Programs: DL Silver, AA Plat, UA 1P, LH Silver, SPG Gold
Posts: 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by Axey
Every EU country scans your passport into the Schengen Information System upon entry. You can read about it here.
Here are a couple of anecdotes that happened to me.
1. I was going to Lisbon and I flew into Madrid. Instead of waiting in the long line for US Passports, I used my Greek ID and went through the fast EU line. I then transited to Portugal without a border crossing since I was now in the Schengen area. Leaving Portugal to go to London, I had to exit the Schengen area (UK is not part of Schengen), so I showed them my US Passport. The girl waited for the computer to find me but after a few minutes without a response and without finding an entry stamp, she asked me where I entered Europe and did they stamp my passport. I said Madrid and they they hadn't stamped my passport. She then said..."OK...I will stamp it for you and proceeded to stamp my passport."
2. I recently entered into the UK at LHR using my Greek Passport. On my way back at LHR Passport control, a woman customs officer searched through my US Passport for a UK entry stamp but could not find a recent one. She then looked at my name and asked me if I had a Greek passport. I said yes and she asked if I used that to enter the UK. I told her yes and showed her the passport (which isn't stamped) and after verifying my identity she let me through. I had to compliment her for her astuteness.
When you really cut to the chase, the whole idea behind the concept of the passport is negated by allowing people to hold multiple passports. And it is so common to have more than one...
I talked to the US immigration officer when I was stopped getting back into the states recently and he told me that, as you mentioned, Canadian customs is under pressure to get a lot stricter. He said the pressure has increased over the last 6 months because that lawyer with Tuberculosis came back into the US through Canada.
IIRC, the lawyer with TB just transited Montreal on his way back to the States from Italy. Canada was blameless with respect to that lawyer, the failures all American from start to finish.
Typical US behavior. Perhaps someone should remind them that Canada didn't let these folks into the US, but indeed the US let them into the US. After all, it's US immigration agents who still man our borders, right?...
If security is lax in Canada, then the United States is less safe, though you are correct that the US has its own border agents. The US expects, quite reasonably, that Canada will do its best to keep possible terrorists from entering Canada and that its neighbor will also do its best to apprehend and/or foil any that may be in Canada. Canada recognizes, rightly so, that it has responsibilities and can't excuse themselves from those responsibilities by saying it is up to the US to keep these people from entering into the US across its border with Canada.
On the bright side, you probably don't need to worry about that - customs between Canada and the US have reciprocal agreements where if you are coming from the USA into Canada and are refused, the USA is required to take you back (and vice-versa); that being said, one can still be arrested by the US authorities upon return.
I hope you won't have any problems with customs in YYZ... knock on wood!
It seems that dvs holds neither US, nor Canadian citizenship. He said that he was not concerned that Canada might not let him in, but rather that they might let him in only to have the US not allow him to return to the US for the balance of the vacation he had planned in the US. If that were to happen, that is he were admitted to Canada from the US, not refused admission to Canada, the US would not be obliged to allow him back into the US when he sought to return.
That NEXUS membership suggestion seems to be a good deal. Never realized it costs merely $50 to be considered. Since I also drive often between PDX and YVR and have been often caught in long lines and wait times, this makes even more sense.
To add my very own experience in flying to Canada, I have never received any more intense and uncomfortable questioning other than from the agents in YYZ. It is sadly quite discouraging to come back.
Location: Tucson, AZ, USA. CO Plat, reluctant DL Plat, former BA jumpseat rider
Posts: 1,414
I experienced a grueling secondary at YVR last time I was there. For years before that, I'd never been asked more than perfunctory questions by Immigration Canada. This last time, though, the tenor was about the worst I've experienced anywhere. Worse than the old INS experiences.
Their concern didn't seem to be my identity. Rather it was my purpose. I believe if I hadn't produced my formal speaker's invitation to a major U, I would have been sent back. It was certainly unpleasant and while I agree that searching questions are the right of immigration officials and that we need to answer them fully and honestly, there are ways to handle these situations more professionally than Immigration Canada did that time.
Programs: AF Gold, BA EC Blue, LH FTL, HH Gold, A|Club Silver
Posts: 4,370
Quote:
Originally Posted by redtailshark
Their concern didn't seem to be my identity. Rather it was my purpose. I believe if I hadn't produced my formal speaker's invitation to a major U, I would have been sent back. It was certainly unpleasant and while I agree that searching questions are the right of immigration officials and that we need to answer them fully and honestly, there are ways to handle these situations more professionally than Immigration Canada did that time.
This is the most disturbing part. I'm single and travel alone almost exclusively. If I pay for a round trip ticket, hotel and other travel related expenses, and then get turned around at the border because the Immigration officer doesn't believe my reason, what recourse does one have? I know that is a rhetorical question. But for one person to deny another who has no reason not to be admitted entry based on a whim is wrong (IMO).
If the intent of the Immigration officers is to keep a mass of people from arriving at the port and then requesting asylum, I can almost understand that. But to travelers with proof of accomodation and return flight, what are they worried about? That we'll come to Canada and spend money? And thats a problem how?
I'm a believer that if you are eligible to immigrate, have no outstanding warrants and can obviously support yourself for the duration of your stay, an immigration officer should have to give good cause in front of a supervisor and/or immigration lawyer why you can't come in.
