It is unfortunately legal for businesses in Denmark to add transaction fees when handling a foreign issued credit card. It is not legal for businesses to add any fees when customers pay with a credit card issued in Denmark or with the danish "Dankort". There are some rules, though: 1: The credit card fee added by the merchant must not exceed the fee that the merchant has to pay to the credit card company, hence the merchant can't earn anything on the fee, and 2: The merchant must clearly display that fees are added when paying with a foreign credit card.
It is unfortunately legal for businesses in Denmark to add transaction fees when handling a foreign issued credit card. It is not legal for businesses to add any fees when customers pay with a credit card issued in Denmark or with the danish "Dankort". There are some rules, though: 1: The credit card fee added by the merchant must not exceed the fee that the merchant has to pay to the credit card company, hence the merchant can't earn anything on the fee, and 2: The merchant must clearly display that fees are added when paying with a foreign credit card.
That sort of rounds up the problem, doesn't it? I was using an AMEX. All European Amex cards are issued in UK, does, however have the contact telephone number on the back to the country office where card holder lives. With a Danish Amex, issued in UK, but danish telephone #, no fee.
The merchant CC transaction fee is not solely based on percentage of sale.
However nice city CPH is, I'll look for other destinations for long weekends.
Last edited by onobond; Mar 25, 09 at 1:07 am.
Reason: typo
I don't think it has anything to do with the telephone number on the back of the CC, I think that is goes with the country, it's issued in. Danish credit cards, Mastercard(Maestro, Visa/Visa Electron are issued by PBS or a Danish bank. Danish American Express are issued by "Danske Bank".
That sort of rounds up the problem, doesn't it? I was using an AMEX. All European Amex cards are issued in UK, does, however have the contact telephone number on the back to the country office where card holder lives. With a Danish Amex, issued in UK, but danish telephone #, no fee.
The merchant CC transaction fee is not solely based on percentage of sale.
However nice city CPH is, I'll look for other destinations for long weekends.
Quote:
Originally Posted by chrismo2
I don't think it has anything to do with the telephone number on the back of the CC, I think that is goes with the country, it's issued in. Danish credit cards, Mastercard(Maestro, Visa/Visa Electron are issued by PBS or a Danish bank. Danish American Express are issued by "Danske Bank".
Looks as we're talking apples and pears. "Telephone number" might have read "Telephone number country code" to yet clearer point to what is the final decider.
Without knowledge of Danish MC or Visa issuing, I have however had a couple of talks with AMEX representatives, who confirm:
1. All European AMEX cards are issued inUK
2. Instructions to merchants from PBS, who have a monopoly of all card transactions in Denmark, is to check back of card for telephone country code, when in doubt if credit card Danish or foreign.
What I pointed out with my original post was that, in Denmark, au contraire to other countries, "foreigners" i.e. people paying with CC, despite of where the card is issued, but with other than Danish country code in contact telephone # on the back of card, have an extra fee of 3,75% on the card transaction.
Discrimination based on gender, race, religion etc is illegal in civilised countries. Seems necessary to add, at least in Denmark, country of domicile, regardless if this be judged by CC telephone country code, color of passport or other random way of deciding what is Un-Danish.
with other than Danish country code in contact telephone # on the back of card, have an extra fee of 3,75% on the card transaction.
Discrimination based on gender, race, religion etc is illegal in civilised countries. Seems necessary to add, at least in Denmark, country of domicile, regardless if this be judged by CC telephone country code, color of passport or other random way of deciding what is Un-Danish.
Agree. The extra cc fee should be based on type of ccard, or even better, on the fee/costs that is caused to the retailer by the acceptance of the payment by said card. It should not be based on the address of the credit card holder.
I agree that it is discriminatory, but not all types of discrimination are illegal, and it is not illegal to discriminate on country of issue of a credit card. Discrimination based on gender, race and religion, is also illegal in Denmark. Nevertheless, the fee is a really bad idea and not good for tourism!
By the way Danish Supermarkets Bilka, Føtex and Netto will from May 2009 start accepting credit cards; of course they add a fee for foreign cards. Coop (Brugsen and Kvickly) started accepting CC around a year ago. Non acceptance of credit cards in supermarkets in Denmark was/is a big problem for tourists here due to the national debit card Dankort, which around 95% of all Danes possess, and which is much cheaper for merchants to accept and free for the customers.
I would love for someone to show me how to acquire a Danish Dankort card or whatever it is called. I will be there in May and have time to set up an account or whatever is needed.
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Presently in Copenhagen, I was surprised to find many restaurants and shops have an extra charge of 3.75% on sales, when using a "foreign" credit card. The decision on what is foreign or not, is the country code in the phone # on the back. Using major restaurants, hotels and buying railway tickets, no extra charge. For that special present to yourself or someone special, or just stepping into the restaurant in front of you, this extra charge might be an ugly surprise.
Never seen this anywhere else in the world. Correct me please, if wrong
Quote:
Originally Posted by WilcoRoger
Just paid with my Finnish credit card at the CPH Hilton, no additional charges were made.
Of course it's possible that Scandinavian cards are not regarded strictly foreign issue.
No, as stated in OT, major restaurants and hotels do not enforce this fee.
I would love for someone to show me how to acquire a Danish Dankort card or whatever it is called. I will be there in May and have time to set up an account or whatever is needed.
The Dankort is easy to get, but I'm not sure how mutch "information" on you the bank will need! Most likely you will need a danish social security number (CPR number) before they will let you get an account!
Dankort is a debit card, but the system does not check if you have money on your accout when using it, it just checks to see if it is reported stolen! So you are able to "overdraw" your account really bad, and the banks will need some assurance that they will get the money in such case!
