much slower first and business class passengers ahead of me.

Why was I rushing when I have a long transit? The reason is I desparately wanted a shower, and had heard (thanks to FT) the new lounge gets rather full due to the high number of first class and one world emerald passengers travelling through to London on British Airways and the similarly timed Qantas flight. The Qantas lounge closes once the onward flights are boarded so I didn't have a lot of time to wait for a shower to become free.

This was one factor in my decision to take the British Airways flight instead of the slightly later Qantas flight. Of course the police search on departure put paid to arriving first so I could have taken Qantas after all.

Amazingly I was one of the first couple of passengers to arrive from the BA flight and yes there was a shower free. Once refreshed I dropped my bags off in a corner of the lounge, which by now was standing room only (and indeed I saw several customers leave the lounge to wait in the public area of the terminal - it was that overcrowded). Next door I spied an empty and closed Cathay Pacific lounge (which I later found was also empty and closed for the transit in the other direction). Wouldn't it have made more sense to combine the lounges for something much bigger? Flights between the London Heathrow and Sydney hubs will always have a lot of premium and elite passengers on Qantas and British Airways, so the overcrowding can hardly be a surprise to the planners.

By good luck a computer terminal became free and I tried OLCI'ing again for tomorrow's return flight. Still no luck.

While the lounge was still open I cautiously approached the friendly lounge agents. Ideally I would not have taken up their time at what is undoubtedly their busiest time on shift (together with the transit of the 2 flights to Sydney). However, with the lounge closing and no opportunity to approach a BA check in or transfer desk agent (BA's transfer desk being open roughly the same hours as landside check in) I was in a pickle and so politely asked for a few minutes of their time. They attempted to check me in, but computer says no. I gather all the info I could think of to help me decide what to do, and retreat to think some more.

I am getting ahead of myself. What is this problem? The side trip I had selected (more on this later) was necessarily purchased as a separate ticket. Due to the schedule of the return flight and available options for the side trip I had a shortish (about 90 minutes) connection at Bangkok on the way back. When I purchased the side trip I decided I likely had enough time to manage the misconnection risk due to the availability of OLCI on British Airways on flights from Bangkok. Now the OLCI wasn't working, I would have to hope the side trip returns back on time, uses a gate not at the far end of the terminal (and I thought it was likely the arrival gate would be in C concourse, about as far as possible from the G concourse used by BA), make like a banshee across the terminal, pray for no queues at transfer desk or at the lounge entrance, and check in in time before it closes for the flight. To add to my stress levels, I had been observing the on-time performance of the side trip flights for the past week or so, and found about every second day they ran 2 hours late! Further, the BA flight back to Sydney leaves after the QF one (so not possible to be protected on a later flight) and a misconnect would cause some problems at work (ie by not getting back in time).

Right about now I was seriously thinking of chucking in the side trip, but I decided to mull it over some more and come to a decision in the morning. So I asked for an information note to be added to my record, to indicate my arriving flight. While it would not provide protection for a serious misconnection, it might buy me a few minutes if my flight to Bangkok is on time or only slightly late.

That done, I grabbed a couple of drinks for fortification of my nerves, checked emails and asked for opinions of some friends about what they would do in my shoes. Eventually the 2 flights boarded and the lounge emptied. I was then asked to leave so they could shut up for the night, and so I headed into the public areas of the terminal.

More to come ...
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Old Jun 5, 2007, 7:58 pm
  #21  
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While I thought about where I'd spend the night (hotel or airport), I decided to walk and explore, for I was still not unkinked properly from the flight over. Despite Suvarnabhumi airport having been open for less than a year, I have transitted many times. However, until now, each transit has been very short with insufficient time to explore much beyond transfer desk, lounge and gate.

Now was my chance to check out the terminal (or at least the airside bits) at a leisurely pace, and compare it with the old Don Muang terminal as well as other hub airports.

I spent the next couple of hours wandering the three levels around the 5 and a bit international concourses, to the accompaniment of an amazing light and sound show outside (ie almost continuous thunderstorms) and the drum of the rain.