I drove from Phoenix to Banff in 2005, and got some close questioning at the border about whether I was going there to work or not. The guard expressed a lot of doubt that someone would drive that far just for a vacation, which doesn't make sense -- who's going to pay me to drive all day?
I was actually driving up the Rockies and hitting National Parks on the way: Bryce Canyon, Dinosaur NM, Grand Tetons, Yellowstone, Glacier, Banff.
This is the most disturbing part. I'm single and travel alone almost exclusively. If I pay for a round trip ticket, hotel and other travel related expenses, and then get turned around at the border because the Immigration officer doesn't believe my reason, what recourse does one have? I know that is a rhetorical question. But for one person to deny another who has no reason not to be admitted entry based on a whim is wrong (IMO).
If the intent of the Immigration officers is to keep a mass of people from arriving at the port and then requesting asylum, I can almost understand that. But to travelers with proof of accomodation and return flight, what are they worried about? That we'll come to Canada and spend money? And thats a problem how?
I'm a believer that if you are eligible to immigrate, have no outstanding warrants and can obviously support yourself for the duration of your stay, an immigration officer should have to give good cause in front of a supervisor and/or immigration lawyer why you can't come in.
Hey, I arrived in YEG with a Marriott hotel reservation, a Horizon reservation out of YEG for the next day and plenty of credit cards. If they ran me through their computers, or even googled me, they would have found a mid-50s practicing MD from MA who was president of his hospital medical staff, membership in multiple professional societies etc. No matter what database they use, they would not have found any negative info other than a 10 year old speeding ticket. But they were not about to let me in... what turned the tide was when they called my wife who told them that I did short turn-around MRs all the time.
...I'm a believer that if you are eligible to immigrate, have no outstanding warrants and can obviously support yourself for the duration of your stay, an immigration officer should have to give good cause in front of a supervisor and/or immigration lawyer why you can't come in.
"Eligible to immigrate"?! That is the most likely reason why they would deny you entry, and if you even hinted that immigration was your intention, then you could be pretty certain they would do so.
I know absolutely none of the details, but I am quite certain that those who want to immigrate to Canada, the US, or most other countries, must arrange it before stepping off an international flight and you want to relocate there permanently. That you have arrived on a roundtrip ticket rather than a OW (airline probably would not sell a OW ticket to a "visitor") and have arranged a hotel for yourself is little assurance that you will not stay on "unofficially." I am not saying that the immigration officers cannot be unpleasant and rather stupid in their questioning, I am just pointing out who has the burden of proof, and it is not that anyone "eligible to immigrate," whatever that means (approved for immigration before getting there?), ought to be allowed in. (Those claiming refugee status are a different matter.)
I drove from Phoenix to Banff in 2005, and got some close questioning at the border about whether I was going there to work or not. The guard expressed a lot of doubt that someone would drive that far just for a vacation, which doesn't make sense -- who's going to pay me to drive all day?
I was actually driving up the Rockies and hitting National Parks on the way: Bryce Canyon, Dinosaur NM, Grand Tetons, Yellowstone, Glacier, Banff.
Maybe you should have tried a bit of schmoozing with him, telling him how beautiful you had heard Banff was (did you continue on to Jasper?), asking him if he had ever visited the Canadian Rockies, etc. I take it that in the end, you convinced him to let you proceed. (Banff is nice, isn't it?)
Hey, I arrived in YEG with a Marriott hotel reservation, a Horizon reservation out of YEG for the next day and plenty of credit cards. If they ran me through their computers, or even googled me, they would have found a mid-50s practicing MD from MA who was president of his hospital medical staff, membership in multiple professional societies etc. No matter what database they use, they would not have found any negative info other than a 10 year old speeding ticket. But they were not about to let me in... what turned the tide was when they called my wife who told them that I did short turn-around MRs all the time.
If they were well-informed about such things, they might have appreciated that a US-based physician wanting to re-establish him/herself in Canada was far less likely than a Canada-based physician seeking to re-establish him/herself in the US. If they were very well-informed, though, they might have taken into account that the odds against a MA-based physician wanting to relocate to Canada might be substantially less than those for physicians from any number of the other 49 states to their south (and Alaska to their west/north) fleeing regulation here and seeking asylum there.
(PS: If they had really probed deeply, would they have found that you had undictated charts at the time?)
Programs: AF Gold, BA EC Blue, LH FTL, HH Gold, A|Club Silver
Posts: 4,370
Quote:
Originally Posted by itsme
"Eligible to immigrate"?! That is the most likely reason why they would deny you entry, and if you even hinted that immigration was your intention, then you could be pretty certain they would do so.
Fair enough. By immigrate I meant enter the country legally through an approved immigration channel, but if my word choice is off, use entry instead.
In other words, eligible for entry (whatever criteria you must meet as a citizen from country X wanting to visit country Y). My argument is that if you meet those criteria for entry, it should not be that a single immigration officer having a bad day can deny you entry without reasonable cause.
However, if you overstay your VISA or are found to be abusing the privledge of entry by committing crimes or attempting to illegaly set up residence, that country should have the right to deport you and bar you permanently.