But try walk into a bank, and ask about it! They will try their best to get you one! The biggets banks in Denmark are Danske Bank, Nordea, Jyske Bank! You might want to try Nordea, since they have some benefits if you are to travel to other nordic countries, the Baltics and Poland!
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Not paying and waiting for the police might not be a good choice
Quote:
Originally Posted by graraps
Is it noted on the menu and/or prominently posted on a wall?
If not, I would tell them that, unless they waive the fee, I am not paying them ANYTHING and that they should call the police if they have any problem with that.
Obviously, I will bow if you know more about Danish law than I do. However, to my knowledge, it does not have to be written "prominently". In most cases it is written in small prints below the card symbols. When you choose to dine in the restaurant, a contract has been entered into, and you are liable to pay the total amount.
I think you might be allowed to leave and withdraw cash from an ATM, if paying with a foreign credit card and incurring the fee upsets you.
If you refuse to pay, you are committing a crime, since it is a specific crime in the Danish Penal Code to dine at restaurants without paying (sec. 298, p. 3). I think the police would probably tell you to pay, so they do not have to make your holiday unpleasant.
Quote:
Originally Posted by onobond
Never seen this anywhere else in the world. Correct me please, if wrong
You are correct, and you can work around this by paying in cash.
Quote:
Originally Posted by EasternTraveler
What do they consider a foreign credit card?
I can use one issued in the USA, UK or IE.
Domestic = Cards issued by domestic banks in Denmark, Greenland or Faeroe Islands from any national office.
I don't know what makes the Danish retailers think they are entitled to be the only country in the civilized world that doesn't accept credit cards at this scale or charges to use them.
I guess it's their right not to get revenue from visitors.
It's not unique at all that retailers get charged a fee by the credit card companies. EVERY retailer gets charged a fee in EVERY country of the world. They simply include the cost in the goods or services they sell. Also, it's not 3-5 or 6%. It's negotiable on how much revenue you have and it's typically between 1-3%.
Also, there's a % fee if you make a withdrawal with your debit card overseas as well.
The consequence? Well, I haven't been to Denmark for a few years and we just waited to do all the shopping till we got to the next country. I got sick of running to ATMs and it's also pretty annoying to get stuck with Danish Kroner when leaving this consumer unfriendly country
I don't know what makes the Danish retailers think they are entitled to be the only country in the civilized world that doesn't accept credit cards at this scale or charges to use them.
I guess it's their right not to get revenue from visitors.
It's not unique at all that retailers get charged a fee by the credit card companies. EVERY retailer gets charged a fee in EVERY country of the world. They simply include the cost in the goods or services they sell. Also, it's not 3-5 or 6%. It's negotiable on how much revenue you have and it's typically between 1-3%.
Also, there's a % fee if you make a withdrawal with your debit card overseas as well.
The consequence? Well, I haven't been to Denmark for a few years and we just waited to do all the shopping till we got to the next country. I got sick of running to ATMs and it's also pretty annoying to get stuck with Danish Kroner when leaving this consumer unfriendly country
Come over the Oresundsbro into Sweden. This consumer-unfriendly set-up does not exist there and even the Danes like to use their credit/debit cards in Sweden.
I am not sure what annoys me more: the credit card fees in Denmark or the ATM withdrawal limits in Argentina and their withdrawal related fees.
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I agree with your decision but not with your reasoning
Quote:
Originally Posted by tommy777
I don't know what makes the Danish retailers think they are entitled to be the only country in the civilized world that doesn't accept credit cards at this scale or charges to use them.
Actually, Denmark is not at all special in this regard nor is it the only civilized country in the world with this kind of arrangement. In Germany many stores only accept payment in either cash or an electronic bank card (Eurocheck) issued by a German bank. In Italy you will see that same thing: either cash or "Banco" (a domestic debit card).
So there is really nothing special with Denmark in this regard, save that some Danish stores do accept international credit cards. The surcharge is for the cards issued non-nationally and as the signs clearly say: "the entire surcharge is passed on to the banks". In other words, if you are a non-loyal customer only visiting the store rarely, then the store wants you to pay the expense of the credit card surcharge yourself, since otherwise the loyal local customers would have to pay your surcharge through higher prices. This seems entirely reasonable.
You can just pay in cash and avoid the whole issue. Besides, I think this surcharge is mainly charged in non-tourist stores like local supermarkets. If you are spending big money in a clothing store, I very much doubt they have the surcharge.
Also, you write "I don't know what makes the Danish retailers think they are entitled ..." They are entitled through what is called: the forces of the free market. They make a profit doing this, and that is the way that works. I know that the free market is very popular in America, so I would think that on further consideration perhaps you would support this surcharge.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tommy777
The consequence? Well, I haven't been to Denmark for a few years and we just waited to do all the shopping till we got to the next country. I got sick of running to ATMs and it's also pretty annoying to get stuck with Danish Kroner when leaving this consumer unfriendly country
Denmark is one of the most consumer friendly countries in the world (and apparently also the happiest country, as several studies have shown). Most stores have excellent customer protection and will give you the money back if you are unhappy. If not, you can complain to the Consumer Complaints Board (for a small fee of US $30) and they will rule in the matter. If the ruling is in your favour then the store must follow the ruling. Otherwise, in most cases, the Consumer Complaints Board will take the store to court on your behalf for free. (More information in English.) Please name some other countries, which have better consumer protection!
However, Denmark is also very pricey. If you travel a lot, there are certainly cheaper options around, and that is why I would agree with your decision not to do big shopping in Denmark.
At present, Sweden is the nearest cheaper option but the UK is also cheaper. I am naming these two countries because they also have reasonable consumer protection AFAIK.
Not paying and waiting for the police might not be a good choice
I agree with your decision but not with your reasoning
