Can I get in trouble at customs with external hard drives with downloaded music/film?

aviationx · May 20, 11, 5:07 pm

(here I copy and paste a question that was asked in another forum)

i am just wondering if i travel to Australia or America from England and I get stopped at customs, what happens if they check my 2 external hard drives?

I have 2 500GB hard drives that are full of music and tv shows and films that have been downloaded illegally. Can I get in trouble?

do I have to prove where the material has come from?

I dont think they will check what’s on the harddrives… Do they make people prove that they bought the music on their ipods?

gojirasan · May 20, 11, 5:11 pm

It is highly unlikely. I haven't heard of even a single case of this happening. But if you are concerned just encrypt the drives with truecrypt.

**Xyzzy** · May 20, 11, 7:38 pm

Fr

m everything I've seen and heard what they are really after when searching such devices is kiddie porn.

Global_Hi_Flyer · May 20, 11, 7:45 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xyzzy

Fr

m everything I've seen and heard what they are really after when searching such devices is kiddie porn.

But they may also go after folks that they think are engaging in the large-scale importation and/or sale of counterfeit and/or pirated items that are protected intellectual property.

**Xyzzy** · May 20, 11, 8:18 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Global_Hi_Flyer

But they may also go after folks that they think are engaging in the large-scale importation and/or sale of counterfeit and/or pirated items that are protected intellectual property.

Abs

lutely! They can also try to collect import duty for the drives themselves if they think you've exceeded the non-dutiable amount of goods...

Often1 · May 20, 11, 8:28 pm

The short answer is yes. Federal law enforcement is actively looking for illegal downloads. While that is not the focus of hard drive exams on entry, if found, you are subject to prosecution and massive civil penalties. Do not even think about bringing your hard drives to the USA.

AAToday · May 20, 11, 8:47 pm

How would they know it was an illegal download?

I've got 90 gb of music on an Archos personal DVR, not sure how they'd know if any was not purchased.

Affection · May 20, 11, 9:14 pm

I think technically they're supposed to be looking for contraband -- things that are prohibited -- rather than things that were simply illegally obtained. That said, if in the process of looking for contraband they "happen" to find something that gives them probable cause that you have committed a crime, they may arrest you. I suspect it will not be long before Obama directs his TSA to support the Hollywood actors that worked so hard for his election and begin looking for digital piracy.

--Jon

Often1 · May 21, 11, 9:36 am

Copyrighted materials which are lawfully downloaded are properly hached and that's immediately apparent on the software CBP uses for its scans. The law enforcement goal here is to deter the conduct. The fines are so enormous that travelling with illegal downloads is potentially ruinous.

lobster7 · May 21, 11, 1:31 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Often1

Copyrighted materials which are lawfully downloaded are properly hached and that's immediately apparent on the software CBP uses for its scans. The law enforcement goal here is to deter the conduct. The fines are so enormous that travelling with illegal downloads is potentially ruinous.

Still haven't read on anyone getting arrested for it.

jkhuggins · May 21, 11, 2:10 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by lobster7

Still haven't read on anyone getting arrested for it.

I haven't either ... but there are other penalties available besides arrest. Civil charges which can result in fines. Confiscation of the device holding the contraband. Denial of entry into the U.S..

I don't know how likely any of these are ... but they are certainly possible.

Affection · May 21, 11, 2:18 pm

Properly hached?

I'm not sure what that means, but so long as one cleared any of the "UPLOADED BY L33TP1R3TE420 ON THEPIRATEBAY" or similar tags on their stuff, there would be no way of telling whether I legally ripped the media from a DVD that I lawfully own, or whether I downloaded that rip from someone else. Further, even if it was downloaded from a torrent site, if I own the DVD it's still legal. Maybe I'm travelling and left my DVD at home, so I downloaded a copy on the road. Perfectly legal.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Often1

Copyrighted materials which are lawfully downloaded are properly hached and that's immediately apparent on the software CBP uses for its scans. The law enforcement goal here is to deter the conduct. The fines are so enormous that travelling with illegal downloads is potentially ruinous.

--Jon

Frodosan · May 21, 11, 2:21 pm

Quite a few years ago, a friend moved from the UK to the US. He shipped his computer with a large number of floppy disks--this was before mass storage was easily and cheaply available--and all of the floppies were seized by customs. Everything...programs, data disks, etc. He had to then prove to customs that what was on these disks (including his dissertation) were legitimately his. If they search your hard drives and find the TV and film files, they may well do the same. It took him months to get his stuff released.

Flahusky · May 21, 11, 2:50 pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by lobster7

Still haven't read on anyone getting arrested for it.

Arrested for piracy? can't recall any cases, however arrested,harassed for 'radical thinking' or being a 'threat' because of your skillz lots.
Blackhat/Greyhat people are frequent targets.

The 2 big cases for CBP/ICE are;
1- M. Arnold (kidde pr0n)
2- Xuedong Sheldon MENG. In November 2004. ITAR/ACEA violation

Other regular people have had their gear taken for extended examination and never received an explanation as to why.
Some have yet to get it back.

IF the CBP/ICE becomes an extension of the MPAA/RIAA/BSA (which is plausible) we are screwed.

Worst case, OP loses electronics, a few hours to CBP/ICE
Best case, OP enjoys their holiday with no issues from the US CBP/ICE

My question is why travel with that much data, stream it

a_random_guy · May 22, 11, 1:05 am

Customs is actively involved in enforcing copyright. Cynically, the whole hoo-hah about kiddie porn is deliberately overblown, precisely to give government agents justification to examine electronic data - in support of the RIAA, MPAA, etc.. Taking these hard-drives through customs is simply a lottery. The odds are in you favor that they won't look at the content, but why would you want to take the chance?

For anyone travelling with any information they do not care to have customs agents browsing through - financial information, company trade secrets, whatever - there are two solutions:

- The best solution is to put the information "in the cloud", on a private and secure server or service that you can access once you arrive at your destination.

- If you absolutely must carry sensitive information with you on hard-drives, USB sticks, or whatever, then encrypt the entire contents (not just the individual files), using a password that you do not know. In other words, use a long, random password that you store in a password-safe, and do not have the password-safe with you (put it in the cloud). A good program for disk-encryption: Truecrypt. A good password-safe: KeePass.