Unlike Don Muang, all the shops, restaurants, etc remained open all night. The ratio of staff to passengers was more than one staff to one passenger, even not counting various cleaners and security types.

There is a surprising amount of art, but much of it is on the lowest levels with larger pieces on the middle and upper levels.

Once the "midnight" bank of flights has arrived and departed the terminal is fairly quiet.

There are not a lot of seats in public areas. Some by each transfer desk area, but these are noisy places thanks to the atrium connections to upper levels. A better place is the "Thai economy passenger lounge" on the upper level of concourse B. These have a lot of comfy chairs tucked around a corner to keep the noise level down (except the patter of rain overhead and booms of thunder). Naturally they are in demand, with almost all taken when I wandered here about 3 or 4am.

There are lots of lounges, several Thai, a couple of Cathay Pacific (I guess their many flights are spread out over more than one concourse which seems odd, or maybe they wanted to annoy QF/BA by taking the space next to the Qantas first class lounge?), a few Louis Tavern CIP lounges which seem to be the only ones open 24 hours, and many lounges for a myriad of airlines both well known and obscure.

The various Thai lounges have different opening (and closing) hours, so I made note of the first one to open. By now I realised there was no point in going to a hotel and so kept walking some more.

BTW the first transit desks open at 5am, by which time there is a long queue of waiting passengers. The first TG lounge also opens at 5am and is empty, thus I went there instead. Unfortunately they were unable to issue my boarding pass - need to check in with transfer desk They were, however, happy enough to let me in once they confirmed my onward flight. In fact, this is an ideal situation for me, in that I have some further time to decide whether or not to take the side trip.

Meanwhile, I grab a few coffees and check my email. It was unanimous - I was advised by all I'd asked to not try the side trip. Hmmmm.

On the plus side I noted from the departure screens the flight appeared to be on time (for now), and confirmed this with the lounge agent. On the minus side, the gate used was indeed in concourse C.

I noticed from the arrival and departure information on the Qantas website that last night's Qantas flight to London had returned to gate after pushback (or even possibly takeoff?) for a while before departing very late. Does anyone know the reason?

Last edited by Kiwi Flyer; Jun 5, 2007 at 9:00 pm
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Old Jun 6, 2007, 2:10 pm
  #22  
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Should I stay or should I go now?
(with apologies to The Clash)

About 80 minutes before schedule departure I left the lounge and wandered over to the gate, to check an aircraft was already there (check), was not having maintenance done (check) and seemed to be able to depart on time (check).

I mentally tossed a coin and decided to go for the side trip, so I headed to the transfer desk and checked in with minutes to spare before check in closed. There was some reluctance to check me in without an appropriate visa, but eventually I convinced the agent that I did not need one as I would only be in transit (I'd checked the rules off timatic and had a print out ready to pull out if needed). I asked to get the boarding pass for the return flight. Computer says no

Incidentally, if I had pulled out of the side trip I could have refunded most of the fare. Given the riskiness I had made sure to book a fare that was refundable even if I no showed, although I balked at the high cost of a fully refundable fare and compromised with a mostly refundable fare.
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Old Jun 7, 2007, 12:05 am
  #23  
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Originally Posted by Kiwi Flyer
... Next door I spied an empty and closed Cathay Pacific lounge (which I later found was also empty and closed for the transit in the other direction). ...
Hmmm, the CX lounge was open the afternoon of May 12 during the BA9/QF2 elite invasion of the QF/BA lounges.
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Old Jun 7, 2007, 12:34 pm
  #24  
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Maybe on the day I was flying back CX was only assigned gates closer to their other lounge?
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Old Jun 7, 2007, 7:04 pm
  #25  
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Bangkok to Dhaka (BKK-DAC) on TG A300-600

When I chose a destination for the side trip I looked at various places I haven't been to before. I needed somewhere that did not require a visa in advance (since insufficient time in between international trips to get it) and preferably not a visa on arrival (since I have such little space in my passport). I needed an e-ticket, for insufficent time for ticket to be mailed to me (and in any event some fares are only available from Thailand).

The schedule needed to fit between flights, preferably with at least a couple of hours to connect in each direction. I wasn't able to achieve this.

So I ended up choosing Dhaka, Bangladesh on Thai.

