GUWonder

I don't buy the logic of the above sentence -- even if I were to buy into the first half of that sentence being a fact as it once was. However, as a matter of fact, there is DY's program Norwegian Reward with its CashPoints.

sdsearch

Ok, but that is an airline without a true business class (as most people define it). Most people would consider what they have a upfront at best as a glorified Premium Economy cabin. Also, it's already a deep-discount airline, so it doesn't have "astronomical fares" that people want to redeem instead of paying. It also doesn't seem to have earning partners. So basically, conceptually it's just as "fly N times, get a free flight" (in the same cabin) kind of scheme, and nothing beyond that.

And the cost of their so-called business class cabin is way way way less than the cost of business class seats on "mainstream" longhaul international airlines. And so they price their so-called business class seats until they sell them (unlike most "mainstream" airlines who want to protect business class seat cash prices, and so would rather give them away as upgrades or outright awards than lower the cash cost substantially).

So while it is technically a multi-cabin longhaul airline, it is so unlike a typical business-oriented legacy airline in terms of cabin configuration and cost that I still don't we know if something as simple as their CashPoints could work for a business-oriented legacy airline (like DL, UA, or AA).

At any rate, by "not knowing how it would work", I meant not knowing how it would work for an airline which traditionally priced business class awards at 2x to 3x times coach awards, but traditionally priced business class paid seats at 5x the cash cost of coach paid seats or more. Thus for those airlines, would a single redemption rate (proportional to cash cost) really work, or would they have to have a different redemption rate for different classes to make up-front redemptions possible to fill otherwise-empty seats up there without reducing the cash cost of sitting up there?

GUWonder

DY's business class long-haul seats are comparable to what UA was offering me on US-EZE/EZE-US flights a little more than a decade ago when the gap between economy class fares and business class fares for my trips was higher than it is now.

http://www.businessclass.se/wp-conte...Dreamliner.jpg

DY's economy class fares for my CPH/ARN-US/US-CPH/ARN roundtrip travels this year were more expensive for my dates of travel than what AA/BA/IB and UA and SK sold me this year for my trips.

vhrum

Agreed. The airline business, as all businesses and the economy at large, cycles up and down. One day they will be hurting again, and they will be hurting for business once more. But I won't soon forget what DL has done, and besides that I want to redeem miles for international F cabins, so unless and until they change THAT rule I'll certainly never be interested in them.

DrRodneyMcKay

In the case of Delta, I actually discovered that while the general miles you earn (to be redeemed towards flights) are revenue-based, the Medallion Qualification Miles are actually based on distance flown...so I suppose you could do some very cheap "status runs" where you fly really far for cheap, which boosts you to the next Medallion Tier, at which point you start earning more miles per dollar and have your medallion qualification miles rollover. At least, that is my understanding of Delta's current rules, someone correct me if I'm wrong (I travel some amount for work/school, and unfortunately every year I'm always just a few thousand miles away from qualifying for Medallion status, which is incredibly upsetting to me).

sdsearch

Since you're based in the US, your Delta status is based not just on MQM (Medallion Qualification Miles) but also on MQD (Medallion Qualification Dollars). You can't get cheap status on Delta, because if you don't spend enough MQD, it doesn't matter how many MQM you have.

So cheap "status runs" would only help on Delta if you had already had some expensive fares that didn't earn much miles, so you were already taken care of in the MQD component, but now have to catch up on MQM.

In addition to MQM (or MQS -- segments), you need $3000 MQD for Silver, $6000 MQD for Gold, and $9000 MQD for Platinum. See here for the chart:
(You can get a waiver of the MQD component, but only if you spend $25k+ on the Delta card from Amex.)

DrRodneyMcKay

I've actually never had trouble meeting the MQD qualification - I mean, $3000 isn't that much to spend on an airline in a year if you fly Delta exclusively, like I do. It's the MQMs qualification that I can never meet. It also seems to me that you're going to need to spend at least $3000 to fly 25,000 unless you find $100 tickets to Asia or something.

MrTemporal

The CC miles may be pseudo miles, but I look at them as points and they are as real as the ones earned when actually flying. The airlines sell those miles/points and make money off them, just like they do when they sell an actual ticket for an actual flight.

sdsearch

It depends where you're based and what sort of routes you fly. If you're based in Los Angeles or Boston, and you fly back and forth between the two, that's over 2500 miles flight distance one way, so five round trips gets you to 25000 miles, but five round trips is not likely to necessarily cost you $3000+ (if you can purchase in advance) because that would be $600+ per round-trip flight, and LAX-BOS is competitive enough that it doesn't necessarily always cost that much.

But yes, if you instead fly a lot of more expensive shorter routes, you'll have the opposite problem.

DrRodneyMcKay

Yeah, unfortunately I do most of my flying between PHL and DTW (with the latter also being the one I take other trips out of); DTW is obviously a Delta hub and PHL is a United hub (I believe) so tickets between the two are always inconveniently expensive despite the short distance...hence I have the opposite problem. I have yet to find a solution to it - the best I can do so far is booking my flights as far ahead of time as I can so that they're just a little cheaper, but unless I"m able to relocate (which doesn't look likely for the next few years) I'm kind of stuck meeting the MQD and not the MQM. Or unless I can find a really cheap cross-country flight between now and the end of the year.

sdsearch

PHL was a US Airways hub, but because of the merger it's now an American hub. The nearest United hub is EWR (Newark) on one side and IAD (DC's Dulles airport) on the other side.

DrRodneyMcKay

well, with United and Delta ending their interline agreement whether PHL is a United hub or not is rather a moot point. I only fly Delta so any hub that isn't delta is...not convenient. I suppose I could diversify and fly more airlines, but I've had such horrible experiences with everything that isn't Delta that I just can't force myself to.

sdsearch

Did Delta and United also end their interline agreement? I haven't heard of that. All I can find if I search the Delta forum on "interline" is the obvious thread about Delta and American: