.... and have not problem with it being advertised as it was on another site....
So let's say you're shopping at a specialty electronics store and a salesman from another store runs into that store to solicit business. Do you have a problem in that case?
Coolwulf has not directly answered (despite being asked repeatedly) whether the service he is providing is consistent with the Priceline Terms of Service. Just taking a quick glance through the terms, I see a couple that I would have genuine concerns around whether or not he is violating the terms:
"Accordingly, as a condition of using this Site, you agree not to use this Site or its contents or information for any commercial or non-personal purpose (direct or indirect) or for any purpose that is unlawful or prohibited by this Agreement."
"You may only use this Site to make legitimate reservations, purchases or requests to purchase the products or services offered (each, a "Request") and shall not use this Site to make any speculative, false or fraudulent Requests or any Requests in anticipation of demand."
Nobody has the first clue how this guy is getting at the minimum bid prices (and they do appear to legitimately be the lowest acceptable bid price). I like to get the best deal as much as the next guy, but there is absolutely no transpanency into this guy's methodology. Let's say he's running this operation out of Nigeria with a databank of stolen credit cards (I'm not saying he is), anybody still want to do business with the guy? My gut tells me this guy is doing something illegal or, at the very minimum highly unethical.
Let's say he's running this operation out of Nigeria with a databank of stolen credit cards.
I can guarantee you that we're definitely NOT using any databank of stolen credit cards. Our database and model of calculation are highly confidential at this moment. And we won't reveal this information unless we decide to end this service.
(p.s We're currently bringing more users to priceline. Those who were afraid of using priceline now are able to bid through them. Priceline still keeps their profit with service charge and money between minimum bid and hotel cut. This way, we're hoping to create a win-win senario. )
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Quote:
Originally Posted by coolwulf
(p.s We're currently bring more users to priceline. Those who were afraid of using priceline now are able to bid through them. Priceline still keeps their profit with service charge and money between minimum bid and hotel cut. This way, we're hoping to create a win-win senario. )
I'm surprised someone from Priceline has not dropped by FlyerTalk to congratulate you for helping them out.
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But can you make a similar guarantee that you're not violating Priceline's terms of service? I'm guessing you can't. Otherwise why not just say so?
According to priceline,
"Accordingly, as a condition of using this Site, you agree not to use this Site or its contents or information for any commercial or non-personal purpose (direct or indirect) or for any purpose that is unlawful or prohibited by this Agreement."
Betterbidding.com or BFT all violate their terms of service. People are posting Priceline's contents or information for non-personal purpose and these two sites are using these information for commercial usage (solicit people to go through their affiliated link businese by providing these information.)
As an update, we're going to provide a new kind of service in the near future, it will 100% follow priceline's term of service and I can guarantee you that with this service provided, people will NOT go through betterbidding or BFT's affiliated links in the future. (Detailed info are confidential and I can't talk more about it at this moment.)
"Accordingly, as a condition of using this Site, you agree not to use this Site or its contents or information for any commercial or non-personal purpose (direct or indirect) or for any purpose that is unlawful or prohibited by this Agreement."
Betterbidding.com or BFT all violate their terms of service. People are posting Priceline's contents or information for non-personal purpose and these two sites are using these information for commercial usage (solicit people to go through their affiliated link businese by providing these information.)
I disagree. I think both BFT and BB operate independently of PL's site, and their data comes from the voluntary contributions of users of the BFT/BB site. Those two sites simply instruct users on how to more effectively use PL's site, to their advantage, and always WITHIN THE TOS OF PRICELINE. In fact, both sites have received occasional criticism from others for having deleted posts from users that advocate going against PL's TOS, by using such methods as alternative credit cards and/or email addresses. Both BFT and BB are completely transparent in their operation, and exist with the tacit blessing of Priceline, since they are both supported by their users clicking on affiliate links of one kind or another.
Quote:
Originally Posted by K2Quick
But can you make a similar guarantee that you're not violating Priceline's terms of service? I'm guessing you can't. Otherwise why not just say so?
Instead, coolwulf accuses other sites of violating PL's TOS. As if that would justify his doing so (and I'm not saying he is, because I really don't know).
Last edited by TeaEarleGreyHot; Oct 9, 09 at 10:48 am.
Instead, coolwulf accuses other sites of violating PL's TOS. As if that would justify his doing so (and I'm not saying he is, because I really don't know).
Whether you agree or not won't change the fact and the terms of service from priceline. Because we have formed this database from information we gathered just similar to what BFT did but with better and more efficient ways, make it no violation involved if followed your deduction.