I headed for a lounge nearby the gate to await boarding time (and incidentally keep an eye out for any signs of delays). Then off to security, where there was a long line for 2 flights - seemed to be most of the passengers. Hmmm not a good sign for departing on time. They were checking every bag by hand, slowly, for liquids, before the xray and WTMD. Both screeners and passengers were slow both in the check and repacking afterwards. As it came to my turn I held up my liquid baggy and was invited to proceed without a hand check of my carry on.

By the time I reach the gate priority boarding has commenced, so I head straight onto the airbridge. Business class is fairly full today, but the cabin is reasonably roomy for a regional product. The seats remind me of Qantas old business class seats (just different fabric I think) in 2-2-2 format.

Before take off I am offered to sit at an empty row of 2 in the back of business class, but since that row has no window I decline. We then get the usual pre-take off drinks, a hot towel, newspapers and magazines. A printed menu is handed out. We take off late, but not so late that I worry about my return tight connection. Being in a middle seat I don't get a good view of the mountains, plains and sea below.

I notice on GCM that we are on almost a straight line from the Sydney to Bangkok path.

There is a moderate turbulence for a while, but unlike the BA flight where the service was suspended and fasten seat belt sign on for about 3 hours without the slightest bump ( ), service continues throughout.

We descend over the sprawl of Dhaka to the airport. During the short taxi to the international terminal I am pleased to see airbridges (for the temperature is close to 40C and humid), and surprised to see several aircraft - it is busier than I expected.

On arrival I say goodbye (for now) to the crew and follow the sign left for transit.
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Old Jun 7, 2007, 7:25 pm
  #26  
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Dhaka to Bangkok (DAC-BKK) on TG A300-600

Transit is confusing. Other than the sign in the corridor connecting all the airbridges there is no signage. I made my way to a desk manned by a couple of official looking officers and state that I am in transit, where do I go and how do I get my onward boarding pass?

They ask to see my passport and flick through looking for a Bangladesh visa, which I do not have. My response that I thought I didn't need one is met with silence - which I wasn't totally confident was a good thing. He asked for my itinerary, and had some trouble believing it. He couldn't get into his head why anyone would arrive at Dhaka from Bangkok and want to immediately return to Bangkok. Eventually he wandered off somewhere, leaving me to wonder if (a) I'm in big trouble with immigration, (b) I'm not in trouble but may miss the return flight anyway - what would I do then?, or (c) he's off to check me in landside (there being no facilities for check in airside).

After an anxious 30 minutes I found the answer was indeed (c). Yay. I then went through the overcrowded waiting area and up the stairs (no lift or escalator here) to the Thai lounge upstairs. Yes, even though Thai has only 1 flight a day to Dhaka they have their own lounge. Although the lounge doesn't offer much (some nibbles and drink, 1 computer, and welcome aircon), it is a sanctuary from the heaving masses below.

I hop on the computer to check if my BA flight is running to time. The computer has a very slow connection so I have no time to do anything else before boarding is called. Downstairs to the security at the airbridge. Here again a manual inspection of the carry on, but I am unsure what they are looking for as the check is very cursory and in any case liquids are allowed in Bangladesh (one of the few remaining for international flights).

Back on board it is another fullish flight in business class. We have a delay on departure as it takes a looong time for the last passengers to board - something about congestion at immigration.

With lunch being not so long ago, and tired from lack of sleep I skip the service and doze on the way back, trying not to think about my tight connection which is now very tight. I estimated I would have about 10 minutes to make my way from arrival gate to the departure gate or lounge to beat check in closing (40 minutes before departure). I pysch myself up for a run.

Again a middle seat so not much view of the scenery en route

We lose more time on arrival by flying right past Suvarnabhumi and over the gulf, looping around to land. Now I think - do I have the phone number to call BA to plead to keep check in open a few more minutes for me? Maybe in my bag somewhere but I'll lose valuable minutes searching for it.

Then I get a lucky break. We taxi past concourses C and D, avoid getting a remote stand.
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Old Jun 7, 2007, 10:47 pm
  #27  
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continued ...

