Go Back   FlyerTalk Forums > Miles&Points > Hotels and Loyalty Programs > Marriott and Ritz-Carlton | Rewards
Sign in using an external account

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old May 3, 10, 10:20 pm   #1
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Mid-Atlantic
Programs: AA Plat, UA Minus1K, still DL Plat for sake of kids, Marriott Plat, PC Plat, SPG Gold, Hyatt Plat
Posts: 4,072
Theory: Marriott is being Fooled by Delta Skymiles Folks

I've been thinking about the sudden demise of the AAdvantage partnership and the increased presence now of (the much less valuable imo) Delta Skymiles promotions.

I'm speculating that Delta is selling their miles to Marriott much more cheaply (on a per mile basis) than AA. Marriott (I speculate) still doesn't understand that Delta has been undercutting the competition (I could with a little thought come up with countless specific examples) in terms of cents per mile because they have devalued their miles so much in the last two years or so that they effectively now have at least a 2:1 effective cost advantage (i.e., they give up half or less in exchange for redemption of their miles than AA does).

So what does this mean for Marriott? In the short term they may or may not see some net benefit from this decision to go with a closer relationship with the theoretically cheaper Delta and to drop completely their relationship with the theoretically more expensive American Airlines partner. But sooner or later they'll see this is not a smart long-term move. At least that's the way this former 100k a year Delta flyer views the situation.

What do you think?
__________________
The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing
GrizShel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 3, 10, 10:40 pm   #2
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: PBI/SVO/DME
Programs: SU/DL/US/MR
Posts: 712
If AA miles mean that much to you when staying at Marriott then just switch yourself over to another OneWrld carrier or pile up the MR pts and flip'em into miles with a OneWrld carrier.

If that doesn't work, enjoy staying at another brand.
jredknapp11 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 3, 10, 10:43 pm   #3
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Mid-Atlantic
Programs: AA Plat, UA Minus1K, still DL Plat for sake of kids, Marriott Plat, PC Plat, SPG Gold, Hyatt Plat
Posts: 4,072
Your post is irrelevant to the topic of this thread. Do you agree or disagree with the theory? Why or why not?
__________________
The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing
GrizShel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 3, 10, 11:09 pm   #4
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 552
Quote:
Originally Posted by GrizShel View Post
Your post is irrelevant to the topic of this thread. Do you agree or disagree with the theory? Why or why not?
That's pleasant.

But, to keep to the strict requirements of response to the question:

I do not agree.

Why?

Delta should sell their miles to Marriott much more cheaply than AA - they're worth a lot less. Delta is not "undercutting the competition". If someone offers to give you $100 for something and I offer to give you 100 pesos, I'm not undercutting the competition, I'm simply offering you less in return for whatever you have. If Marriott doesn't realize that they're getting pesos, they will soon.

I don't think Marriott's relationships with AA and Delta are in any way related. I would expect that AA decided they were getting too many transfers from Marriott, and they decided either that they wanted to limit the transfers or get paid better for them. Marriott probably has some amount that they're willing to "pay" for points at redemption, and AA probably wanted more.

Last edited by tvetter01; May 3, 10 at 11:15 pm. Reason: clarity, grammar; really, it was just poor writing
tvetter01 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 3, 10, 11:26 pm   #5
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: PBI/SVO/DME
Programs: SU/DL/US/MR
Posts: 712
Quote:
Originally Posted by GrizShel View Post
Your post is irrelevant to the topic of this thread. Do you agree or disagree with the theory? Why or why not?
Another one for the ignore list.
jredknapp11 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 4, 10, 9:34 am   #6
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Programs: DL - Plat, Marriott - Plat, Hilton - Diamond, SPG- Plat, National- ES
Posts: 1,858
Could we keep the "whining and trashing" of Skymiles on that board???? I have already given up on it due to the overall lack of useful info and I would really hate to see the issues there spread! Perhaps the mods could just move this thread there. I am sure the OP will then find 100's of posters willing to support the theory being discussed.
CarolDisney1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 4, 10, 10:17 am   #7
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Programs: WN AL/CP, DL GM, MR Plat, Hyatt Diamond, PC Gold
Posts: 1,447
Quote:
Originally Posted by tvetter01 View Post
That's pleasant.
As pleasant as the response that prompted it. (Basically, OP was told in not so many words to shut up about Marriott/AA and his question was not addressed.)

Quote:
Originally Posted by jredknapp11 View Post
Another one for the ignore list.
You ignored him for being correct? (OP was correct regarding your previous comment's pertinence to his question.)

Anyhow, enough meta-discussion. My question is simply, why didn't Marriott bump AA to the tier of carriers whose miles are more expensive? Granted, they're mostly foreign carriers, but it's better than losing them completely as a partner.

To the OP's question, no, I'm sure Marriott was not fooled by Delta. > 90% of the people out there have no clue that an AA/UA/CO mile is worth more than a DL mile. Marriott was not fooled; they know this, and IMO, that is why they are doing this promotion with the cheapest miles available

And I hate to admit it, but it's honestly a great promo. 60,000 SkyMiles can easily get you to Hawaii or Alaska (to Alaska maybe even twice via AS), each of which are $1000 tickets. You also can redeem them fairly easily for two domestic tickets that would otherwise be expensive.
__________________
Hooray!