And as I mentioned already, we're going to provide an upgraded new service which makes BFT totally obsolete in the near future.
Since I have already talked too much information about our service in this discussion, I 'm not going to post in this thread any more.
I can guarantee you that we're definitely NOT using any databank of stolen credit cards. Our database and model of calculation are highly confidential at this moment. And we won't reveal this information unless we decide to end this service.
Without using free rebids or false credit card information, all that's left is using the information hidden in Priceline's website source code.
Since I have already talked too much information about our service in this discussion, I 'm not going to post in this thread any more. Originally posted by Coolwulf.
Coolwulf: If I were in your position I would treat FT very carefully and respectfully for breathing life into the two "Coolwulf" threads which are currently running, each of which is so important to the growth of your business. Don't you feel a bit fortunate that FT has allowed you access to this community - in contrast to your being expelled from both Biddingfortravel.com and FW?
There is no requirement that you must reply to all posts. When you get a question, the honest answer to which might disclose proprietary information, simply don't answer it. Flyer Talkers have offered several suggestions in this and the original thread which you found to be valuable and which you adopted. Why cut yourself off of this sort of information?
You have mentioned several times that your friends have made good suggestions to you. If I were you I would I would run by them the subject of the wisdom of your deciding to refuse to post any replies to this thread. What would they say?
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thenewbie
Without using free rebids or false credit card information, all that's left is using the information hidden in Priceline's website source code.
Without trying to be confrontational, why must that be the case? Just because you or I or whomever can't think of another "model" doesn't mean it doesn't exist.
One observation and, if this has been covered, I don't remember seeing it. Has anyone actually proven that coolwulf's price is the lowest that would be accepted? Just because the price he gives out is accepted doesn't prove without question that a lower price wouldn't be accepted. Anyone test this yet?
Without using free rebids or false credit card information, all that's left is using the information hidden in Priceline's website source code.
As was stated above, you are making huge assumptions. I am sure there are various methods, even some that coolwulf has not thought about.
Quote:
Originally Posted by rmiller774
Coolwulf: If I were in your position I would treat FT very carefully and respectfully for breathing life into the two "Coolwulf" threads which are currently running, each of which is so important to the growth of your business. Don't you feel a bit fortunate that FT has allowed you access to this community - in contrast to your being expelled from both Biddingfortravel.com and FW?
Honestly, I think you are lending too much weight to FT. He had a big following way before he started posting on FT and offering this service. The FW thread was many pages long when I looked and that was a while before it got pulled.
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I don't remember seeing it. Has anyone actually proven that coolwulf's price is the lowest that would be accepted? Just because the price he gives out is accepted doesn't prove without question that a lower price wouldn't be accepted. Anyone test this yet?
Look back into the original thread - this and other questions arose. The most notable was the claim that using a sponsored link will lead to a higher price. When this was shown not to be the case, then the claims changed.
On a more general note. If there was an opportunity to charge a fee and give a guaranteed excellent bid, Priceline would offer it because they could charge a fee. Why would they want to let someone else derive the income from their business? The answer is that doing such things compromises their enterprise and their earnings. Therefore, if someone else is doing it they are causing two problems for Priceline: pre-empting their own right to charge for such a service (which they would see as exclusively their own) and disrupting the method of opaque bidding. While they tolerate BFT and BB because they create business, you can see that Priceline is now advertising "recent wins" but giving prices that are higher than reported on those sites.
It fascinates me that whenever the topic of Priceline comes up, there are several on FT who post in defense of them and their services. I became pretty convinced that some of you work for Priceline!! I have never done business with CW, but it does surprise me that all of the people who would probably jump at a mistake in fares (BOS/SFO RT all in $100 for example) and similar advantages berate CW for what he/she is doing and making assumptions about what it could be - pretty much all negative. If you take advantage of a mistake in airfare, hotel charges, etc. you are pretty assuredly taking advantage of the profits of the entity; but heaven forbid for some of you that Priceline should be taken advantage of. Believe me, I don't think you could for a minute.
Honestly, I think you are lending too much weight to FT. He had a big following way before he started posting on FT and offering this service. The FW thread was many pages long when I looked and that was a while before it got pulled.[/QUOTE]
Well, you may be right. FT does get a lot of hits though and the total thread views is about 17,000 for the two "Coolwulf" threads running on FT at this time. That impressed me. Maybe it shouldn't have. Did he offer 3 free requests while on FW? I didn't see his FW thread before it was pulled.