Yah, we got concourse E, saving quite a distance of walking. Even better it was at the end of the concourse. Why is this better? Because I can walk past any other pax and a clear run through to the lounge in concourse G, which I make after a few minutes of running.
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Old Jun 8, 2007, 4:53 pm
  #28  
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Bangkok to Dhaka menu

First Course

Smoked salmon and shrimp mascarpone, salmon egg and mesclun salad with vinaigrette dressing

Main Course

Roasted lamb fillet with tomato fondue, roesti potatoes, grilled Mediterranean vegetables

Prawn in curry "chu-chee" (medium hot), steamed Thai hom mali rice, sauteed vegetables

"Chicken Hyderabadi" (chicken in curry with coconut cream), basmati rice with cumin, bhagre baigan

Assorted breads, biscuits, butter, cheese

Dessert

Chocolate fudge cake

Tea, coffee, espresso, cappuccino


Chu chee curry paste

Ingredients

Salt
Garlic
Dried chilli
Shrimp paste
Chopped shallot
Chopped galangal
Chopped lemongrass
Chopped coriander root
Chopped kaffir lime rind

Benefit for health

Kaffir lime rind : use for flatulence, dyspepsia, purify menstruation

Shallot : use for fever, phlegm, cold.
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Old Jun 8, 2007, 4:59 pm
  #29  
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Dhaka to Bangkok menu

First Course

Smoked salmon salad with thousand island dressing

Main Course

Pan-fried prawn in saffron with cream sauce, sauteed spinach in butter, steamed potatoes with Italian parsley

Lamb in yellow curry with potatoes, steamed Thai hom mali rice, sauteed vegetables

"Machhi ka salan" (fish fillet with spicy and sour), basmati rice with cumin, palak paneer

Assorted breads, biscuits, butter, cheese

Dessert

Baked egg custard with pumpkin

Tea, coffee, espresso, cappuccino


Yellow curry paste

Ingredients

Salt
Spice
Garlic
Ginger
Shallot
Galangal
Dried chilli
Shrimp paste
Lemongrass
Curry powder
Coriander seeds

Benefit for health

Chilli : stimulates blood circulation, increase appetite, digestion

Ginger : sweet spice taste, use for flatulence, phlegm, nourishing body, nausea
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Old Jun 8, 2007, 10:20 pm
  #30  
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Bangkok to Sydney (BKK-SYD) on BA 747-400 (mid J config with NNCW and avod)

I'm welcomed back to the lounge and quickly checked in. I have just enough time for a quick shower to freshen up. Unlike the way over the lounge is very empty, although the earlier departure of the Qantas flight has something to do with it (as well as the light load on the BA flight).

I grab a couple of drinks and then it is time for boarding. Boarding is completed quickly for the load is ridiculously low. This time we get the reconfigured layout with club world in between world traveller plus and world traveller. Some of the pax are grumbling to the cabin crew about it as I walk past to my seat. There is no economy mini-cabin, and the first economy cabin has about 25 passengers - yup enough room for a whole row of seats for every passenger! This, I think, is the reason OLCI wasn't working. They did not want people choosing their own seats. Although it would surely not have been too difficult to allow OLCI but disable seat selection?

The boarding process is quick but we sit at the gate with doors shut for a while, due to good tail winds we expect to arrive at Sydney too early for the curfew. Why couldn't they have delayed boarding? It would be more pleasant to spend an extra half hour in the lounge than sitting in a too hot a/c cabin.

Eventually we get underway. Dinner is choice of beef or chicken. I manage to get a couple of water bottles (begrudgingly given) for later. Once meal is finished I settle down with many pillows and blankets in my own bed across 4 seats. This isn't anywhere near as comfortable as a business class seat (one metal piece seems to find its way between the blankets), but nonetheless I get a few hours sleep before awaking to a far too hot cabin. I try but fail to get back to sleep and so check out the avod. It isn't too bad, apart from a much more limited selection than the likes of EK, NZ or SQ.

Before landing breakfast is served, which I pass on since I will be eating a decent meal in the first class lounge in no time.

Despite the long wait on departure and threatened arrival too early for the curfew, we end up arriving later than scheduled.
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