Last edited by judolphin; May 4, 10 at 10:28 am.
judolphin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 4, 10, 11:17 am   #8
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Chicago
Programs: AA ExP, Hyatt Diamond, MR Platinum, PC Platinum, SPG Platinum, HH Gold
Posts: 495
I think it is Marriott fooling itself thinking we buy the notion that DL miles are just as good as AA miles.

Personally, I'd rather earn 5000 AA bonus miles on my next 5 Hyatt stays, which is on top of the FFN promo and the 500 regular miles. Why is Marriott being so uncompetitive? Even Sheraton added a AA sweetner of 1000 miles per stay on top of the FFN promo that they have and the points you normally earn. I have been Platinum four years in a row with MR, but I have only stayed 4 nights this year, and three of them were comped.
zacktravel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 4, 10, 11:28 am   #9
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Mid-Atlantic
Programs: AA Plat, UA Minus1K, still DL Plat for sake of kids, Marriott Plat, PC Plat, SPG Gold, Hyatt Plat
Posts: 4,072
Glad to see we're starting to get some discussion on the topic I presented. That's what I had hoped for. I actually like to hear from others with different viewpoints, especially if they provide reasoned arguments supporting their position.
__________________
The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing
GrizShel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 4, 10, 12:52 pm   #10
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Herndon VA
Programs: AA EXP 2M, MR & SPG Gold, Hyatt Plat Avis Pref
Posts: 32,756
Disagree

I think that Marriott knows that DL is probably a product that is not as valuable as AA however the ability to offer 60K miles looks good from a 30000 foot vantage point. 60K of anything looks great to the kettles and probably even fools most business travelers. I'd surmise to say it fools everyone with the exception of FT'ers who are well aware of the crappy skymiles program.

Marriott is doing this strictly as a way to try and BS the vast majority of the travelers and trying to make them think this is a great promo when few know its a near useless promo
TrojanHorse is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 4, 10, 1:05 pm   #11
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Wyoming
Posts: 17,415
Quote:
Originally Posted by TrojanHorse View Post
when few know its a near useless promo
Well I think that is taking it a bit far. I'm sure there are plenty of people who will find the promo useful.
__________________
SUPPORT THE TROOPS
annerj is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 4, 10, 1:26 pm   #12
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Programs: WN AL/CP, DL GM, MR Plat, Hyatt Diamond, PC Gold
Posts: 1,447
Quote:
Originally Posted by TrojanHorse View Post
Disagree

I think that Marriott knows that DL is probably a product that is not as valuable as AA however the ability to offer 60K miles looks good from a 30000 foot vantage point. 60K of anything looks great to the kettles and probably even fools most business travelers. I'd surmise to say it fools everyone with the exception of FT'ers who are well aware of the crappy skymiles program.

Marriott is doing this strictly as a way to try and BS the vast majority of the travelers and trying to make them think this is a great promo when few know its a near useless promo
I will say that even SkyPesos (never used that term before) are worth more than Marriott points, because of the nature of hotel points.

That means that if you're going with Marriott, you're better off going with the SkyMiles promo this summer than with the MR point promos...

As much as the SM program sucks, it still is a fact that 60k SkyMiles (worth $500-$1500) >> 40k MR Points (worth $200-$600).
__________________
Hooray!
judolphin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 4, 10, 2:59 pm   #13
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 552
Quote:
Originally Posted by judolphin View Post
As much as the SM program sucks, it still is a fact that 60k SkyMiles (worth $500-$1500) >> 40k MR Points (worth $200-$600).
Right, but don't you have to switch to earning miles to qualify for the SM promotion? I may be wrong about that, as I didn't really pay any attention to the Delta promotion.

If so, there's a significant loss there vs. earning Marriott Points (the amount of which depends on your average nightly rate).


As an aside, $200 for 40,000 Marriott points is awfully low. As an absolute worst case scenario, you can get Marriott gift cards/cheques at better than that rate. Not that that changes your point.
Just from what people say, $1,500 sounds high to me for 60k Delta miles, but as I don't fly Delta or use Delta miles, I'm completely unqualified to place a value on those, so I could be wrong about that.

Last edited by tvetter01; May 4, 10 at 3:22 pm.
tvetter01 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 4, 10, 3:12 pm   #14
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Wyoming
Posts: 17,415
Quote:
Originally Posted by judolphin View Post
40k MR Points (worth $200-$600).
I back of the napkin value mine at .01 each.
__________________
SUPPORT THE TROOPS
annerj is offline   Reply With Quote
Old May 4, 10, 3:22 pm   #15
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Herndon VA
Programs: AA EXP 2M, MR & SPG Gold, Hyatt Plat Avis Pref
Posts: 32,756
Quote:
Originally Posted by annerj View Post
Well I think that is taking it a bit far. I'm sure there are plenty of people who will find the promo useful.
thats why I said Near useless

I'm just glad I'm not one of the gazillions who are active members (BIS mile earning) of sky pesos (never used that either) program

I collect the pesos too but only via Avis rentals.
TrojanHorse is offline   Reply With Quote
 
 
Reply

Bookmarks


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 11:41 pm.