carpboy

Obviously the OP was guilty of something. Nobody with anything to hide would mind identifying themselves in any manner asked by any person for any reason in any place at any time.

dhuey

Because it's requested of everyone, it doesn't cost you anything significant in terms of time or pride, and most important, because there are more intrusive incursions into your privacy to challenge. Fight the big invasions of privacy (e.g., "now that I've stopped your for speeding, do you mind if I search your car?") and ignore the trivial ones.

bocastephen

Ignoring the trivial ones gives them the hubris needed to keep pulling off the big ones. We need to fight them all, big or small.

dhuey

Gilmore is the way all of the courts are going to deal with this specific ID requirement. You can fight a hopeless battle, if you like, but why?

genome4hire

She read my Virginia Drivers License # into her radio, and had someone perform some kind of check on me. It took all of about 10 seconds.

Due to the creative spelling of US government employees working at Ellis Island a few generations back, I understand that the only people in this country with my last name are related to me. I do not believe there is anyone else in this country with my full name, let alone in Virginia.

The DCA Police officer should have just as easily been able to read my name - which I had told her - into her radio, and would have gotten the exact same information back: A clean record.

genome4hire

Mr Gilmore didn't wish to undergo a secondary screening in response to declining to show ID. I am happy for them to search me, within reason.

What I would like them to do - is to follow their own stated policies. US Government lawyers told the court in Gilmore v. Gonzales that as long as someone is willing to undergo the SSSS treatment, that they can fly without ID. All I want, is to be able to do just that.

I want to fly, on a regular basis, within the US, without showing a single piece of ID. Once I've done this enough times, I want to be able to show someone my collection of used "NO-ID" boarding passes, and ask: "If I can fly without ID, what is the purpose of the no-fly list?"

I'm also not willing to go through one of those air puffer machines - which I regularly refuse to go through - but that is better left to another forum thread.

dhuey

Yes, the facts here alter Gilmore a bit, but what I'm saying is that in the air travel context, the courts are going to favor a requirement of ID production whenever it is squarely at issue. It won't matter whether it's TSA or an airport cop.

Like I mentioned, fight if that's your thing. I'm just saying these fights re air travel ID will always lose legally. And if the idea is to fight LEO/TSA hubris, losing to them in court is an odd tactic.

Travellin' Fool

Why subject yourself to any of that?
Seriously I don't get it? I must be missing something completely. The whole point of the game is to spend LESS time around the checkpoints.
Seems to me like a Pyrrhic Victory. Who are you going to show? The President? Your grandmother? The TSA officer at your airport? Your best bet is Chris Hansen w/ NBC. But he's busy chasing down real criminals.

PhilaBurbTom

It seems that this becomes a problem when you have ID on your person and refuse to show it. Why not keep your credit cards and ID of value (Benjamins for example )and pack what is considered by TSA/LEO as acceptable ID (DL, Costco card, library card )in your check-in bags if you are carrying any?

ND Sol

The courts will have a difficult time enforcing a requirement of ID production when the government says the requirement does not exist. That is the case we are discussing here.

exerda

Actually, given the OP's history, I think the media would be a fairly willing and receptive audience to such a demonstration. And anything that points out yet another flaw in the "no-fly list" (as if anyone with an IQ over 50 couldn't already see how stupid and useless said list is) is OK in my book.

exerda

Good point, but I would hesitate from putting anything like an ID inside a checked bag... wouldn't want the ID theft worries, myself.

gatorboy

On my most recent trip I got to the airport and whipped out my wallet and lo and behold my DL was not there. Traveling with my family including two young kids and thought we might have to miss the flight as I went back home to either look for my DL or get my passport. Frindly TSA person said just go back to check-in and get new special boarding pass. Got an SSSS and went on through. Luckily we were there at a very uncrowded time.

Later figured out had left my DL at a Costco which very kindly expressed it to me for Saturday delivery so I could continue my trip without any hassles. Thanks Costco.

Wally Bird

CVIN/NCIC check. The Supreme Court has ruled (Michigan v. Summers, 452 U.S. 692, 701 (1981) et al.), that this is permissible during the course of a Terry stop. But, a Terry stop itself requires a "reasonable and articulable" suspicion on the part of the officer. Since no applicable law* has been cited in this incident, OP provided oral identification and no evidence was provided of any other kind of suspicious activity (except in the minds of the TSA), the justification for the Terry stop itself would seem debatable.

Worth "fighting" ? Yes.
Worth spending money to do so ? Probably not. Sigh. YMMV

*And a precedent in Gilmore which would seem to support the legality of OP's action

MikeMpls

So you'd rather be searched & groped in lieu of showing ID?

Makes no sense to me.