I wonder if TSORon knows how to say "I made a mistake."
Having done so in the past I believe that it has been proven.
Now, where in the post I made did I make a mistake? Please, take a moment to point that out for us and of course support your belief with a link to supporting data.
Not illegal at all, and being a selectee is the only justification a TSO needs to do such a search. That search, at her discretion, can include the envelopes, if she is unsure about what is in them.
What part of:
"...after the presence of weapons and explosives had been ruled
out, the search can no longer be justified under the
administrative search doctrine..."
"...after the presence of weapons and explosives had been ruled
out, the search can no longer be justified under the
administrative search doctrine..."
Is difficult for you to understand?
Tommy Tommy Tommy, here is what I said:
Quote:
Sorry to bust your uhh … bubble … here eric, but please re-read the PDF file on this. The passenger was a selectee, and the TSO was required to do a full search. Not illegal at all, and being a selectee is the only justification a TSO needs to do such a search. That search, at her discretion, can include the envelopes, if she is unsure about what is in them.
Where in that is an error Tommy? That the TSO in the case made an error is undeniable, we just have different opinions on where that error was and why.
Now Tommy, kindly read what I posted and tell us all where there is an error in it? (geez)
Programs: UA-1k, HH Silver, Giving Tootsie Pops to UA employees, & now a retired hockey goalie
Posts: 10,128
Quote:
Originally Posted by TSORon
Sorry to bust your uhh … bubble … here eric, but please re-read the PDF file on this. The passenger was a selectee, and the TSO was required to do a full search. Not illegal at all, and being a selectee is the only justification a TSO needs to do such a search. That search, at her discretion, can include the envelopes, if she is unsure about what is in them.
But, have a nice day anyway.
and once the tso has determined the contents of the envelopes are not a threat to bring down an aircraft*, or to use your words, "she is unsure about them" but now is sure once she has viewed the contents and said contents not a threat, what next, ron?
*you have posted on several occasions that you look for things which a threat to bring down an aircraft and afaik, cash is not a threat
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just my humble opinion but i used to try and stop hockey pucks so what do i know . Nighthawks fans are everywhere
and once the tso has determined the contents of the envelopes are not a threat to bring down an aircraft*, or to use your words, "she is unsure about them" but now is sure once she has viewed the contents and said contents not a threat, what next, ron?
*you have posted on several occasions that you look for things which a threat to bring down an aircraft and afaik, cash is not a threat
Well G-Man, if it looks like it might be more than $10,000 I pass the issue along to a supervisor. If not, then I tell the man thanks for his time and send him on his way, after completing the remainder of the search of course.
If I cant tell how much cash it is, I still pass it along to a supervisor. After all, LEO calls are their job and not mine (I’m not allowed to call a LEO here at my airport, a local procedure).
Having done so in the past I believe that it has been proven.
Now, where in the post I made did I make a mistake? Please, take a moment to point that out for us and of course support your belief with a link to supporting data.
IOW, I didnt make a mistake, but I know who did.
By uttering that last sentence, you've proven that you do NOT, in fact, recognize who has made the error.
As has been pointed out to you, the screener in question stated under oath that she was NOT looking for weapons, incendiaries, or other threats to aviation safety. She stated straight out that she had cleared the envelopes for metal or explosives, and was looking for other "contraband" - NOT safety-related items, but items which are OUTSIDE TSA'S PROPER PURVIEW. The court agrees with that perspective, apparently, as has been pointed out.
That means that her screening was done improperly and violated the passenger's rights, and your defense of her is in error.
Programs: UA-1k, HH Silver, Giving Tootsie Pops to UA employees, & now a retired hockey goalie
Posts: 10,128
Quote:
Originally Posted by TSORon
Well G-Man, if it looks like it might be more than $10,000 I pass the issue along to a supervisor. If not, then I tell the man thanks for his time and send him on his way, after completing the remainder of the search of course.
If I cant tell how much cash it is, I still pass it along to a supervisor. After all, LEO calls are their job and not mine (I’m not allowed to call a LEO here at my airport, a local procedure).
sarcasm aside, i'm not a g-man tho i do know the bank secrecy act, the usa patriot act and anti-money laundering statues both, as the saying goes, "frontwards and backwards" as this has been my specialty for 30 years so with that...
the issue of exporting or importing greater than $10,0000 u.s. (or foreign currency equivalent) is not a tsa issue but a cpb issue as they are the ones who act on it-which is why fincen form 105 is presented to cpb and not the tsa (read the instruction on page 2 of the form under "who must file"). it is the responsibility of the pax to declare the currecny to cpb, answer their questions, not those from the tsa and face any applicable penalties from cpb for not declaring.
now you state "if it looks like it might be more than $10,000" and "If I cant tell how much cash it is", why don't simply count the currency? it's out of your jurisdiction but if it makes you fell better, why don't you count it if it makes you happy
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just my humble opinion but i used to try and stop hockey pucks so what do i know . Nighthawks fans are everywhere
the issue of exporting or importing greater than $10,0000 u.s. (or foreign currency equivalent) is not a tsa issue but a cpb issue as they are the ones who act on it-which is why fincen form 105 is presented to cpb and not the tsa (read the instruction on page 2 of the form under "who must file"). it is the responsibility of the pax to declare the currecny to cpb, answer their questions, not those from the tsa and face any applicable penalties from cpb for not declaring.
Hey, g-man () it is CBP, not CPB.
Your post sums everything else perfectly. What the TSA is doing with the cash is just general law enforcement.
Well G-Man, if it looks like it might be more than $10,000 I pass the issue along to a supervisor. If not, then I tell the man thanks for his time and send him on his way, after completing the remainder of the search of course.
If I cant tell how much cash it is, I still pass it along to a supervisor. After all, LEO calls are their job and not mine (I’m not allowed to call a LEO here at my airport, a local procedure).
What part of "it is not the role of TSA to employ TSO's to search for evidence of potential criminal conduct that is unrelated to aviation safety" do you not understand?
What part of "it is not the role of TSA to employ TSO's to search for evidence of potential criminal conduct that is unrelated to aviation safety" do you not understand?
Tell that to the anonymous busy body TSA defender over at EOS.
"Now your just being dense. No law being broken? What about public obscenity laws? Laws about indecency with children (or related laws - not a lawyer here)? Playing porn in a public place where children are near is illegal. You are foolish to suggest that this was not illegal, and that I was just being a "busy-body" by reporting it. Shame on you."
This was in response to some postings about the St Louis incident update. Somehow looking for child porn makes things different? Or, is $4700 an obscene amount of money to a TSO?
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"Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness." Mark Twain
Well G-Man, if it looks like it might be more than $10,000 I pass the issue along to a supervisor. If not, then I tell the man thanks for his time and send him on his way, after completing the remainder of the search of course.
If I cant tell how much cash it is, I still pass it along to a supervisor. After all, LEO calls are their job and not mine (I’m not allowed to call a LEO here at my airport, a local procedure).
. Nighthawks fans are everywhere
) it is CBP, not CPB.
