Stick with Qantas or a large carrier for SYD-MEL
Aug 2, 2011, 8:13 pm
#1
Original Poster
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 49
Stick with Qantas or a large carrier for SYD-MEL
I recently booked on Tiger Airways for SYD-MEL-SYD, and now seriously wish I had booked on Qantas or another major carrier.
Tiger Airways' Australian services are still suspended after more than a month due to safety concerns raised by the Australian certification authorities. There were also customer service problems in the form of very long flight delays and poor communications.
Unfortunately Tiger won't agree to cancel my reservations and make a full refund. They basically have my money, are now a provenly unsafe airline, and are leaving me in limbo pending permission for them to fly again. Not a nice situation.
Tiger Airways' Australian services are still suspended after more than a month due to safety concerns raised by the Australian certification authorities. There were also customer service problems in the form of very long flight delays and poor communications.
Unfortunately Tiger won't agree to cancel my reservations and make a full refund. They basically have my money, are now a provenly unsafe airline, and are leaving me in limbo pending permission for them to fly again. Not a nice situation.
Aug 2, 2011, 8:21 pm
#2
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 44,555
If Tiger does not restart operations, then they will refund
If they do restart, then they must have satisfied CASA that their operations are safe and so no safety reason to not fly with them
Unless booked to fly with them imminently, I wouldn't worry too much and wait and see what happens tomorrow
If they do restart, then they must have satisfied CASA that their operations are safe and so no safety reason to not fly with them
Unless booked to fly with them imminently, I wouldn't worry too much and wait and see what happens tomorrow
Aug 2, 2011, 8:53 pm
#3
Original Poster
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 49
Other factors
Dave, my flights are in a peak (school break) vacation period, and I just can't wait for Tiger to cancel or not cancel my flights. I need to make other arrangements IN CASE they cancel at short notice.
They have already had to defer resuming operations at least twice. Put it another way: they two or three times gave dates by when they expected to satisfy the authorities, and failed to meet them. As I write now, they have dangled an expectation of flying again in front of the public - for August 1 (and it didn't happen), and for August 5 (which is too late for people to easily make alternative arrangements at low fares if it does not happen).
They also advised of updates to their status for "later in the week", and it didn't happen.
Regardless of CASA's blessing to start flying again, if it ever comes, I don't think you can change a safety culture in a few weeks. I've been in aerospace so long that I can almost predict that further problems will come to light as they rush to tackle those already identified to cover their behinds, leaving others unattended to.
Clearly they haven't changed their customer service culture either, or they would allow pax who made reservations before the service disruption to cancel with a full refund on request. They should accept they will have to rebuild customer confidence with people who want to place bookings after flights are allowed to resume. This is not a minor matter of poor records keeping, or a delayed service action. This is a systemic set of problems causing over a MONTH of grounding (so far).
Right now, they are just taking advantage of me, and leaving me in limbo.
They have already had to defer resuming operations at least twice. Put it another way: they two or three times gave dates by when they expected to satisfy the authorities, and failed to meet them. As I write now, they have dangled an expectation of flying again in front of the public - for August 1 (and it didn't happen), and for August 5 (which is too late for people to easily make alternative arrangements at low fares if it does not happen).
They also advised of updates to their status for "later in the week", and it didn't happen.
Regardless of CASA's blessing to start flying again, if it ever comes, I don't think you can change a safety culture in a few weeks. I've been in aerospace so long that I can almost predict that further problems will come to light as they rush to tackle those already identified to cover their behinds, leaving others unattended to.
Clearly they haven't changed their customer service culture either, or they would allow pax who made reservations before the service disruption to cancel with a full refund on request. They should accept they will have to rebuild customer confidence with people who want to place bookings after flights are allowed to resume. This is not a minor matter of poor records keeping, or a delayed service action. This is a systemic set of problems causing over a MONTH of grounding (so far).
Right now, they are just taking advantage of me, and leaving me in limbo.
Aug 2, 2011, 11:52 pm
#4
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Adelaide,Australia
Posts: 273
Qantas.Off the topic a little They are cashing in big time on Tiger's Suspension by jacking up the prices big time.I only discovered this the other day when my Brother needed to come from Melbourne to Adelaide and back again to go visit the doctors $400 for next week.That's even dearer than the Overland,Greyhound or Virgin Australia or Firefly Buses Go Figure that one out
DJ if you time it right and don't have luggage can be done for less than $300.
DJ if you time it right and don't have luggage can be done for less than $300.
Aug 3, 2011, 2:27 am
#5
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: MEL, AU
Programs: DJ Velocity, Skywards
Posts: 134
Aug 3, 2011, 8:03 am
#6
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Melbourne
Programs: QF Gold, VA Red, SQ, HH Silver, Marriott Gold.
Posts: 314
Regarding Tiger, it rather depends on when the holidays are. Given they may start up again soon, it might be worth waiting a week or so. But personally I would never trust or fly them. If you need to be certain book on Qantas or Virgin.
Regarding Qantas fares MEL/ADL I notice they are often on the high side, but I presume this is due to demand.
But for example on Wednesday next week you can do a return trip on Qantas for $220.
I do not see Qantas gouging because Tiger are not flying.
Regarding Qantas fares MEL/ADL I notice they are often on the high side, but I presume this is due to demand.
But for example on Wednesday next week you can do a return trip on Qantas for $220.
I do not see Qantas gouging because Tiger are not flying.
Aug 3, 2011, 9:16 am
#7
Original Poster
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 49
Tiger Airways and safety
Rick said about Tiger Airways: "But personally I would never trust or fly them."
That pretty well is what I'm thinking.
I took a look at what CASA flagged them for, as best I could find out. Of course, it's well known that more than one of their flights descended too low when approaching MEL. By itself, that's not a biggie, because ATC could catch it. Some flights weren't affected anyway if the crew never descended below the minimum altitude because their flight path never took them there. But what came to light is that Tiger Airways weren't maintaining a current set of "flight rules" on their airplanes, so were programming the flight director with the wrong information. This IS a biggie, because it calls into question the entire flow of information from manufacturer and certification authority and airports to Tiger's operations.
What could that mean? Examples (admittedly conjectural): a runway closure unknown to the crews; a change in the AFM (airplane flight manual) with new field length data at a high temperature condition; a change in operating procedure in severe turbulence.
As CASA probed for information, they found there was more and more to look at, and Tiger was sounding cooperative without being sufficiently responsive. I can post the link if anyone is interested.
So I fear that the errors were quite severe, and pervasive enough to require the almost-unheard-of grounding for a month (so far) by CASA. When coupled with a poor customer service record concerning delayed and cancelled flights with downright uncaring communications to passengers, I get the picture of an airline who thought that flying cheap allowed them to get away with just about anything. And they did - for a while. What finally irks me is that they are refusing to allow all pax who booked before this fiasco to cancel and get a full refund. The attitude is: "We got your money, and if we can keep it we will. Never mind that you booked on an airline with an unquestioned safety record, and now an unsafe history is evident."
That pretty well is what I'm thinking.
I took a look at what CASA flagged them for, as best I could find out. Of course, it's well known that more than one of their flights descended too low when approaching MEL. By itself, that's not a biggie, because ATC could catch it. Some flights weren't affected anyway if the crew never descended below the minimum altitude because their flight path never took them there. But what came to light is that Tiger Airways weren't maintaining a current set of "flight rules" on their airplanes, so were programming the flight director with the wrong information. This IS a biggie, because it calls into question the entire flow of information from manufacturer and certification authority and airports to Tiger's operations.
What could that mean? Examples (admittedly conjectural): a runway closure unknown to the crews; a change in the AFM (airplane flight manual) with new field length data at a high temperature condition; a change in operating procedure in severe turbulence.
As CASA probed for information, they found there was more and more to look at, and Tiger was sounding cooperative without being sufficiently responsive. I can post the link if anyone is interested.
So I fear that the errors were quite severe, and pervasive enough to require the almost-unheard-of grounding for a month (so far) by CASA. When coupled with a poor customer service record concerning delayed and cancelled flights with downright uncaring communications to passengers, I get the picture of an airline who thought that flying cheap allowed them to get away with just about anything. And they did - for a while. What finally irks me is that they are refusing to allow all pax who booked before this fiasco to cancel and get a full refund. The attitude is: "We got your money, and if we can keep it we will. Never mind that you booked on an airline with an unquestioned safety record, and now an unsafe history is evident."
Last edited by mayfam; Aug 3, 2011 at 9:18 am Reason: Typo
Aug 3, 2011, 9:44 pm
#8
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Sydney
Programs: Qantas Platinum, Hilton Honors Gold
Posts: 270
I recently booked on Tiger Airways for SYD-MEL-SYD, and now seriously wish I had booked on Qantas or another major carrier.
Tiger Airways' Australian services are still suspended after more than a month due to safety concerns raised by the Australian certification authorities. There were also customer service problems in the form of very long flight delays and poor communications.
Unfortunately Tiger won't agree to cancel my reservations and make a full refund. They basically have my money, are now a provenly unsafe airline, and are leaving me in limbo pending permission for them to fly again. Not a nice situation.
Tiger Airways' Australian services are still suspended after more than a month due to safety concerns raised by the Australian certification authorities. There were also customer service problems in the form of very long flight delays and poor communications.
Unfortunately Tiger won't agree to cancel my reservations and make a full refund. They basically have my money, are now a provenly unsafe airline, and are leaving me in limbo pending permission for them to fly again. Not a nice situation.
Unfortunatly not a lot that can be done other than a)Wait for the court ruling and go from there.
b) Go ahead and book on another carrier, and then see what happens to money later.
Aug 22, 2013, 8:19 am
#9
Original Poster
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 49
Got money back
Well, I tried to cancel, but their website could not process it. I sent them a letter confirming the cancellation. No reply. I made other travel arrangements.
They wouldn't refund, but I appealed to the credit card company. In the end, I got the charges reversed.
I will never book on Tiger again - even if they are now safe.
They wouldn't refund, but I appealed to the credit card company. In the end, I got the charges reversed.
I will never book on Tiger again - even if they are now safe.