MKEbound

He just thought, as I wasn't arrested and in the end none of my property was taken. However, I'm pretty sure he didn't call the LEOs over to discuss my recipe for beer pancakes and would have been pretty happy to see me arrested or at least a little intimidated.

GUWonder

That question sounds a bit like a false choice. By measure of the actions noted by the OP, the involved government employees at MKE engaged in hostile discriminatory treatment toward a traveling citizen on the basis of the traveling citizen's making a constitutionally-protected form of political expression.

Facing government intimidation for engaging in constitutionally-protected political expression unpopular with government agents is a suppression of the rights of American citizens. Witting or unwitting behavior, there's no excuse for this kind of activity from federal government employees.

Doppy

Citizen!! Are you questioning authority?!? That kind of attitude could get a comrade arrested, you know. Some would say that it should.

MKEbound

I fly home on Friday, and it's the only quart baggie I've got!

GUWonder

I'm going to carry two bags and alternate in my use of them. One will read: "Kip Hawley is a genius." The other will read: "Kip Hawley is an idiot." I'm sure the Communist Chinese government employees won't hassle me for flying with such items. More free under Communists in this limited regard?

kaukau

MKEbound - You got a set of onions on you, kid. Mazeltov.

Superguy

On the contrary. How many times do you read in the news that someone was supsended (put on admin leave, blah blah) pending the outcome of an investigation? If it's serious enough (and I think this case is), then it's warranted.

Bart, you of all people should know that there are some things you can let slide if there is remorse and mitigating factors and there are some things that are fireable on the spot.

To me, the overreaction isn't the issue. It's the "Your constitutional rights don't exist at a checkpoint." THAT'S what I have a problem with. And when you have sworn federal employees that have taken an oath to defend that freedom with their lives, I find it very contemptible that someone would blatantly trample on the constitution in a power trip.

You may not agree with that, and that's fine. Maybe you're a bit more benevolent than me.

Bart, I think you're letting your emotions force you into hyperbole. It's ok, pumpkin.

I'm no fan of TSA ... there's never been doubt about that. And you should know that after I worked for the government, I'm not a fan of bureacracy in any form. However, one thing that I hold very sacred is the constitution and the rights that it gives. And I'm not going to give a lot of leniency for a blatant violation of it by a federal employee such as this STSO. I've seen clearances revoked over a lot less, which in turn caused people to lose their jobs. My former employer always hammered the constitution into us and not to do anything to violate it. In fact, we couldn't even violate our own 4th amendment rights (bet you didn't know that it's possible ... it is). I'm disgusted that my former employer actively violated the rights of many American citizens while sitting there and preaching to me not to do it. Hypocrisy at its highest, and it doesn't sit well with me.

I hope you can understand that.

Super

PTravel

I want to be clear: your rights were repressed. When state action chills free speech the First Amendment is violated as a matter of law. It doesn't matter whether or not you were arrested, or whether or not your property was seized. You were intimidated in a heavy handed and clearly impermissible fashion.

And to Bart, there's no such thing as just a little tyranny. "I'm having a bad day" does not excuse violations of fundamental constitutional rights.

cme2c

Clearly the TSA is way out of control, but my honest first impression of the comment " Hawley is an idiot" was that it could have several meanings. So first day of this new policy: Hawley is an idiot, now I can carry a bomb on board. Or Hawley is an idiot and these stupid rules aren't going to stop me from hijacking a plane. We know that is not what the OP intended, but I can see how it could be construed as a form of a "threat". Again, clearly they over-reacted with the 1st Amendment garbage. But if you look at it from their perspective, their job (at least by description, we all know it's not really happening) is to provide security. Therefore their state of mind is to treat everything/everyone in a suspicious manner.

Regarding the previous posts about wearing a swastika to a synagogue... I agree that this is similar, but from a common sense perspective, not a civil rights perspective. Sure you have the right, but it's just stupid if you ask me and you got what you deserved. You were picking a fight and now complain when you got it. Sorry no sympathy here.

GUWonder

The LEO is most likely the government employee who can be more effectively and directly subjected to accountability by the citizenry. The TSA employees are generally far more insulated from individual review.

Also, the LEO could have pursued the disorderly conduct nonsense, not that it would sell well to public reviews.

Constitutionally-protected forms of political expression don't need any explanation beyond the fact that it's expression protected under the First Amendment of the Constitution. Are you really denying that calling Kip Hawley an idiot is a constitutionally-protected form of political expression?

We'll have to agree to disagree on that one. Anyone not willing to be a surrender monkey when it comes to their own constitutional rights is a winner in my book.

kaukau

Wouldn't freedom of expression apply to the TSA agent as well? Afterall, he may have expressed it, but did he act on it? GUWonder?

Bart

Deleted

flyzabit

Well, maybe it should have been written in Latin, or at least Pig Latin!

Maybe it should have said "Pray (with me) for Kip Hawley". You can take that however you want. Hey, that is "for", not "against", right?

Or, you could try writing it in a language with a non-Roman alphabet (Greek, Hebrew, probably best not Arabic or Farsi script, but then there are also syllabic (Japanese hiragana) or whole word/ideographs (Chinese) writing forms.

Can you imagine writing a profound fundamentalist evangelical statement or declaration in one of the above (beyond "Bless Bush" or "W '04")? Then upon questioning, tell them what it says ("J.C. is my personal L&S, etc.") and that you wish to witness to them, and hand them that little paper booklet about hellfire with a prayer at the end? I wonder if you would have been there 25 seconds, much less 25 minutes!
(and no I'm no heathen, so don't flame me...)

Superguy

I think there would be more accountability as the TSA agent was acting in his official duties as an agent of the government. If a pax had said that, sure, that'd be protected.

The government is made up of people and is not an unassailable machine.

mbstone

Gee, I've posted remarks critical of TSA to this forum, and just by coincidence, I don't get to check in at kiosks anymore. I haven't tried wearing a "F*** the TSA" shirt, but there is case law on point.