Igetit

There seems to a myth spreading here that airlines have to live with, perhaps accept, fuel dumps simply because expanding its geographical coverage through interlined carriers and end-on-end fare combinations is necessary. Fuel Dumps is not a fait accompli.

While it is true that airlines use interlining to gain more coverage and thus passengers, they do not have to lose control of their YQs.

Let’s see how that works for AA and BA inside the Cayman Islands.

AA flies from MIA to GCM.
You think they might want to offer some island hopping on the same ticket so they should interline with Cayman Airlines (KX) and allow end-on-end fare combinations. But in reality, AA does not care to sell you their cheap fares combined with Cayman’s. Combining KX fares with AA’s will automatically price AA at Y Fare Basis Code.

AA (already the largest carrier) does not think it is profitable to do, as you say, “business from hundreds/thousands of passengers not being able to make the "connections”. So there goes the myth that AA needs this airline to make connections.

Let’s extend this argument to American’s JV partner British Airways.

BA flies to Cayman Islands (technically a direct flight from London).
Ticket costs about $882 with $249.80 of YQ.
The LON-GCM fare allows for end-on-end connections. Alright so maybe BA cares to offer inside Cayman Island fares along with its own. OK so let’s price one.

Well the price is the same ($917) regardless where you put the Cayman Island flight (before returning or after returning to London); and they are both more expensive than a simple LON-GCM R/T fare. This means that BA kept full control of charging the same YQ ($249.90) even after adding Cayman Air’s flights. Just because BA allowed a fare combination for the benefit of its passengers does not mean there will be a fuel dump. It all depends on how well BA filed its YQ fees. If they are good at it, there will be no dumps.

Finally airlines do not lose business allowing for illogical itineraries. Most, if not all, 3x strikes are not even in the same country as the previous segment. What connections are you talking about if a huge surface segment exists between the previous flight segments destination and the 3x’s origin?
You think airlines care to make connections for flights that are not even in the same continent? Can you even call these "connections"?

And, do people normally add a flight after they have returned home? That’s what 3x usually does.

Airlines do not have to accept 3x FDs as a necessary evil. These loopholes exist because their employees have poor skills in defining YQ records. No need to help them make their jobs easier. Keep FD underground.

flylonghaul

Myself and others here are not against people learning. This is not the problem. If someone is smart enough and dedicated enough to learn this skill, then good for them. I cannot stop that.
What I and others do not like is when an over active and clueless newbie comes along and acquires the skills from handouts or purchase and they do not have any sense for what the information is capable of, and run around blurting it out without any regard for the true risk that comes from it.

As I also previously stated, it should not come as a shock that certain members of this thread do not want to see the game ruined by someone with loud mouth syndrome that is just chasing some sort of non existent Trick it fame. Especially if, like me, you have spent 100s an 100s of hours learning what makes airfares work the way that they do.

The reason I keep posting here is because some people need to be told that the behavior that they are exhibiting is not appropriate and should be stopped. Because it doesn't take long before loose lips will sink the ship.

As you put it yourself, the info is there for anyone willing to read... Well there you go, there's your answer for why so many people are told to read the thread.

And yes, this thread has become too well known for anything to be openly discussed here without things leaking.
It may shock you to know that there are many many many other places that people can discuss this topic, all of which are infinitely more water tight than this thread is.
This thread has an average of roughly 6000 views per day. When something is posted openly it is going to get noticed. Its really not difficult to understand the reason why so many are against the open sharing.

Bhavshah

👍👍👍

Igetit

Even the most innocent excitement to share a cheap fare can lead to airline quickly fixing a YQ loophole.

Consider this post last 29th of Feb - [FARE GONE] NYC-MAD TAP $282 AI End of October

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/milea...d-october.html

The infamous blog SF also published it causing people all over the place to talk about it. Funny there were even calls made to the OTAs or the airline for advanced seat reservations.

That obviously tipped the airline and they fixed it (the self dump) the same day. If you have the ability to display the YQ records you can see they made the fix with a new YQ filing.

From the posts, some folks got cancellations. Since you can no longer rely on DOT (Prohibition of Post Purchase Price Increase) Protection then you are out of luck.

As you can see even an innocent cheap fare tip can lead to blogs posting it. This was not a mistake fare – the base fares were correct. This was a case of a mistake YQ filing. It was a “self dump”. The airline intended to collect $516 YQ but incorrectly filed it.

But talking about it leads to blogs posting it and the airline getting notified they made a mistake.

Be careful. Be very careful. If you still want to enjoy self dumps or fuel dumping you cannot talk about it since you are essentially tipping the airline. I hope the example makes this extremely clear. Take it underground.

man4business

Thanks for inspiration. $228.36 (or $222.36 if arriving elsewhere but departing on the way back from KRK) OTA price $219

made_by_hugo

How is this even a special price? U can fly europe to north America in the low 300s without any tricks (and with a bit of fairy dust get easily below 200).

man4business

Do I talk about C2-C1...??

flylonghaul

It's just the usual marketing technique.
Personally I prefer the easy options that you are talking about!

Both

WingedWorldExplorer

Glad someone helped you. Now it is a about being protective of what you got.

FrankTalk

While it would be foolish of them (at least the big players) not to watch FT and the blogs I pretty much doubt they keep refreshing this thread.

Point is, whatever gets an exposure treatment on FT/blogs is surely going to the way of the dodo, no questions about that. The deals that never hit wider audiences are more interesting. Based on my experience those actually boil down to 2 catergories: easy to understand and hard to understand. There were glorious, glorious holes that had fares rotting there for 2 yrs or more and were fixed immediately after they were used in an improper unexpected way. Why? It was immediately obvious what was exploited used and how it worked. There are similarly glorious deals to be had with even the same airline's other fares but it's weird and difficult to understand how and why it works.

I think the same goes for the dumps. Most things discussed here in the trick it thread is convoluted, and thus dissemination of information is severely limited. The results don't worth the effort, since half the stuff posted here are for epeen only, and/or they can't crack what people are actually saying. Result is the same.

WingedWorldExplorer

rmf5

ME Hub or Sub?

rmf5

M/E Hub or sub?

WingedWorldExplorer

C2 - Open Jaw two South American capitals $ 213,55. For a little more $$ you can visit the capital of a ancient empire. A straight round trip can be done at $ 172,72 All-in. Hight of springtime

EklaEpic

Hi,

Is it possible to dump TK CDG-JFK in feburary 17 BF 15$ ?